Posted on 05/31/2017 1:41:09 PM PDT by ealgeone
Question: "Can a Christian lose salvation?"
Answer: First, the term Christian must be defined. A “Christian” is not a person who has said a prayer or walked down an aisle or been raised in a Christian family. While each of these things can be a part of the Christian experience, they are not what makes a Christian. A Christian is a person who has fully trusted in Jesus Christ as the only Savior and therefore possesses the Holy Spirit (John 3:16; Acts 16:31; Ephesians 2:8–9).
So, with this definition in mind, can a Christian lose salvation? It’s a crucially important question. Perhaps the best way to answer it is to examine what the Bible says occurs at salvation and to study what losing salvation would entail:
A Christian is a new creation. “Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has gone, the new has come!” (2 Corinthians 5:17). A Christian is not simply an “improved” version of a person; a Christian is an entirely new creature. He is “in Christ.” For a Christian to lose salvation, the new creation would have to be destroyed.
A Christian is redeemed. “For you know that it was not with perishable things such as silver or gold that you were redeemed from the empty way of life handed down to you from your forefathers, but with the precious blood of Christ, a lamb without blemish or defect” (1 Peter 1:18–19). The word redeemed refers to a purchase being made, a price being paid. We were purchased at the cost of Christ’s death. For a Christian to lose salvation, God Himself would have to revoke His purchase of the individual for whom He paid with the precious blood of Christ.
A Christian is justified. “Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ” (Romans 5:1). To justify is to declare righteous. All those who receive Jesus as Savior are “declared righteous” by God. For a Christian to lose salvation, God would have to go back on His Word and “un-declare” what He had previously declared. Those absolved of guilt would have to be tried again and found guilty. God would have to reverse the sentence handed down from the divine bench.
A Christian is promised eternal life. “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life” (John 3:16). Eternal life is the promise of spending forever in heaven with God. God promises, “Believe and you will have eternal life.” For a Christian to lose salvation, eternal life would have to be redefined. The Christian is promised to live forever. Does eternal not mean “eternal”?
A Christian is marked by God and sealed by the Spirit. “You also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession—to the praise of his glory” (Ephesians 1:13–14). At the moment of faith, the new Christian is marked and sealed with the Spirit, who was promised to act as a deposit to guarantee the heavenly inheritance. The end result is that God’s glory is praised. For a Christian to lose salvation, God would have to erase the mark, withdraw the Spirit, cancel the deposit, break His promise, revoke the guarantee, keep the inheritance, forego the praise, and lessen His glory.
A Christian is guaranteed glorification. “Those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified” (Romans 8:30). According to Romans 5:1, justification is ours at the moment of faith. According to Romans 8:30, glorification comes with justification. All those whom God justifies are promised to be glorified. This promise will be fulfilled when Christians receive their perfect resurrection bodies in heaven. If a Christian can lose salvation, then Romans 8:30 is in error, because God could not guarantee glorification for all those whom He predestines, calls, and justifies.
A Christian cannot lose salvation. Most, if not all, of what the Bible says happens to us when we receive Christ would be invalidated if salvation could be lost. Salvation is the gift of God, and God’s gifts are “irrevocable” (Romans 11:29). A Christian cannot be un-newly created. The redeemed cannot be unpurchased. Eternal life cannot be temporary. God cannot renege on His Word. Scripture says that God cannot lie (Titus 1:2).
Two common objections to the belief that a Christian cannot lose salvation concern these experiential issues: 1) What about Christians who live in a sinful, unrepentant lifestyle? 2) What about Christians who reject the faith and deny Christ? The problem with these objections is the assumption that everyone who calls himself a “Christian” has actually been born again. The Bible declares that a true Christian will not live a state of continual, unrepentant sin (1 John 3:6). The Bible also says that anyone who departs the faith is demonstrating that he was never truly a Christian (1 John 2:19). He may have been religious, he may have put on a good show, but he was never born again by the power of God. “By their fruit you will recognize them” (Matthew 7:16). The redeemed of God belong “to him who was raised from the dead, in order that we might bear fruit for God” (Romans 7:4).
Nothing can separate a child of God from the Father’s love (Romans 8:38–39). Nothing can remove a Christian from God’s hand (John 10:28–29). God guarantees eternal life and maintains the salvation He has given us. The Good Shepherd searches for the lost sheep, and, “when he finds it, he joyfully puts it on his shoulders and goes home” (Luke 15:5–6). The lamb is found, and the Shepherd gladly bears the burden; our Lord takes full responsibility for bringing the lost one safely home.
