Posted on 08/18/2019 7:05:12 PM PDT by Al Hitan
Today the Church remembers with thanksgiving the Blessed Virgin Mary, the Mother of God. Historically, this day was understood to mark her dormition, or "falling asleep," which was most anciently regarded as her natural death and burial. From early on, however, the Church considered that she who conceived and gave birth to the very God of very God, by His Word and Holy Spirit, was also resurrected and ascended into heaven, in both body and soul, soon after her death. There is no word of Holy Scripture to teach these traditions as doctrine, but we should not be too quick to dismiss them as merely pious devotion. Such piety, at its heart, is a confession of that which is the Church's faith in Christ, the Blessed Virgin Mary's Son, our Savior and our God.
St. Mary is uniquely honored among all the saints of God in Christ, not only by the Church, but first of all by the Lord God Himself. He has had mercy upon her, blessed her with His grace and favor, and chosen her above all other women to bear the almighty and eternal Son of God. She is rightly called, and truly is, the Mother of God; for her own dear Son, the Fruit of her womb, is indeed the one true God, begotten of the Father from all eternity. It is from her flesh and blood that the Lord has taken for Himself a true and natural body, bone of her bone and flesh of her flesh, so that henceforth He is true Man, the perfect second Adam, our elder Brother, our kinsman Redeemer, the promised Seed of the Woman, by whom we are reconciled to God. As the ancient fathers of the Church confessed, God thus became like us, in order that we become like Him, by grace. It is that great salvation that we celebrate in commemorating any of the saints, and in particular the Blessed Virgin Mother of God, St. Mary.
She is an icon of the Church, a living Sacrament of Christ, and a beautiful example of faith, of all the true children of father Abraham. Her body was comprehended by the Word and Spirit of God to become the tangible means by which the Son of God became flesh and was given to us, and not only for us, but for the life of the world. It is His body, conceived and born of St. Mary, that our sins and sorrows did carry. It is a human body, like our own in every way, save without sin, because He was born of this woman (born under the Law to redeem us). Thus do we recognize in her an archetype of the Blessed Sacrament of our Lord's body and blood.
What is more, in conceiving and giving birth to the Son of God, she is a type of the Church, the holy mother who surely gives birth to the sons of God in Christ. We too have been conceived and given new birth by the same Word and Spirit of the same Holy Triune God that overshadowed the Blessed Virgin Mary and knit within her womb the incarnation of the only-begotten Son. Thus are we, like Him, "born not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God" (St. John 1:13).
Along with her vocation as the woman by whom the Son of God was given to and for the world, St. Mary also stands with us as a living member of the Church, the Body of Christ. When the Word of the Gospel was announced to her, she received that Word in faith, obtained in her by the mercies of God, and meekly bowed her head in humble trust: "Let it be to me according to Thy Word." Blessed is she who has heard the Word of God and kept it, who treasured it in her heart, who believed that there would surely be a fulfillment of all that God had spoken to her. In all of this, St. Mary is one of us, a faithful disciple of her own dear Son, and among that great cloud of witnesses with which we are surrounded, of that blest communion, fellowship divine.
When the Church in pious tradition has considered St. Mary to be resurrected and ascended to heaven, already in both body and soul, it is a confession of faith in that which Christ Jesus our Lord has accomplished for us and for all by His victorious Cross, Resurrection and Ascension. We may indeed contemplate that she by whom the Lord became like us, should exemplify the way in which we all become like Him, recreated in the glorious Image of the Man from heaven. Of course, we do not rest faith upon the tradition of St. Mary's dormition and assumption into heaven; faith clings to Jesus Christ alone and finds true peace and Sabbath rest forever in Him. But what we envision concering St. Mary, we understand to be the Church's hope precisely in Christ our Lord, our Savior and our God. For we know that He is the Resurrection and the Life, and that she who believes in Him will live even if she dies; yes, and everyone who lives and believes in Him will never die.
