Posted on 05/08/2020 4:37:58 PM PDT by pastorbillrandles
By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh. By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God. But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him. (Hebrews 11:4-6)
The famous “Faith Chapter” in the book of Hebrews, begins with two Saints, Abel and Enoch as examples of faith which we are to imitate. Faith is the point, for faith is the only way to please God.
I once asked the LORD, ‘Why Faith? Why is that what you require?” I believe I received several answers in the form of scripture and impressions, from the LORD. God requires faith, because we simply cannot save ourselves. Only God can save our souls, no one can redeem themselves, therefore Faith is required, because faith glorifies God and not man.
Another reason for the requirement of faith that came to me, is that our problems began when we quit believing in the goodness of God. Adam and Eve were willing to entertain a false and degraded notion of God, that He was holding something back that would be good for the first couple. The Serpent bore false witness about the LORD, and they believed it.
The way back? It has to be faith. We must repent and believe again in the goodness of God.
The “hall of faith” begins with Abel and Enoch. One Saint who was murdered for his faith, and for bearing witness to God in a hostile world. There would be literally millions upon millions who would follow in his footsteps, being willing to let go of their life rather than deny the truth of God.
The other Saint, Enoch, was a man who lived in a kind of “end times scenario” living in the time leading up to the flood. It was a day of Apostasy, but Enoch walked with God, until God took Him home. He didn’t die , He was raptured. God took him home, to be with himself.
Faith was required of each of them.
I believe that we also live in an end-time. I have no doubt that Jesus is coming, and in our lifetime. What makes us unique is the re-emergence of the nation of Israel, in 1948, in fulfillment of the prophecies about the last of the last days. All of the prophets pre-supposed that there would be a national Israel, and a Jewish occupied city of Jerusalem, as well as a controversy over Judea, (The West bank) which would engulf the whole world.
The burden of the word of the Lord for Israel, saith the Lord, which stretcheth forth the heavens, and layeth the foundation of the earth, and formeth the spirit of man within him. Behold, I will make Jerusalem a cup of trembling unto all the people round about, when they shall be in the siege both against Judah and against Jerusalem. And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people: all that burden themselves with it shall be cut in pieces, though all the people of the earth be gathered together against it. (Zechariah 12:1-3)
Which brings us back to our two Saints at the beginning of Hebrews 11. One died, He was martyred for his witness to God. The other one did not die. He was Raptured. Both of these Saints lived by Faith and Pleased God.
I believe that this speaks to us in our generation.
No doubt. many of us will end up dying. Perhaps some of us will be given an opportunity to be martyred. We are Saints and love God, but all things being equal, unless the LORD returns, we will die, one way or another.
(Of course, Christians don’t really die, they “go to sleep”) but the real point is that Faith is the only way to please God.
But according to the scriptures, there is a unique end-times event, coming, as I hope I have pointed out in this series, called the Rapture, or “Our gathering together unto Him”, “the Episynagogue” and Jesus coming to “take us where (He)…is, unto himself”. The LORD is coming to snatch us off the earth with a swift and irresistable power”.
To participate in such an event is a rare honor among the countless Millions of Saints who believed in Jesus before us.
But whether we die, or are martyred, o whether we are raptured, the real point is that we must live our lives by Faith,which is the only way to please God.
This is why I do not enter into the countless discussions as to the timing of the Rapture. “Will The Rapture be pre- ,mid , or post Tribulation”?
Honesty, the only things I am sure about the Rapture at all are that it is:
* For God’s Saints only, and the prospect of it is a comfort.
* A Mystery revealed in the New Testament era.
* It occurs before the actual “Wrath ” of God.
* It involves the “dead in Christ” as well as “We who are alive, until the coming of the LORD”.
As far as I know, all else can only be speculation. God doesn’t want us to know the exact timing otherwise it would be clearer. I am glad there is a Rapture, and my prayer has always been that I be involved in it, while alive. But I cannot say with certainty what the timing of it is, so I don’t.
What counts is Faith in Jesus. Not dead works, but a living, vital, infectious faith. Let us have a faith which still moves us to confess and forsake our sins, to Love and seek God. To forgive and love our brothers, and a faith which moves us to share with others what God has shown to us. Is your faith alive? Do you have oil in your lamp? Are you current with God?
We Overcome the World by our faith. “This is the victory that overcometh the World…our faith”. We overcome the Spirit of antiChrist also, by our faith. So also we overcome the sins that so easily beset us, and the Coldness and soul deadening effect of this world, by our Faith.
Of course we want out of here, we can increasingly see that there is nothing in this World for we who believe, but rejection and opposition.I want Jesus to come, and Long for the Rapture. I am either going up in it, or I am gong to die, but one way or another we are leaving.
Either way, the point is Faith. So I will leave the timing of the Rapture to God, and just strive to be counted worthy to attain it, whether ded or alive.
Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man. (Luke 21:35)
I won’t touch that one. Aufustine already said it was the profession by faith that is the Rock of which Christ spoke.
Okay, I let the first comment go by without commenting, but I have to step in here and ask you both to rethink what you're sayin'...
First let me mention that there may be so few who are actually deemed righteous enough to be ruptured, most may never even know the rapture occurred - the rest to await death and judgment day.
But to what I want to point out, if the entire world is in the midst of the worst part of the Bible, do you really believe those afraid for their lives, their hearts failing them from fear, are going to stop and say, hey, I didn't see this rapture thing happen, so I'm going to rethink this whole God thingy.