Jude 24–25 further emphasizes the goodness and faithfulness of our Savior: “To Him who is able to keep you from falling and to present you before his glorious presence without fault and with great joy—to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.”
Are you so dull? Do you not realize that many of the dates set by your org correspond to the pagan dating? Are you unaware that the ‘queen of heaven’ designation is directly from the worship of Astarte? Perhaps Submareener or delchiante will enlighten you, if you will listen.
First of all, the pagan astrology is a Satanic counterfeit of the Mazzaroth which is Abba Father YHWH’s salvation plan written in the stars. Second, we us the Hebrew calendar to do the calculations, but translate into the current calendar for reporting to Americans.
So let’s follow Jesus’ commandments and love one another.
I don’t regard myself as being particularly dull. Evidently, there is no real evidence of these things. I guess I just don’t have the fantastic imagination necessary
to figures out these obscure things.
Not from the EARLY church. I knew that Mary was a normal sinner, and a mother to numerous other children, after Jesus was born, so I started looking around, for where this unbiblical idea came from, of her being the queen of Heaven, perpetual virgin, or whatever she is called.
On the other hand, I do not talk a whole lot about Mary, just once in a while. It is not an important subject to me. The plan of salvation IS important. We must be born anew, from above. Anyone who is never born anew, will have their part in the lake that burns forever. 🔥 All the rest of the ideas out there, including what anyone thinks of Mary, pales in comparison to Heaven and Hell. I don't want to see you, or anyone go there. 😇
Agreed. By the way, am I correct in assuming that you were in the Navy?
You mentioned the stars. I read two books, one called the Gospel in the stars, by Duane Spencer, who I met in person once in San Antonio, and the Witness of the Stars, by EW Bullinger. I take most of it with a grain of salt. They have some nice to know stuff in there, but I am not convinced it is true, any more than I think fallen angels had sex with women, and produced the Nephilim.
As far as mother/son worship goes, and the so called queen of Heaven goes? Same thing. I accept much of what is written by various authors, and other things I might not accept. As I said earlier, the only issue that is important, is Heaven or Hell. No other issues matter even SLIGHTLY, compared to keeping people out of Hell 🔥
Yes, I was in the Navy.
Jeremiah deals with the “Queen of Heaven” when the remnant decides to disregard YHWH Word and go to Egypt.
Our Priest told this story a couple of Sunday’s ago. This guy dies and goes to heaven. Saint Peter meets him at one of the Pearly Gates, and says, “We have a new merit system. You have to get 100 points to get in.” The guy says, “Well, I always tried to go to Church every week.” “Fine!”, Saint Peter says, “That’s three points.” The guy goes on to list some other things he did, and each time Saint Peter says, “Fine, that’s three points!”. After he gets to ten things, the guy says, “Wait a minute! At this rate, the only way I’m going to get into Heaven is by the Grace of God!” To which Saint Peter says, “Right, come on in! You are on the list!” ;-)
“Do you know of any writings from the early church that supports your assertion that this paganism was brought into the church? Or that even mentioned any pagan religions?”
rwa265,
I do want to say directly to you that you can find reams of information online, but I will not post that, since much is very negative.
It is far more important that a person come to saving faith in Christ - trusting HIM totally and Him alone for the payment of sin and for eternal life. Where you go to church on earth is secondary.
Salvation is only about Him, His sacrifice and our need to entrust ourselves to Him alone, by faith in Him alone to save us — to trust Him personally as our Lord and Savior.
There is no church that saves. Only Christ saves.
There is nothing we can do to earn salvation. Only entrusting ourselves by faith totally to Him saves.
Everything else is secondary. I wish eternal life for you.
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Clearly there are no released documents that order bishops to integrate paganism. The testimony of Catholic scholars, however, does say it happened. The symbolic appropriation from Babylonian mystery religions into the church speaks volumes.
Here are some quotes for you.
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Twentieth Century Encyclopedia of Catholicism says the following:
“The missionary history of the [Catholic] Church clearly shows her adaptability to all races, all continents, all nations. In her liturgy and her art, in her tradition and the forming of her doctrine, naturally enough she includes Jewish elements, but also elements that are of pagan origin.
