Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

To: Elsie
Please allow me to give you some quick and necessary perspective on a topic you may have neglected: namely, post-13th-century Catholicism.

God requires of us not only faith in Jesus Christ our Savior, but also adherence to His law, so far as the person knows it. This includes being a member of His Church. Why? Because one is saved precisely by being incorporated into the Body of Christ. We are saved if we are in Christ.

We find in the Popes and the Fathers of the Church two kinds of assertions, very often by the same writers. One kind speaks strongly about the need of Church membership; the other expresses a remarkably broad view of what membership consists in.

How to reconcile the two kinds of assertions? Pope Boniface VIII in his famous "Unam sanctam" (1302) spoke strongly: "Outside of which (the Church) there is neither salvation nor remission of sins. . . . But we declare, state and define that to be subject to the Roman Pontiff is altogether necessary for salvation."

But other Magisterium texts repeatedly assert that being "in Christ" is a broader thing than formal Church membership: they speak of even Moses and the Prophets being "in Christ" because they loved Him inasmuch as they had seen Him "from afar" and, in a real though fragmentary way, served Him under the impulse of the Holy Spirit.

Authoritative Magisterial texts also say that no one will be blamed for not being visibly in the Catholic Church if they lacked the needed knowledge, or even the possibility, to enter the Church and to remain in her..

Thus Pius IX, in "Quanto conficiamur moerore" (1863) taught:

"God, in His supreme goodness and clemency, by no means allows anyone to be punished with eternal punishments who does not have the guilt of voluntary fault."

Pius IX does not deny the obligation to formally enter the Church if one knows the truth --- but he still says that if one keeps the moral law as he knows it, somehow the other requirements will be met --- though the Pope does not explain how. In the same document, he uses the words “contumacious” and “obstinate" to clarify that only those who intentionally, knowingly and culpably reject the Church are condemned. That is, they have to do so with the knowledge that they are rejecting something founded by Christ for their salvation.

On August 9, 1949, the Holy Office, citing the teaching of Pius XII in his Mystical Body Encyclical condemned the error of an American priest, Leonard Feeney, who held that those who failed to enter the Church formally, even with no fault of their own, could not reach salvation. The decree says:

"It is not always required that one be actually ncorporated as a member of the Church, but this at least is required: that one adhere to it in wish and desire. It is not always necessary that this be explicit. But when a man labors under invincible ignorance, God accepts even an implicit will, called by that name because it is contained in the good disposition of soul in which a man wills to conform his will to the will of God."

Pius XII had said that a man can be "ordered to” (meaning, pointed towards and even conformed to) the Church by a certain desire and wish of which he is not aware (inscio quodam desiderio ac voto), that is, the one contained in the good dispositions mentioned by the Holy Office.

406 posted on 06/09/2016 4:42:55 PM PDT by Mrs. Don-o ("The riddles of God are more satisfying than the solutions of man." - G.K. Chesterton)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 404 | View Replies ]


To: Mrs. Don-o
God requires of us not only faith in Jesus Christ our Savior, but also adherence to His law, so far as the person knows it.

Oh?

This is taught to Catholics?

HMMMmmm...


I'v e always wondered why Jesus FAILED to mention it when He was asked a DIRECT question by some fellas...

John 6:28-29

Then they asked him, “What must we do to do the works God requires?”

Jesus answered, “The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent.”

 

 

OF course; there'll be some who will cry: "Out of context!!!"

 

I Am the Bread of Life

22 On the next day the crowd that remained on the other side of the sea saw that there had been only one boat there, and that Jesus had not entered the boat with his disciples, but that his disciples had gone away alone. 23 Other boats from Tiberias came near the place where they had eaten the bread after the Lord had given thanks. 24 So when the crowd saw that Jesus was not there, nor his disciples, they themselves got into the boats and went to Capernaum, seeking Jesus.

25 When they found him on the other side of the sea, they said to him, “Rabbi, when did you come here?” 26 Jesus answered them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, you are seeking me, not because you saw signs, but because you ate your fill of the loaves. 27 Do not work for the food that perishes, but for the food that endures to eternal life, which the Son of Man will give to you. For on him God the Father has set his seal.” 28 Then they said to him, “What must we do, to be doing the works of God?” 29 Jesus answered them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in him whom he has sent.” 30 So they said to him, “Then what sign do you do, that we may see and believe you? What work do you perform? 31 Our fathers ate the manna in the wilderness; as it is written, ‘He gave them bread from heaven to eat.’” 32 Jesus then said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, it was not Moses who gave you the bread from heaven, but my Father gives you the true bread from heaven. 33 For the bread of God is he who comes down from heaven and gives life to the world.” 34 They said to him, “Sir, give us this bread always.”

