Posted on 06/08/2018 8:54:57 AM PDT by Salvation
There are a lot of “solos” sung by our Protestant brethren: sola fide (saved by faith alone), sola Scriptura (Scripture alone is the rule of faith), and sola gratia (grace alone). Generally, one ought to be leery of claims that things work “alone.” Typically, many things work together in harmony; things are interrelated. Very seldom is anyone or anything really “alone.”
The problem with “solos” emerges (it seems to me) in our mind, where it is possible to separate things out; but just because we can separate something out in our mind does not mean that we can do so in reality.
Consider, for a moment, a candle’s flame. In my mind, I can separate the heat of the flame from its light, but I could never put a knife into the flame and put the heat of the flame on one side of it and the light on the other. In reality, the heat and light are inseparable—so together as to be one.
I would like to argue that it is the same with things like faith and works, grace and transformation, Scripture and the Church. We can separate all these things out in our mind, but in reality, they are one. Attempting to separate them from what they belong to leads to grave distortions and to the thing in question no longer being what it is claimed to be. Rather, it becomes an abstraction that exists only on a blackboard or in the mind of a theologian.
Let’s look at the three main “solos” of Protestant theology. I am aware that there are non-Catholic readers of this blog, so please understand that my objections are made with respect. I am also aware that in a short blog I may oversimplify, and thus I welcome additions, clarifications, etc. in the comments section.
Solo 1: Faith alone (sola fide) – For 400 years, Catholics and Protestants have debated the question of faith and works. In this matter, we must each avoid caricaturing the other’s position. Catholics do not and never have taught that we are saved by works. For Heaven’s sake, we baptize infants! We fought off the Pelagians. But neither do Protestants mean by “faith” a purely intellectual acceptance of the existence of God, as many Catholics think that they do.
What concerns us here is the detachment of faith from works that the phrase “faith alone” implies. Let me ask, what is faith without works? Can you point to it? Is it visible? Introduce me to someone who has real faith but no works. I don’t think one can be found. About the only example I can think of is a baptized infant, but that’s a Catholic thing! Most Baptists and Evangelicals who sing the solos reject infant baptism.
Hence it seems that faith alone is something of an abstraction. Faith is something that can only be separated from works in our minds. If faith is a transformative relationship with Jesus Christ, we cannot enter into that relationship while remaining unchanged. This change affects our behavior, our works. Even in the case of infants, it is possible to argue that they are changed and do have “works”; it’s just that they are not easily observed.
Scripture affirms that faith is never alone, that such a concept is an abstraction. Faith without works is dead (James 2:26). Faith without works is not faith at all because faith does not exist by itself; it is always present with and causes works through love. Galatians 5:6 says, For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth anything, nor uncircumcision; but faith working through love. Hence faith works not alone but through love. Further, as Paul states in 1 Corinthians 13:2, if I have all faith so as to move mountains but do not have love, I am nothing.
Hence faith alone is the null set. True faith is never alone; it bears the fruit of love and the works of holiness. Faith ignites love and works through it. Beware of the solo “faith alone” and ask where faith, all by itself, can be found.
Solo 2: Grace alone (sola gratia) – By its very nature grace changes us. Again, show me grace apart from works. Grace without works is an abstraction. It cannot be found apart from its effects. In our mind it may exist as an idea, but in reality, grace is never alone.
Grace builds on nature and transforms it. It engages the person who responds to its urges and gifts. If grace is real, it will have its effects and cannot be found alone or apart from works. It cannot be found apart from a real flesh-and-blood human who is manifesting its effects.
Solo 3: Scripture alone (sola Scriptura) – Beware those who say, “sola Scriptura!” This is the claim that Scripture alone is the measure of faith and the sole authority for the Christian, that there is no need for a Church and no authority in the Church, that there is only authority in the Scripture.
There are several problems with this.
First, Scripture as we know it (with the full New Testament) was not fully assembled and agreed upon until the 4th century.
It was Catholic bishops, in union with the Pope, who made the decision as to which books belonged in the Bible. The early Christians could not possibly have lived by sola scriptura because the Scriptures were not even fully written in the earliest years. And although collected and largely completed in written form by 100 AD, the set of books and letters that actually made up the New Testament was not agreed upon until the 4th century.
Second, until recently most people could not read.
Given this, it seems strange that God would make, as the sole rule of faith, a book that people had to read on their own. Even today, large numbers of people in the world cannot read well. Hence, Scripture was not necessarily a read text, but rather one that most people heard and experienced in and with the Church through her preaching, liturgy, art, architecture, stained glass, passion plays, and so forth.
Third, and most important, if all you have is a book, then that book needs to be interpreted accurately.
