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To: Izzy Dunne
You can take a pile of logs and build a house - you are increasing order.

Yes, and you proved my point. The order of a structure was the result of work being done on the system. Work done by an intelligent outside source.

Simply pouring energy into a system does not by default increase order by itself.

Also in those ordered structures, as you pointed out, entropy still enters and decay begins. Once the work is done, if it is not maintained, entropy kicks in, and even then the maintenance merely slows down the rate of entropy.

Entropy is a LAW of thermodynamics.

It HAS to happen and will happen even after work is done to the system to create pockets of order.

And since when do creationists care about physical "laws" anyway? Everything is apparently subject to the whims of a magical immortal being.

Because God also created the laws by which the universe runs.

Isaac Newton held to that view and I would suggest that he was a more brilliant scientist than most alive today.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_views_of_Isaac_Newton

Newton saw God as the masterful creator whose existence could not be denied in the face of the grandeur of all creation.[26] Nevertheless, he rejected Leibniz' thesis that God would necessarily make a perfect world which requires no intervention from the creator. In Query 31 of the Opticks, Newton simultaneously made an argument from design and for the necessity of intervention:

For while comets move in very eccentric orbs in all manner of positions, blind fate could never make all the planets move one and the same way in orbs concentric, some inconsiderable irregularities excepted which may have arisen from the mutual actions of comets and planets on one another, and which will be apt to increase, till this system wants a reformation.[27]

BTW, Christians do not believe in magic.

If you consider the extra natural, things that exist outside the purview of the natural as can be observed and described by science, as *magic* it shows a mind closed to anything outside it's narrow, rigid belief system.

135 posted on 06/10/2017 5:53:40 AM PDT by metmom ( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith...)
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To: metmom; Izzy Dunne
meteor quoting, on Newton:"Nevertheless, he rejected Leibniz' thesis that God would necessarily make a perfect world which requires no intervention from the creator.
In Query 31 of the Opticks, Newton simultaneously made an argument from design and for the necessity of intervention: "

Today it's not clear if God's interventions in nature will appear to us as anything other than "random chance" or "happy coincidence" or even in Chaos Theory, as a "great attractor".
But it is clear that God's interventions in human history are intended to be seen by all as His Work.

For example, many Founders were Enlightenment men who believed in the Great Clock Maker --who was thought to be generally "hands off" of His creation.
However, by the ends of their lives, all understood that Providence operated in their lives to accomplish His ends.

177 posted on 06/13/2017 11:40:12 AM PDT by BroJoeK (a little historical perspective...)
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