Maybe instead, those who find themselves in such a predicament are going to be calling on the Lord to save them from the apocalypse, don't ya think?
You can conclude anything you wish to believe. The word of God taken in full points to the Body of Christ being removed before God pours out His wrath on the unbelievers. And yet the Mercy of God is shown in that out of the Tribulation a number so great John could not count it come out of the tribulation to Heaven. These are not the body of Christ but it is only by finally trusting in Him that they show up in Heaven.
Nice dodge, but the manuscript is from the time of the ECF, even as you choose to deny it refutes your false assertion of No written material. and there are others found in sermons from ECFs. But of course you have chosen to not believe so you will believe what you want rather than truth.
that any true student of the Bible
......................................
How would one describe a true student of the Bible?
sasportas, have you ever read 1 Thes. and 2 Thes.? Why did Paul write the 2nd letter to them? He tells us. It was to comfort them. They were troubled and confused about something (Chapter1:7) and he wrote that letter to assure them of things he had ALREADY told them REGARDING THE DAY OF THE LORD. Read Chapter 2 specifically. He says in Chapter2:5 that he had ALREADY told them of these things.
“Don’t count on being ‘gone’ (raptured) before trouble sets in.”
Christians must accept the reality that being a follower of Christ means being the recipients of persecution and tribulation.
2 Timothy 3:12 (NKJV)
Yes, and all who desire to live godly in Christ Jesus will suffer persecution.
Acts 14:22b (NKJV)
We must through many tribulations enter the kingdom of God.
John 16:33 (NKJV)
These things I have spoken to you, that in Me you may have peace. In the world you will have tribulation; but be of good cheer, I have overcome the world.
John 17:15 (NKJV)
I do not pray that You should take them out of the world, but that You should keep them from the evil one.
Through Christ’s atoning work on the cross, we who believe escape God’s just wrath against us. Jesus took our place and washed away our sins in His own blood so that we never need to encounter God’s wrath. This is what we can expect to escape rather than tribulation and persecution. But God does “keep” us as we go through these things. And He does not have to take us out of this world to do so.
How is it none of the ECF interpreted “the word of God” on these points you mentioned, as you do? You live about two thousand years later on this issue than they.
They had the same word of God before them as you, why do you disregard their interpretation on these points you made?
I’ll tell you why...read 2 Pet. 2:19,20. Yours is a “private interpretation,” your own interpretation, not what the word of God actually says. Yours is what you want it to say.
LOL, ‘as I do’! As the Bible does, sasportas. Jesus introduced the reality in John 14. Why would he be preparing a place for us in the Father’s House? Love for His. Does God abide IN THE BELIEVER? Answer that question with the reason for the wrath to come upon the Earth.
1 Thess.5:9 “For God hath NOT appointed us to WRATH, BUT to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ.”
And
Romans 5:9. “Much more then, being NOW JUSTIFIED by His blood, we SHALL BE SAVED FROM WRATH THROUGH HIM”.
On your knees, open Bible, in a spirit of prayer. Is there any other way?
As a prophecy student of the Bible for 50 years, and a former pretrib I might add, yes, I am very familiar with 1 & 2 Thess.
Before I deal with your point, can I ask you a question? What does “the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night,” 1 Thess. 5:2, mean to you? Is it when the rapture happens?
Here is a video from Andy Woods which starting at ten minutes fifteen seconds Pastor Andy gives reasons why The Departure is a better meaning for the 2 Thess 2:3 passage.
Here is a video from Andy Woods which starting at ten minutes fifteen seconds Pastor Andy gives reasons why The Departure is a better meaning for the 2 Thess 2:3 passage: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nU-S22S5gTM
The Day od The Lord is something to fear for you unbelievers, yet it is a day believers will not even be on the Earth to witness. We shall be in Heaven with the Lord until He brings us with Him at the end of the Great Tribulation.
And here is a more full offering of the Andy Woods defense of 2 Thess 2:3 as The Departure of believers who have God abiding in their spirit (1 John 3:9): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nU-S22S5gTM
Now MHGinTN is calling me an unbeliever because I believe in the singular second coming that all the early writers of church history believed. You do know, you are calling them unbelievers, don’t you?
This takes the cake.
There are distinctions between the coming of Christ to rapture the church and the coming of Christ to return to earth to reign.
That said....It is the Lord who controls the ultimate fulfillment of time and has sovereign control to bring His promises to pass. Only the Lord knows the exact times and seasons for His fulfillment. But we do know that God has not appointed us to his wrath which will surely be let loose in the tribulation. Thus I believe we will not be on this earth during that time of his wrath.
I realized this a few years ago. It may be pretty bad BEFORE a or the Rapture. I know the scripture does mention a thief in the night as it happens out of the blue. Only we may be in perilous times.
Secondly, once in awhile I make a snide and say, ‘It already happened, nobody went.”
I am not as certain of the Rapture as I used to be. Our call is just to be faithful. That is a struggle sometimes. Thank you Lord for your Mercy and Grace.
You are a liar, but that was coming anyway as you dissembled. I call you an unbeliever in the pre Trib Rapture and you fraudulently accuse me of calling you a nonbeliever in The Christ. You are a liar, whatever else you are. If you are in fact a Christian, try to get your points across without lying.
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