Without a valid and recognized interpreter, the book can serve to divide more than to unite. Is this not the experience of Protestantism, which now has tens of thousands of denominations all claiming to read the same Bible but interpreting it in rather different manners?
The problem is, if no one is Pope then everyone is Pope! Protestant “soloists” claim that anyone, alone with a Bible and the Holy Spirit, can authentically interpret Scripture. Well then, why does the Holy Spirit tell some people that baptism is necessary for salvation and others that it is not necessary? Why does the Holy Spirit tell some that the Eucharist really is Christ’s Body and Blood and others that it is only a symbol? Why does the Holy Spirit say to some Protestants, “Once saved, always saved” and to others, “No”?
So, it seems clear that Scripture is not meant to be alone. Scripture itself says this in 2 Peter 3:16: our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, also wrote to you, Our Brother Paul speaking of these things [the Last things] as he does in all his letters. In them there are some things hard to understand that the ignorant and unstable distort to their own destruction, just as they do the other scriptures. Hence Scripture itself warns that it is quite possible to misinterpret Scripture.
Where is the truth to be found? The Scriptures once again answer this: you should know how to behave in the household of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and foundation of truth (1 Tim 3:15).
Hence Scripture is not to be read alone. It is a document of the Lord through the Church and must be read in the context of the Church and with the Church’s authoritative interpretation and Tradition. As this passage from Timothy says, the Church is the pillar and foundation of truth. The Bible is a Church book and thus is not meant to be read apart from the Church that received the authority to publish it from God Himself. Scripture is the most authoritative and precious document of the Church, but it emanates from the Church’s Tradition and must be understood in the light of it.
Thus, the problems of “singing solo” seem to boil down to the fact that if we separate what God has joined we end up with an abstraction, something that exists only in the mind but in reality, cannot be found alone.
Here is a brief video in which Fr. Robert Barron ponders the Protestant point of view that every baptized Christian has the right to authoritatively interpret the Word of God.sss
Indeed. The effect is not to be confused with the cause.
Uh...NO! Show me the Gospel quote.
Uh...NO? Then just WHO had Holy Spirit inspire the writers of Scripture?
I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you. All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you. (John 16:12-15)
And as God told Moses and others to write Scripture, ( Ex. 17:14; 24:4,7; Dt. 4:13; 17:18; 31:9,24; 34:27; Jos 4:7; Isa 30:8; Jer 30:2; 36:2; Hab 2:2) so the Lord told John:
Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafter; (Revelation 1:19; cf. 1:11; 19; 2:1; 10:4; 14:13; 19:9; 21:5)
So again, just WHO had Holy Spirit inspire the writers of Scripture?
News Flash!
The OT and Revelations ARE NOT GOSPELS!
John 1:14 And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we have seen his glory, glory as of the only Son from the Father, full of grace and truth.
John 1:17 For the law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.
John 14:6 Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
John 15:26 “But when the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth, who proceeds from the Father, he will bear witness about me.
John 16:13 When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth, for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.
John 17:17 Sanctify them in the truth; your word is truth.
2 Corinthians 4:2 But we have renounced disgraceful, underhanded ways. We refuse to practice cunning or to tamper with God's word, but by the open statement of the truth we would commend ourselves to everyone's conscience in the sight of God.
2 Timothy 2:15 Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a worker who has no need to be ashamed, rightly handling the word of truth.
1 John 4:6 We are from God. Whoever knows God listens to us; whoever is not from God does not listen to us. By this we know the Spirit of truth and the spirit of error.
1 John 5:6 This is he who came by water and blood—Jesus Christ; not by the water only but by the water and the blood. And the Spirit is the one who testifies, because the Spirit is the truth.
We were talking about INFANT baptism, not young children.
A child old enough to speak is old enough to express trust in, faith in, or as desire to follow Jesus.
An infant, not so much.
Do you believe that Scripture, ALL of it, is God breathed, Holy Spirit inspired revelation from God to man?
Yes or no will do.
I really don’t understand what you’re trying to say here. Examples please?
You’ve been shown plenty already.
If you reject the Word of God, that is your business, but don’t try to argue that you obey and believe all Scripture with one breath and then attack its authenticity with the next.
News Flash! John is, and the gospels abound with OT quotes and references, affirming that God chose writing to be His most reliable means of authoritative preservation.
Meanwhile, the gospels were not written by Christ directly, but were inspired by His Spirit just as the rest of Scripture is. But perhaps G Larry is a breed of heretical Catholics who only believes the gospels are the authoritative word of God (sola evangelicae)?
From a spiritual point of view, I think it’s good to baptize infants asap after being born.
They have just transitioned into the world and need all the help they can get staying healthy and safe.
It obviously is good sense to physically wash their physical body shortly after birth.