“In certain respects, she has copied her organization from that of the Roman Empire, has preserved and made fruitful the philosophical intuitions of Socrates, Plato and Aristotle, borrowed from both Barbarians and the Byzantine Roman Empire—but always remains herself, thoroughly digesting all elements drawn from external sources...In her laws, her ceremonies, her festivals and her devotions, she makes use of local customs after purifying them and “baptizing” them.
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A quote from a famous Catholic Cardinal (bragged about here on FR about his brilliance)
“The use of temples, and these dedicated to particular saints, and ornamented on occasions with branches of trees; incense, lamps, and candles; votive offerings on recovery from illness; holy water; asylums; holydays and seasons, use of calendars, processions, blessings on the fields; sacerdotal vestments, the tonsure, the ring in marriage, turning to the East, images at a later date, perhaps the ecclesiastical chant, and the Kyrie Eleison are all of pagan origin, and sanctified by their adoption into the Church.” (An Essay on The Development of the Christian Doctrine
- John Henry ‘Cardinal Newman’ p.373)
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“It is interesting to note how often our Church has availed herself of practices which were in common use among pagans .. Thus it is true, in a certain sense, that some Catholic rites and ceremonies are a reproduction of those of pagan creeds.”
- The Externals of the Catholic Church, Her Government, Ceremonies, Festivals, Sacramentals and Devotions, by John F. Sullivan, p. 156, published by P.J. Kennedy, NY, 1942)
This volume was published for Catholic usage and is still available on Amazon
https://www.amazon.com/Externals-Catholic-Church-Reverend-Sullivan/dp/1785164554
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Cardinal Gibbons, Catholic Historian, in his book, Faith of our Fathers in the 1917 edition on page 106 says:
“The penetration of the religion of Babylon became so general and well known that Rome was called the New Babylon.”
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Having included these quotes from eminent Catholics that support this claim of paganism being incorporated into the church, I want to circle back to the only thing that matters.
It is far more important that a person come to saving faith in Christ - trusting HIM totally and Him alone for the payment of sin and for eternal life. Where you go to church on earth is secondary.
Salvation is only about Him, His sacrifice and our need to entrust ourselves to Him alone, by faith in Him alone to save us — to trust Him personally as our Lord and Savior.
There is no church that saves. Only Christ saves.
There is nothing we can do to earn salvation. Only entrusting ourselves by faith totally to Him saves.
Everything else is secondary. I wish eternal life for you.
Choose to place your entire trust on Him alone and have eternal life.
Nowhere do I denounce Scripture and there really is no reason to accuse. We were sharing the Gospel and some epistles.
I don’t find they support your argument. If nobody is saved until they die, then there aren’t any true believers, hence no Christians. Our God is a Living God and indwells believers who are saved. It is foolish to argue with those with that life.
Salvation is only about Him, His sacrifice and our need to entrust ourselves to Him alone, by faith in Him alone to save us — to trust Him personally as our Lord and Savior.
Amen bro. Nothing else matters, but Heaven or Hell
As far as all this idolatry goes, when then Navigator dudes presented me with the true gospel, idolatry was something that was NEVER mentioned, not even once.
I became born again, and over a period of time, the idolatry just worked its way out of my system. Now, correct me if I am wrong, but I believe idolatry, is anything that gets between me and my walk with God. It can be family, job, possessions, and a host of other things. So born again Christians STILL need to be on guard against worldly issues, that hinder their walk with God.
In the end, however, keeping people out of Hell, is the soul winner's motive.
“Amen bro. Nothing else matters, but Heaven or Hell”
+1
Amen, I believe it.
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>> “If nobody is saved until they die, then there aren’t any true believers” <<
That is nonsense.
You’re looking for an unconditional guarantee, and no such thing is offered.
The scriptures make it plain that the only path to eventual salvation is endurance in the faith Yehova offered in the covenant at the first Shavuot at Sinai.
His son came to revive it, and provide the promised perfect sacrifice.
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You popping in Roodian posts reminds me of that scene in Caddy Shack, of the Baby Ruth in the swimming pool, only it isn’t a candy bar in this case.
LOL, bastos.
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Shame on you MHG!
Of course it isn't offered. If it were offered, it would be a work in accepting the offer.
It's the call of the elect and how one responds which allows our faith to be efficacious for His gracious gift of salvation.
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You clearly have demonstrated that you have no grasp of what the term “works” means.
For example our acts of obedience to commandments are not works.
Works are human concoctions of actions that ‘should’ please Yehova (but never do). (for example the Pharisees Takanot and Ma’assim, or the Catholics Christmas, Lent, and Easter)
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