Posted on 11/05/2018 1:55:29 PM PST by boatbums
Sure thing. I thought FR honored carriage return/line feed characters if there were no html tags. I’ll use html tags from now on.
Carriage returns (enter) works. But if you copy some things off the net and put them in your post it can mess that up. I think I’ve had that happen to me even after reviewing my comments and think it looks okay before posting.
See Post #77.
I don't think I copy/pasted anything for the post I typed. If I did, it wasn't much of it.
No, they really aren't. Only if you START with the preconceived belief in Purgatory and then look for verses that sound like they might support it. Even Catholic apologists today admit that there IS no Scriptural basis for the doctrine. The dogma developed over time and was never taught by the Apostles. Nice try!
To have a hi-ball with Lucifer?
From a usefulness perspective (not so much about theological accuracy from the Bible but about beliefs that help or hurt rubber-meeting-the-road in living our Christian faith), I'm kinda indifferent to purgatory as long as Catholics don't make a big issue about it.
Here in Alabama, when I was young Catholics around here were more about their Catholic beliefs and traditions than about core Christian values. For instance, as regarding purgatory, a lot of Catholics didn't bother witnessing to others because, what's the point? They're gonna get a 2nd chance to get into Heaven anyway (so they believed).
I think that's a bastardization of their original belief in purgatory, which is that all non-believers of Jesus go straight to Hell, while all believers would go to purgatory and suffer for however long, depending on each person's judgement of how they lived their lives, before eventually going to Heaven. So their belief in purgatory when I was young makes me automatically against it because they used it as an excuse to ignore Jesus' great commission.
Now that Catholics (at least in my area) are back to believing the great commission should be done even if there's a purgatory, I have less issue with them believing in a purgatory. It's kind of like I'm an old earther who can get along with young earthers --- as long as young earthers don't go around talking about their young earth beliefs so much around non-believers that they define a Christianity as based on pseudo-science that's not much different from, say, scientology. Imagine you're a non-believer who's thinking about accepting Jesus, but you hear from Christians that "true Christianity" believes the speed of light isn't constant, that people lived on the earth with dinosaurs, and that one dude named Methuselah lived about 1/6th of the entire history of earth's existence. Stuff like that makes a joke out of Christianity....all while the world is repeatedly sending a message that Christians are anti-science. When the young earthers take it to that level, I see it as a major problem. When young earthers talk about it only to fellow believers, it's something to have a friendly debate over during lunch.
That's how I see purgatory as long as the Catholics don't back to using it to keep them from evangelizing or to abuse indulgences.
I never found any reference to it in Scripture.
Scripture teaches about the sufficiency of Christ’s atonement to cleanse us from ALL sin.
Therefore, there is no need for purgatory.
Ebb, I did.
Not a single passage in that article has anything to do with a purgatory.
I was astounded you posted it, as if it was true.
Once you're dead, there are no second chances.
You make your decision here on earth before you die.
Once you're dead, it's a a done deal.
Chapter and verse on that or do you expect us to just take your say so?
Where do you get that from? There's no where what it says anyone died.
What's the basis for believing Jesus descended into Hell? The closest I can think of is 1 Peter 3:18-22.
Note that I included verses 21 and 22. So if you say that verse 19's and 20's description of Jesus going to visit the spirits of people in prison is proof enough that Jesus went to Hell, then surely the next verse (21) is a valid teaching about baptism...even though it describes baptism being an appeal to God for a good conscience.
So I ask you, if I say that verses 19 and 20 mean purgatory exists today (not something that was done away with after Jesus' death and resurrection, maybe as a placeholder for Old Testament deaths), will you concede that the very next couple of New Testament verses also say infant baptism is worthless (because babies ain't old enough to appeal to God for a good conscience)?
Jesus chastised people who were looking for signs, "So Jesus said to him, “Unless you see signs and wonders you will not believe.” (John 4:48). He also said, "“Because you have seen Me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.” (John 20:29).
I don’t expect anything from you.
I’m just stating the truth.
Q
most of those verse don't even come close to addressing a place like purgatory, and the only one that talks about testing something with fire, is dealing with the quality of our works.
The *fire* tests our WORKS, not US.
Catholics completely miss the point that cleansing from sin is done ONLY through the blood of Jesus.
Hebrews 9:22 Indeed, under the law almost everything is purified with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness of sins.
Catholics must be about the most gullible people on the planet to believe every Tom, Dick, and Harry who comes along and relates some apparition.
What "fire" do you know suffer from, or expect to suffer ffrom?
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