Posted on 12/21/2016 8:03:51 AM PST by DouglasKC
There's nothing wrong with traditions except where that tradition contradicts scripture. In that case the word of God is supreme.
The article you listed quoted ", "So then, brethren, stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or by letter" (2 Thess. 2:15)" and other verses to make the case that church can make traditions that supersede the word of God. However scripture is clear that Christ and the early Christians authority rested in what the scriptures revealed to them.
Some examples:
Joh 5:45 Do not think that I shall accuse you to the Father; there is one who accuses you—Moses, in whom you trust. Joh 5:46 For if you believed Moses, you would believe Me; for he wrote about Me.
Joh 5:47 But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe My words?"
Act_28:23 So when they had appointed him a day, many came to him at his lodging, to whom he explained and solemnly testified of the kingdom of God, persuading them concerning Jesus from both the Law of Moses and the Prophets, from morning till evening.
Paul used scripture, the same scripture that reveal God's holy days, to persuade people.
The Bereans as well didn't just swallow what Paul was saying, they wanted biblical proof:
Act 17:11 These were more fair-minded than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness, and searched the Scriptures daily to find out whether these things were so.
If the view of the Catholic church were correct Paul could have been preaching the flying spaghetti monster and no matter how much scripture contradicted it they would have to accept it if it was a tradition.
And finally:
2Ti 3:16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness,
2Ti 3:17 that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.
How can one use scripture for "reproof, correction and instruction" if it is NOT supreme to tradition?
It's an uphill battle for sure! It's always amazing to see that in these types of forums that the word of God itself is unassailable.
That's gonna leave a mark. You stabbed right in the ad hominem.
What day do you think Jesus kept? Thrall us with your ken.
Jesus kept the Jewish sabbath. The Christian sabbath need not be kept the same day. Jesus was the new covenant. New laws suggest the idea that new rules be adopted. Or that existing laws (like the keeping of the sabbath) be kept in a different way.
CC
Jesus was the new covenant. New laws suggest the idea that new rules be adopted. Or that existing laws (like the keeping of the sabbath) be kept in a different way.
They suggest it, huh? I need a little more than a suggestion to overturn when God writes something down in stone as a Commandment. So you admit Jesus kept the Sabbath and He was perfect but you don't want to do like Jesus You want to do your own thing. Jesus had a saying about that. If you love Me keep My Commandments. I think that was to establish who loved Jesus and those who loved the wide road of the world.
Yep, a viper pit. Merry Christmas. Have fun counting how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.
CC
Oh, had a little trouble getting the Word of God to justify the changing of His Sabbath. Don't worry, you're not the only one. I don't count angels on the head of a pin. And being the accuser of the brethren is a practice of Satan. Rev. 12:10
Hurry DouglasKC. (raising hand in the back row) "I know. I know". let me. let me.
Shush BBob. Let DouglasKC answer. You know it’s a trick question. It just needs to be answered in the correct manner.
New testament scripture, especially the book of Hebrews, makes it clear what has been changed under the new covenant. Boiling it down, the priesthood has changed from the Levitical priesthood to once in which Christ is the high priest. Most of that is discussed in Hebrews 7. Animal sacrifices have been changed to one in which the sacrifice of Christ is sufficient..this is discussed in depth in Hebrews 8,9 and 10. Since there was change in the priesthood all laws and ordinances related to the priesthood have been altered.
BUT the holy days of the Lord were NOT just part of the Levitical priesthood. They were not given to the priesthood but instead to the children of Israel (Lev 23:2). Various scriptures show they predate the old covenant and, according to scripture, will be observed and celebrated when Jesus Christ returns.
This is a rather large topic and I've only scratched the surface but we can discuss further if you would like.
So there is a tradition that holds some of The Law applies to the Gentiles but some of it does not. Does your tradition include the dietary laws ?
Actually you've got a wrong premise here. Gentiles have no part of parcel in the law, covenants or God's promises..including the new covenant. Gentiles do not know the God of the bible. Would you like to re-phrase the statement?
Have a nice life Bob.
CC
No, I'm a Christian. But I see that you're confused by my response so I'll explain.
Eph 2:11 Therefore remember that you, once Gentiles in the flesh—who are called Uncircumcision by what is called the Circumcision made in the flesh by hands—
Eph 2:12 that at that time you were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world.
Gentiles, those who were NOT part of the house of Israel or Judah, have no part in the covenants. They do not know God. This is confirmed in many places in scripture:
1Th 4:5 not in passion of lust, like the Gentiles who do not know God;
When one becomes a Christian they cease being a gentile. We become a Christian by accepting the terms of the new covenant through Christ our Lord. HOWEVER the new covenant is ONLY with the house of Israel and Judah:
Heb 8:6 But now He has obtained a more excellent ministry, inasmuch as He is also Mediator of a better covenant, which was established on better promises.
Heb 8:7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then no place would have been sought for a second.
Heb 8:8 Because finding fault with them, He says:
"BEHOLD, THE DAYS ARE COMING, SAYS THE LORD, WHEN I WILL MAKE A NEW COVENANT WITH THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL AND WITH THE HOUSE OF JUDAH—
Heb 8:9 NOT ACCORDING TO THE COVENANT THAT I MADE WITH THEIR FATHERS IN THE DAY WHEN I TOOK THEM BY THE HAND TO LEAD THEM OUT OF THE LAND OF EGYPT; BECAUSE THEY DID NOT CONTINUE IN MY COVENANT, AND I DISREGARDED THEM, SAYS THE LORD.
Heb 8:10 FOR THIS IS THE COVENANT THAT I WILL MAKE WITH THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL AFTER THOSE DAYS, SAYS THE LORD: I WILL PUT MY LAWS IN THEIR MIND AND WRITE THEM ON THEIR HEARTS; AND I WILL BE THEIR GOD, AND THEY SHALL BE MY PEOPLE.
Note that Paul is quoting Jeremiah 31:31-33. So both the old testament and new testament agree that the NEW COVENANT is only made with the house of Israel or the house of Judah.
When we come to Christ we join ourselves to Israel through Christ and become partakers of the covenants and promises given to Israel.
Eph_2:13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.
So that's what I meant when I said that gentiles have no part or parcel of any covenants or promises of God. By biblical definition Gentiles are not Christian and do not worship Christ since they have no part in the new covenant.
With that in mind would you like to re-phrase your statement?
And you are a name caller. He has rejected that offensive label.
There are traditions as to which laws in the Old Testament apply to Christians, especially Gentile Christians, and which are non binding on them.
Those were abolished by Christ. Eph. 2:15 and nailed to the Cross Col. 2:14 Hallelujah!
Which day of the week to meet with other Christians in worship service to God is part of these traditions.
They met all days of the week they could. However they kept the Sabbath Day holy as God has directed. Otherwise "They worship Me in vain; they teach as doctrine the precepts of men. You have disregarded the commandment of God to keep the tradition of men.” Mark 7:7,8
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