So, I bet the same is also true for their spiritual body, too, which is what baptism is for, right?
Once they’re up and running, they can take care of it themselves.
But until then and after then, I figure it’s always better safe than sorry, especially with all things supernatural!
This is my belief as well. I go further into it upthread.
While physically washing is good, the Catholic fantasy that the very act of baptism (ex opere operato) an infant, who cannot obey the stated requirements for baptism, (Acts 2:38; 8:36,37) is born again, means they are henceforth treated as Christians and never challenged to to come to the Lord Jesus as contrite, damned + destitute sinners, and trust Him to save them by His blood-expense and righteousness, not at all by their merit or the power of the church and a postmortem purgatorial work.
And thus most Caths have no conscious "day of salvation," and testimony of manifest transformative regeneration, and yet expect to see Heaven (usually via Purgatory) - to their eternal horror. .
That false doctrine isn't taught at all in the scriptures...
Again and again the sacred writers tell us that it is in baptism that we are saved, buried with Christ, incorporated into his body, washed of our sins, regenerated, cleansed, and so on (see Acts 2:38, 22:16; Rom. 6:1–4; 1 Cor. 6:11, 12:13; Gal. 3:26–27; Eph. 5:25-27; Col. 2:11–12; Titus 3:5; 1 Pet. 3:18–22). They are unanimous in speaking of baptism in invariably efficient terms, as really bringing about a spiritual effect.
Baptism doesn't mean water...Never will...And water doesn't mean baptism...
Act 11:15 And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, as on us at the beginning.
Act 11:16 Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost.
Act_10:47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
These people were baptized in the Holy Ghost and then later were baptized in water...
Getting water dropped on you while some person wearing a robe gives a little speech does not indwell anyone with the Holy Ghost...
Christ’s instructions to the Apostles and successors: He said to them, “Go into the whole world and proclaim the gospel to every creature. 16Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved; whoever does not believe will be condemned.
That was Jesus' command to all of his Jewish disciples at the time...
Comically, your current pope remarked some time ago that a person didn't have to believe in Jesus Christ to be a Catholic Christian...
Catholic always ignore the glaring truth in the scripture you just posted...And that is: if you believe and are baptized you'll be saved, but if you don't believe and are baptized anyway, you are condemned...
Well, there goes all the babies who were baptized in the Catholic church...And what's that, about 90% of the Catholic population???
You Catholics are only allowed one baptism, which is with water, and if you weren't old enough to recognize sin and the need for a Savior at that one time baptism, that baptism is meaningless...
You’re majoring in a minor and completely embarrassing yourself on this issue.
Has anyone said only adults can be baptized??
However, the NT is clear...one must be able to profess faith in Christ.
Infants cannot do that. Children can and it will vary by year when they begin to understand.
Jesus told us to be like little children in order to join Him in Heaven. Perhaps you should look that up and understand it.
Yes...we are to have a child's trust in Him. Children implicitly trust their parents....so we should implicitly trust Him.
I see you cannot answer AMPU’s questions.
Why do you not want us to know?
More importantly, I wonder why ADSUM would not want us to know.
If he is a priest, he'd be the only Roman Catholic to offer a valid statement of RCC theology. The rest of you are just offering your opinions.
Unfortunately, I am leaving for a trip for one week and cannot get more involved in this at the moment.
I must apologize.
I was wrong about G Larry getting put on timeout
but ya gotta give me points for creativity.
7
For me, it’s a self-evident truth that, if you have to do it all for them in the physical world, then I figure you have to do the same for their spiritual side as well.
This might sound strange, or worse, but I “see” the spiritual/supernatural world that I can’t see as being every bit as real as the physical world my physical world senses do make me aware of.
Though each of us, being born in Their Image, is born with the capacity/ability to sense things on the higher levels, I have yet to figure out how turn that on in me.
So, while I have a sense of it, I still cannot discern it, even though I do fully believe in the existence of spiritual/supernatural world things I cannot sense with what remains of my five senses.
What little I have seen/experienced is more than enough proof for me, as if I needed any more.
However, in seeking to better understand and become more aware of such things, I find the Protestants are generally resistant to spiritual/supernatural world things and concepts.
It seems to be a matter of perspective for most of those I know. If they can’t see it, hear it, touch it, taste it or smell it, it doesn’t exist... unless it’s scary or evil, of course, and then, maybe.
Even the stories in the Bible, like Jonah in the whale, for example, are not fully accepted, but just acknowledged as stories in the Bible.
Otoh, the Catholics and the Orthodox appear to have a much richer understanding of, and participation with, the spiritual/supernatural world of the Holy Family, angels and saints.
I’m not sure why things are this way, but that’s the view from here... so far.
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