We believe, teach and confess with the absolute certainty of faith that St. Mary is the Mother of God; that the almighty and eternal Son of the living God was born of this woman, born under the Law, to redeem us who were under the Law. In celebrating that marvelous incarnation of God the Son, in which He died and rose again for us men and our salvation, we may also celebrate proleptically the resurrection of the body that all His saints share with Him by grace through faith in the Gospel. And in that glorious light, we sing: "O higher than the cherubim, more glorious than the seraphim, lead their praises: 'Alleluia!' Thou bearer of the eternal Word, most gracious magnify the Lord: 'Alleluia! Alleluia! Alleluia!"
That phd you claim to have sure isn’t helping you any.
“im not catholic.. i dont agree with catholics beliefs. mary is not put in the same position as catholics do. i dont ask a priest for forgiveness. i go by the king james bible and talk to my Lord. ive been through the worst hurt.. and the lord is with me. ive witnessed the holy spitit.. i hang on because He hangs on to me. its personal..me and my lord.”
For you it is apparently all subjective, personal. For me it is personal but what is personal must be in accordance with what is absolutely true at all times.
You’re not Catholic. But you should be.
You don’t agree with Catholics’ beliefs. But you should.
You say Mary is “not put in the same position as catholics do.” But in reality she’s exactly in the position God put her in and we simply recognize it.
You don’t ask “priest for forgiveness.” But Christ gave His priests the power to forgive sins (John 20:19-23).
You “go by the king james bible”. But there are problems with the KJV just as there are problems with many Bible translations and editions.
You “talk to my Lord.” And that’s great, but then again a lot depends on what you’re talking to Him about.
You’ve “been through the worst hurt.. and the lord is with me.” Yes, and He could be with you in even greater ways, but you’ve already closed yourself off to those.
You’ve “witnessed the holy spitit..” “spitit”?
You say you “hang on because He hangs on to me. its personal..me and my lord.” Yet Jesus never said it was just you and Him. What might you be missing in your “personal” theology and ecclesiology that has nothing to do with what Jesus taught and everything to do with what you feel?
Hey frnewsjunkie….I bet you know that Christ has always existed.....some RCs apparently don't see that.
“You’re words, vlad....which btw you will see again in future conversations. You’re squirming vlad.”
Quote them often since they are irrefutably true. There was no Jesus before Jesus was formed in the womb. That’s exactly what John 1 tells us. There was the Second Person of the Trinity but no Jesus.
This is basic, orthodox Christianity. And there’s never any squirming on my part. My gosh, do you ever project a lot! Everything I said is entirely orthodox and has been believed in for 2000 years and is enshrined right there in John 1 but you think I’m squirming for siding with God and by quoting inspired and inerrant scripture. Seriously, your floundering is the best laugh I’ll have all day. At this rate you’re be denying the resurrection by the end of the week and claiming I’m “squirming” by citing gospel resurrection accounts! How low into personal comments/attacks/fantasies will you anti-Catholics sink to cover up your own embarrassment?
And I noticed that you completely ignored the verses that irrefutably shows that what I said was true. Gee, what a surprise that an anti-Catholic is ignoring scripture that shows his error is exactly that - error! Here they are again so other people can see you ignore them yet again in apparent desperation.
John 1: 1-3: In the beginning was the Word,
and the Word was with God,
and the Word was God.
He was in the beginning with God.
All things came to be through him,
and without him nothing came to be.
John 1:14: And the Word became flesh
and made his dwelling among us,
and we saw his glory,
the glory as of the Father’s only Son,
full of grace and truth.
The Second Person of the Trinity BECAME FLESH. Only after John says that does he refer to “Jesus Christ” in verse 17.
“That phd you claim to have sure isn’t helping you any.”
John the Evangelist never claimed to have a PhD yet you’re rejecting what he wrote under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. Go on, keep ignoring what he wrote. Everyone here will see you reject inspired scripture yet again.
Hey frnewsjunkie….I bet you know that anti-Catholics will deny the doctrine of the prexistence of Christ as Second Person of the Trinity before He took on flesh as Jesus clearly shown in John 1 because of how embarrassed they are at making such a silly error for such a well known orthodox belief. Here are the verses they ignore:
John 1: 1-3: In the beginning was the Word,
and the Word was with God,
and the Word was God.
He was in the beginning with God.
All things came to be through him,
and without him nothing came to be.
John 1:14: And the Word became flesh
and made his dwelling among us,
and we saw his glory,
the glory as of the Father’s only Son,
full of grace and truth.