35 Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life; whoever comes to me shall not hunger, and whoever believes in me shall never thirst. 36 But I said to you that you have seen me and yet do not believe. 37 All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out. 38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me. 39 And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day. 40 For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.”

41 So the Jews grumbled about him, because he said, I am the bread that came down from heaven.” 42 They said, “Is not this Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? How does he now say, ‘I have come down from heaven’?” 43 Jesus answered them, “Do not grumble among yourselves. 44 No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day. 45 It is written in the Prophets, ‘And they will all be taught by God.’ Everyone who has heard and learned from the Father comes to me— 46 not that anyone has seen the Father except he who is from God; he has seen the Father. 47 Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever believes has eternal life. 48 I am the bread of life. 49 Your fathers ate the manna in the wilderness, and they died. 50 This is the bread that comes down from heaven, so that one may eat of it and not die. 51 I am the living bread that came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever. And the bread that I will give for the life of the world is my flesh.”

52 The Jews then disputed among themselves, saying, “How can this man give us his flesh to eat?” 53 So Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. 54 Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day. 55 For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink. 56 Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him. 57 As the living Father sent me, and I live because of the Father, so whoever feeds on me, he also will live because of me. 58 This is the bread that came down from heaven, not like the bread[c] the fathers ate, and died. Whoever feeds on this bread will live forever.” 59 Jesus[d] said these things in the synagogue, as he taught at Capernaum.

408 posted on 06/10/2016 4:02:37 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 406 | View Replies ]

To: Mrs. Don-o
God requires of us not only faith in Jesus Christ our Savior, but also adherence to His law, so far as the person knows it.

Since you seem to understand that GOD requires certain things; let's see what the book that Rome assembled has to say about requirements...



 
James 1:27
Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world.
 

 
1 John 3:21-23
Dear friends, if our hearts do not condemn us, we have confidence before God and receive from him anything we ask, because we keep his commands and do what pleases him.
And this is his command: to believe in the name of his Son, Jesus Christ, and to love one another as he commanded us.
 

 
Micah 6:8
He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the LORD require of you?
To act justly and to love mercy and to walk humbly with your God.


 
John 6:28-29
Then they asked him, "What must we do to do the works God requires?
 Jesus answered, "The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent."

 

 
 
 

409 posted on 06/10/2016 4:06:43 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 406 | View Replies ]

To: Mrs. Don-o; teppe; StormPrepper; Normandy
Pope Boniface VIII in his famous "Unam sanctam" (1302) spoke strongly: "Outside of which (the Church) there is neither salvation nor remission of sins. . . . But we declare, state and define that to be subject to the Roman Pontiff is altogether necessary for salvation."

So THIS is where Mormons got it from!!!



 


In conclusion let us summarize this grand key, these “Fourteen Fundamentals in Following the Prophet”, for our salvation depends on them.


1. The prophet is the only man who speaks for the Lord in everything.
2. The living prophet is more vital to us than the standard works.
3. The living prophet is more important to us than a dead prophet.
4. The prophet will never lead the church astray.
5. The prophet is not required to have any particular earthly training or credentials to speak on any subject or act on any matter at any time.
6. The prophet does not have to say “Thus Saith the Lord,” to give us scripture.
7. The prophet tells us what we need to know, not always what we want to know.
8. The prophet is not limited by men’s reasoning.
9. The prophet can receive revelation on any matter, temporal or spiritual.
10. The prophet may advise on civic matters.
11. The two groups who have the greatest difficulty in following the prophet are the proud who are learned and the proud who are rich.
12. The prophet will not necessarily be popular with the world or the worldly.
13. The prophet and his counselors make up the First Presidency—the highest quorum in the Church.
14. The prophet and the presidency—the living prophet and the First Presidency—follow them and be blessed—reject them and suffer.

I testify that these fourteen fundamentals in following the living prophet are true. If we want to know how well we stand with the Lord then let us ask ourselves how well we stand with His mortal captain—how close do our lives harmonize with the Lord’s anointed—the living Prophet—President of the Church, and with the Quorum of the First Presidency.

Ezra Taft Benson

(Address given Tuesday, February 26, 1980 at Brigham Young University)     http://www.lds.org/liahona/1981/06/fourteen-fundamentals-in-following-the-prophet?lang=eng

411 posted on 06/10/2016 4:12:58 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 406 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson