Posted on 08/03/2018 9:55:47 PM PDT by unlearner
LEXINGTON, Kentucky, Pro-homosexual dissident 'Catholic' groups see in Pope Francis' ‘changing’ of the Church’s teaching on the death penalty the hope that the Church will one day also change its teaching against homosexuality.
New Ways Ministry called the change in the Catechism proof that "Church teaching can change."
"It's important for Catholic advocates for LGBT equality to take note of this change because for decades Catholic opponents of LGBT equality argued that it is impossible to change church teaching. They often pointed to the fact that condemnations of same-sex relationships were inscribed in the Catechism, and so were not open for discussion or change. Yet, the teaching on the death penalty is in the Catechism, too, and, in fact, to make this change in teaching, it was the text of the Catechism that Francis changed," the group stated on its website.
New Ways Ministry, which works to "promote the acceptance of LGBT people," said that Pope Francis' move will help advance "LGBT equality" in a number of ways.
"First, we now have a clear, explicit contemporary example of church teaching changing, and also a look into how it can be done: with a papal change to the Catechism," it stated.
"Second, we can see that the process that brought about this change has been decades of theological debate and discussion, and not just a papal whim. That means the theological and even ecclesial discussions and debates right now about LGBT people have great potential to shape future changes in church teaching in regard to those topics," it added.
The pro-gay group was not the only one to see the significance of Pope Francis' rewrite of the Catechism.
In a post that appeared yesterday on Twitter, Lexington-based “Fortunate Families” wrote:
The church cannot change its teaching. That is what so many others say about other topics, for example regarding LGBTQ persons. But doctrine develops. Today’s news is a sterling example.
"The idea first floated by [the] Pope on Catechism’s 25th anniversary last fall to signify development of doctrine,” the tweet continued, “rescript issued today sees Francis issue edit of the 1994 official text, now deeming capital punishment ‘inadmissible’-- the new formulation.”
“Development of doctrine”, legitimately used to describe how the Catholic Church refines and expands, but never undermines or rejects, what was taught earlier, has now been interpreted by some to mean the erasure of settled Church teaching.
Critics say Pope Francis attempted to do that yesterday when he promulgated a new teaching concerning the death penalty in the Catechism of the Catholic Church, saying that it was “inadmissible.” The perennial teaching of the Church, based on Scripture and unanimously accepted by the Church Fathers and every pope until Francis, is that legitimate civil authority may impose the death penalty on a malefactor. Although both Saint John Paul II and Benedict XVI were strongly opposed to capital punishment--and John Paul’s Catechism strongly circumscribed it--neither pope denied this principle.
Pope Francis’ innovation has already become a club for American liberals to beat conservatives with. Jane Fleming Kleeb, Chair of the Democratic Party in Nebraska, has tweeted “Let's be clear Nebraskans, @GovRicketts is going against the teachings of the church. We can change leaders by voting different on Nov. 6--Democrats are against the death penalty.”
Fortunate Families, founded in 1992 by Mary Ellen and Casey Lopata, the Catholic parents of a same-sex attracted man, is a group of Catholic religious and laypeople who dissent on authentic Church teaching regarding sexuality and marriage. From 2010 until this July Fortunate Families was part of a coalition with Call to Action, the banned Dignity, and the censured New Ways ministry.
Astonishingly, since November 2017 Bishop John Stowe, OFM of Lexington has served as the dissident group’s “ecclesial advisor”. Stowe is one of the five bishops who have endorsed Fr. James Martin’s pro-LGBT book Building a Bridge. The bishop was appointed to the Lexington diocese by Pope Francis in 2015.
Fortunate Families was last in the news when a Lexington Catholic church stretched an LGBT flag across its front lawn. The first executive director of the group, Stan “JR” Zerkowski, is a parishioner at St. Paul’s parish, and told media that he hoped the banner got wide publicity.
“This is a church that is open to all people and I hope this sign gets that across,” he said in the TV report. “I don’t think a Catholic Church has ever had a sign like this before in front of it during Pride Week or any other time. However, in other parts of the country we see this regularly.”
The banner read “LBGTQ+ Catholic /Family, Friends & Allies/all are welcome”, insinuating that at other Catholic churches Catholics who experience same-sex desires or suffer from gender dysphoria are barred from the worship of God.
Former homosexual Joseph Sciambra retweeted the group’s Twitter message, saying “Bishop Stowe’s ‘Fortunate Families’ believe that the [Catechism of the Catholic Church] will also ‘change’ in terms of homosexuality. FF operatives are embedded within several dioceses around the US.”
Sciambra, a survivor of the San Francisco 1990s “gay scene”, is dedicated to helping people with same-sex attractions avoid being trapped in what he says is a dangerous way of life.
