Posted on 02/15/2022 5:49:53 AM PST by kinsman redeemer
The Diocese of Phoenix said 'all of the baptisms he has performed until June 17, 2021, are presumed invalid'
"The issue with using ‘We’ is that it is not the community that baptizes a person, rather, it is Christ, and Him alone, who presides at all of the sacraments, and so it is Christ Jesus who baptizes," Olmsted said.
(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...
work out doesnt mean work for, it means you as individual have to make the decision to call on jesus for your self, also it means nobody else can make your salvation- once your saved- important to you, you have to work it out on your own nobody else can do it for you! dont confuse with work for. its a gift.
You might like this article: What is a Nominal Christian?
at https://www.gotquestions.org/nominal-Christianity.html
This story may have made God facepalm.
Honestly you really are reading way to much and to little into that at the same time.
21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
The first part translate literally to say “symbolizes,” then it adds by good conscience, which is saying by your faith and lastly credits the resurrection for salvation.
That is how the verse breaks down. What you quote in verse states that baptism symbolizes our salvation in Christ by our faith though the resurrections of Christ.
It is interesting that you believe and teach others exactly the opposite of what the bible says.
You say that baptism is merely a ceremony, that has no real relevance to actual salvation is not necessary.
But the bible says the exact opposite. No where does the bible say that baptism is a mere ceremony. Several places it says it is essential to salvation.
So why do you believe and teach exactly the opposite of what the bible says? Who taught you exactly the opposite of what it says and how did you come to believe and teach it?
Because Peter insisted that they be baptized believingit wasnecessary and should net be withheld from them
This implies Baptism is important that it could be withheld.
It implies also that its importance is integral to what they have been given already.
There are many kinds of gifts of grace. But Peter recognized the uiuse should be baptized. Later in acts, in council with other disciples he recounted this story as reasoning how baptism shouldn’t be withheld from gentiles which was a practice then.
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
Nowhere in the seminal verse does it state Christ + baptism.
There are many other verses that state faith in Christ alone is suffiencnt. Your accusation that I teach others the opposite of what the scripture states is false and disingenuous.
You can mention other scriptures may appear to contradict me(in your opinion) but you have no grounds to state I am not following scripture.
That’s the bottom line, isn’t it?
Yet still they received the gifts of the Holy Spirit BEFORE baptism.
It is a big jump to make anyone’s salvation dependent on baptism as the final requirement. It usurps God absolute authority in so many circumstances as to challenges the very concept of a rational, unchanging eternal G-d. Such a belief demands some go to damnation solely based on a personal physicals act, regardless of Christ’s sacrifice.
It makes salvation something man can do, nay must physically do, to achieve instead of the free gift the bible states it to be.
You seem to think Baptism is not God’s authority, this is not scriptural. That is erroneous in reasoning to boot. Its not exclusive, God’s authority and keeping God’s commandments as part of that authority.
There are many gifts of the spirit however but the same Lord. It is necessary to be given the gift of the spirit to proclaim Jesus to begin with. However, Jesus himself makes it a condition that someone should be baptized in his name.
The Scriptures also say “trust not your own understanding,” don’t they?
***How is it you’re gonna trust not your own understanding if you haven’t gotten to a point of understanding yet? The thrust of that verse is POST-understanding, not PRE-understanding.
Hold up.
I/we baptize you in the name of The Father,Son and Holy Spirit..
Where are the ‘names’ in that ritual?
Baptism saves,
***We are saved by GRACE through FAITH, not by works lest a man should boast. Show us all where it says in the bible that baptism saves.
but a lack of baptism does not condemn,
***If one doesn’t obtain salvation he obtains condemnation. Show us where a lack of baptism does not condemn and then develop how this is somehow the same thing that saves such a person. Acts 19. Paul did not question the BELIEF nor Salvation of those who had not been baptized.
Only a lack of faith.
***Non sequitur. Poor writing. Even inside the context of the paragraph.
A person can come to faith before his baptism,
***Then that is what saved them.
but that doesn’t mean baptism doesn’t do what the Bible says it does.
***Now you’re playing some weird word game about the word “do”.
Furthermore, all old testament saints were obviously saved without being baptized
***Which goes against your point that baptism saves.
- it hadn’t been instituted yet (or even by the time of the thief on the cross).
***John the baptist baptized, well before the thief on the cross. He even baptized Jesus. Did Jesus need to be saved? Our Greatest Example showed that baptism is not necessary for salvation, but it is the right thing to do.
Ooopsss…….
If baptism actually saved people, that might be the case, but since it doesn’t, then the wet baby is no worse off with the *wrong* words than the *right* ones.
Or conversely would be no better off with the*right* words than the *wrong* ones.
No, God does.
Baptism is not a magic formula used to manipulate something out of God that He freely lavishes on us in Christ.
Well said.
I don’t need someone’s stamp of approval on my relationship with God for it to be valid.
It’s not their decision to make.
Fabricated nonsense. There is no such thin alluded to in Scripture. It’s purely a Catholic construct to support an unbiblical doctrine.
The only magical thinking is presumption that one is saved by not keeping the words of Jesus. Because doing so is to not keep the words of Jesus. How can one not keep the words of Jesus Jesus Christ and be saved?
blessed are those who hear the word of God and keep it. Luke 11:28
Jesus Did command disciples to “go and baptize.” Matthew 28:19
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