The Second Person of the Trinity BECAME FLESH. Only after John says that does he refer to “Jesus Christ” in verse 17.
Anti-Catholics claim to love the Bible but they deny it every time it disagrees with their “personal” beliefs.
From one who admitted to at one time falling for the false message of an apparition.
I seriously question anyone who has fallen for that false message.
Keep flailing away to try and explain away your statement.
This would be comical if it weren't so sad at the same time.
[But those who say: 'There was a time when he was not;' and 'He was not before he was made;' and 'He was made out of nothing,' or 'He is of another substance' or 'essence,' or 'The Son of God is created,' or 'changeable,' or 'alterable'— they are condemned by the holy catholic and apostolic Church.]
entirely possible although the Bible states Jesus is. direct descendant of David maybe implying there is some genetic component. Again though I’m not sure this is an area we are even supposed to speculate about. If God wanted us to know He would tell us. There will time unrestricted in eternity to learn the glories of our God! And it will take all eternity and more to begin to learn about Him and know Him more. I can’t wait to get started!!!
I like the way C S Lewis describes it. There is no way the human body could contain the fullness of God. The finite can not contain the infinite. In the incarnation God did not take up residence in a human body, rather the human body was drawn up into and united with the fullness of His diety.
you are very judgmental and i could take offense. but i dont care what others who think they are the only one who has the truth, think.
i could never be a catholic. i dont wear a label except “christian”. i have lived enough years ... when i sat beside my son as he stopped breathing it does something to a parent jesus heaven, and the reality of what is important.. it isnt any church or domination. its do you know ehere youll spend eternity.
God bless you I can’t imagine the pain. God however knows your pain and will provide for you. May you be sustained in Him and the assurance of a glorious meeting with your Savior and your child when you pass into eternity.
The limits of your education are being exposed:
"Did you or did you not take on flesh from your mother? (As one half of my chromosome complement, yes. That leads to asking if you can prove half of the chromosomes in Jesus came from Mary, which you absolutely cannot prove but you assume it. Assumption, not logical connection)
Every baby does. ( Funny how Catholic Apologists will assume something then use that assumption as if it is a fact in evidence. You fail, apologist.. BTW, your specious assertion that since Jesus was a baby His gestation was exactly like every other baby, when you can see from the Scriptures that His gestational life was supernaturally derived thus He was not like every other baby in His natal age.)
Jesus was a baby in Mary’s womb. Refute that. You’ll fail. (It is you who has failed. Not surprising given your background in the mythos of Catholiciism)
You pose cleverly devised statements, but such cleverness exposes your lack of education regarding embryology and gestational existence for all but one human being. The creation of the body for The Son of God was a supernatural occurrence that your natural mind seeks to make into just another natural conception.
It is apparent that you have made several assumptions to support your assertions, not the least of which error is assuming half of the chromosomes in Jesus derived from Mary, as if God inseminated Mary's ovum. When challenged you revert to the childish 'you make no logical arguments'. The FACT is you are making assertions without any ability to prove those Catholic assertions.
Here's a piece of evidemce from Scripture to expose your assumptions: the Word of God tells us Mary conceived in her body. That does not say anything about her chromosome complement it just tells us the embryo of Jesus implanted in her uterine wall, in her womb. After that implantation the growing of the placenta and the body for life in the air world is solely the work of the newly implanted life. The body in which the implantation occurs adds not a single chromosome to that gestation person.
The natural man cannot fathom the spiritual for it is alien to the natural mind.
So succinctly stated and so very accurate! Thank you for posting that. BTW, I’m gonna appropriate the wording as a gem.
So now it reads that you're saying that Jesus is not the Second Person of the Trinity, God Incarnate.
Interesting.......
See post # 258 ... you fail, yet again!
*y* chromosome, but that aside, you are correct that if Jesus was made from Mary's flesh, He would have, of necessity, been a girl.
sry. posting on the fly.... and getting more senile every day
I hear you, but the posting police are going to catch it and rag on you for it and try to invalidate any point you made with it.
I figured better to catch it before they do.
thank you!
Hey, we've got so called phds claiming, "Your logic means Jesus existed before Jesus existed - which is an impossibility.", so I think you're excused for a typo.
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