All Catholics pray for the pope at every mass. Many pray for him in their private prayers also.
Actually, for the Roman Catholic the problem is a bit more serious than that.
Their own canon law says they are not to publicly incite hatred toward the Apostolic See.
Can. 1373 A person who publicly incites among subjects animosities or hatred against the Apostolic See or an ordinary because of some act of power or ecclesiastical ministry or provokes subjects to disobey them is to be punished by an interdict or other just penalties.
Catholicsstraightanswers.com defines the Apostolic See to mean:
The Holy See is also interchangeable with the term “Apostolic See.” The Code of Canon Law provides the following definition: “…The term ‘Apostolic See’ or ‘Holy See’ applies not only to the Roman Pontiff but also to the Secretariat of State, the Council for the Public Affairs of the Church, and other institutions of the Roman Curia, unless the nature of the matter or the context of the words makes the contrary evident” (#361).
http://catholicstraightanswers.com/what-does-the-term-holy-see-mean/
In other words...ebbtide, and others, who post articles critical of their pope, are breaking their own canon law.
Ironically, they are doing the very thing they routinely condemn Luther for. The irony is not lost.
Further, when the Council of Trent's rulings on who is to interpret Scripture are taken into consideration the lay Roman Catholic is unable to determine on their own the true and accurate meaning of a verse from Scripture:
Furthermore, in order to restrain petulant spirits, It decrees, that no one, relying on his own skill, shall,--in matters of faith, and of morals pertaining to the edification of Christian doctrine, --wresting the sacred Scripture to his own senses, presume to interpret the said sacred Scripture contrary to that sense which holy mother Church,--whose it is to judge of the true sense and interpretation of the holy Scriptures,--hath held and doth hold; [Page 20] or even contrary to the unanimous consent of the Fathers; even though such interpretations were never (intended) to be at any time published.
Where does all of this leave the lay Roman Catholic?
1) they cannot criticize their pope
2) they cannot ascertain the meaning of a verse from Scripture on their own and have to rely upon the Church...the Apostolic See...the very office they are condemning.
The lay Roman Catholic is at the mercy of the "Church" to instruct them in this manner.
Per Unam Sanctam, the Roman Catholic has to obey their pope. They have no choice.
It's too bad Luther did not have the advantage of the internet in his time to bring all of this information forward. The outcome of the Reformation may have been completely different.
Yet, I learned the rules within months.
Yes fer sure.
But it is good that they see that their pope is corrupt and very un Christian.
But they stay in their denomination.
Don’t they know that the fish rots from the head down?
There is really something fishy about their exalted Vicar of Christ (eww that’s so wrong!)...lots of stink
Ha ha LOL!
If a poster is going to be this careless or ambivalent to the rules of Free Republic, it would be my opinion the poster should not be allowed to use the caucus thread any longer.
You defended non-Catholics posting on Catholic caused threads with this, "Some times OTH (Other Than Catholic) posters post on Catholic caucused threads because many of them don’t qualify for the Catholic caucus designation."
You just said you don't check as to what qualifies as a caucus.
I know I've caught several of your caucus threads that broke the caucus rules.
I had thought you had bowed out of this dialogue.
I see I was wrong.
I know, right.....man up and say it in the open for the world to see and judge!
Speaking for others now, are you?
Imagine that.........
Yet you admit the following:
It's not up to a poster to determine what qualifies as a caucus.
You don't play these public debate games very well.
I think I just sunk your battleship.
Say what??
Has it ever occurred to you that just maybe we might agree with the opinions posted and would like to say so???
On the other hand, there have been Catholic Caucus threads posted that did NOT obey the Caucus rules and were sneakily trying to slip past the Moderator. I'd guess that this has happened FAR more frequently here. I know I've exposed a few myself and have successfully challenged their categorization. Maybe THAT is what irks some so much?
If your church is OK with gays or if it believes in evolution, you are not going to a Christian church.
Badgering, lol! Because you fibbed, right?
And I see the little posse has arrived to help you out. How do you guys work that out? Does a smoke signal go out behind the scenes? Unheard of in Catholic freeper-land.
I said no such thing. It was I who posted the caucus rules to unlearner.
I got unceremoniously uninvited from a caucus thread one time years back for that exact thing.
It was about a priest who lost his job for standing his ground about something he believed and I had a lot of respect and admiration for that kind of character.
My posts were positive and I was booted and told by the Catholics that it wasn't because of the content of my posts, but it was because of who I was.
So they don't even allow others the opportunity to agree with them and yet complain that all we do is criticize.
You can't win with some folks.
I’ll bite:
What.
From my experience, "No". And this thread has confirmed it.
Have you ever considered people may read threads they’re interested in?? That paranoia will destroya.
Yet Roman Catholicism allows their members to believe in evolution.
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