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To: af_vet_1981; MHGinTN; ealgeone; boatbums; Mark17
That's very creative, but:

you also have some people who hold to the teaching of [the] Nicolaitans. (v. 15)(New American Bible)

"Also" means "over and above" or "in addition to" and does not associate this additional doctrine with that antinomian one of Balaam, who taught adversaries to get the Israelites to sin against God.

but there is no description of what the works or teaching of the Nicolaitans is, nor why they should be hated.

Of course there is. It is right there in the word classifying the practice of the group. It is not the name of an Apostle-selected man of Godly disposition and life, never mentioned as being otherwise! You are simply repeating the same creation by the original priest-makers of a tale that directs the attention of their gullible followers away from the kind of organizational activity that Jesus hates: the effort to create a clergy class to psychologically and economically dominate those who have to earn a living to feed themselves and their children--who would become the "lay" class not encouraged to become spiritually mature enough to make and teach more disciples from their daily acquaintances, and thus preserving Jesus' Way of Life apart from interference of a clergy.

Why is it that you do not see that in appointing these deacons, The Apostles were NOT creating a class of priests, but of servants, of ministers, of stewards of the collection and distribution of necessary goods to the needy of Jerusalem.

My goodness! Though the Apostles were especially selected to inaugurate churches of Christ throughout Judea, and Samaria, even to the ends of the Earth, they were NOT to act as priests. They were NOT to even contemplate the humanistic kind of power-grabbing structure of inserting themselves as conduits through which one must go to get God's attention! They themselves were not, and never claimed to be priests! They knew that their Master hated the priests who were determined to kill Him! Though he permitted priests to influence the government to pin him to the Cross, His death showed how dastardly that kind of pernicious parasites the priesthood of Jewry was.

Is it not clear to you that the RCC and its stepdaughters Lutheran, Anglican, Episcopalian, Methodist all copy this hated domineering structure of two-class religions? And solidifying its hegemony by placing its center of power outside of, and untouchable by the members of its local churches?

Standing right in the middle of it, you tell me it doesn't exist? And you expect me or any thinking person to agree with you?

I'm flabbergasted by your boldness in maintaining an obviously untenable hypocritical thesis about "Nicolaitans".

Nicolaitans are those who form two-class religious societies, support them, and are officers of them, IMO.

The true priest is every member of a local, independent, autonomous assembly of believers, that baptizes professing born-anew professsors of faith in Christ, observes the Remembrance Supper regularly, preaches and teaches strong Bible doctrine, and keeps its practices clean by Scriptural church discipline. Its pro-tem offices are those appointed by concensus of the brethren.

That is who the real priests are. No nicolaitan priests need apply.

776 posted on 04/22/2017 7:11:19 PM PDT by imardmd1 (Fiat Lux)
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To: imardmd1
"Also" means "over and above" or "in addition to" and does not associate this additional doctrine with that ...

I did not equate them. Doctrine of Baalam and doctrine of Nicolas does not imply doctrine of Baalam equals doctrine of Nicolas. Your question about Nicolas being in Ephesus was incorrect. Pergamum, not Ephesus, had those who held the doctrine of Baalam and those who held the doctrine of the Nicolaitans.

Of course there is. It is right there in the word classifying the practice of the group.

Circular argument not borne out by the scriptures or tradition (except as an antiCatholic tradition)

Why is it that you do not see that in appointing these deacons, The Apostles were NOT creating a class of priests, ...

Deacons are not a class of priests. The scriptural type/analogy/model would be more like:
Israel => Levites => Cohenim (Priests)
with the deacons being more like Levites to assist the priests
779 posted on 04/22/2017 7:34:13 PM PDT by af_vet_1981 (The bus came by and I got on, That's when it all began.)
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To: imardmd1
They knew that their Master hated the priests who were determined to kill Him! Though he permitted priests to influence the government to pin him to the Cross, His death showed how dastardly that kind of pernicious parasites the priesthood of Jewry was.

The LORD Himself established the priesthood of Jewry, from the tribe of Levi, so your polemic is in error. The scripture says that a great company of the priests were obedient to the faith. Even when a priest was not obedient to the faith, the scripture shows the office was to be respected.

Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will perform that good thing which I have promised unto the house of Israel and to the house of Judah. In those days, and at that time, will I cause the Branch of righteousness to grow up unto David; and he shall execute judgment and righteousness in the land. In those days shall Judah be saved, and Jerusalem shall dwell safely: and this is the name wherewith she shall be called, The Lord our righteousness. For thus saith the Lord; David shall never want a man to sit upon the throne of the house of Israel; Neither shall the priests the Levites want a man before me to offer burnt offerings, and to kindle meat offerings, and to do sacrifice continually. And the word of the Lord came unto Jeremiah, saying, Thus saith the Lord; If ye can break my covenant of the day, and my covenant of the night, and that there should not be day and night in their season; Then may also my covenant be broken with David my servant, that he should not have a son to reign upon his throne; and with the Levites the priests, my ministers. As the host of heaven cannot be numbered, neither the sand of the sea measured: so will I multiply the seed of David my servant, and the Levites that minister unto me. Moreover the word of the Lord came to Jeremiah, saying, Considerest thou not what this people have spoken, saying, The two families which the Lord hath chosen, he hath even cast them off? thus they have despised my people, that they should be no more a nation before them. Thus saith the Lord; If my covenant be not with day and night, and if I have not appointed the ordinances of heaven and earth; Then will I cast away the seed of Jacob and David my servant, so that I will not take any of his seed to be rulers over the seed of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob: for I will cause their captivity to return, and have mercy on them.


And the word of God increased; and the number of the disciples multiplied in Jerusalem greatly; and a great company of the priests were obedient to the faith.


And Paul, earnestly beholding the council, said, Men and brethren, I have lived in all good conscience before God until this day. And the high priest Ananias commanded them that stood by him to smite him on the mouth. Then said Paul unto him, God shall smite thee, thou whited wall: for sittest thou to judge me after the law, and commandest me to be smitten contrary to the law? And they that stood by said, Revilest thou God's high priest? Then said Paul, I wist not, brethren, that he was the high priest: for it is written, Thou shalt not speak evil of the ruler of thy people.


Jeremiah, Catholic chapter thirty three, Protestant verses fourteen to twenty six,
Acts, Catholic chapter six, Protestant verse seven,
Acts, Catholic chapter twenty three, Protestant verses one to five,
as authorized, but not authored, by King James

781 posted on 04/22/2017 8:59:33 PM PDT by af_vet_1981 (The bus came by and I got on, That's when it all began.)
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