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To: Elsie; Mrs. Don-o
Blessed Mary is described as being the Great Sign, the Queen in the heavens;
I know you Catholics are TAUGHT this; but it sure would be a bit easier to swallow if something; just ANYTHING had been written about Mary after John took her in; other than this stretch of the Word by Rome.

I think what is lost in all of this is that by the time John penned the book of Revelation that Mary had long been expired. The chapter of Rev. 12 was more about the future of the Church as signified by a woman than any person. This is consistent with the symbolism of a pure woman being a church with pure doctrine and a harlot being a church with polluted doctrine.

125 posted on 05/26/2016 9:01:51 AM PDT by BipolarBob (I'm so open minded that you should only think like me.)
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To: BipolarBob

Below is a good reminder of the dangers of memorials and images. They start out with great intentions but are soon perverted. I would encourage the reading of the total story of Gideon to put it in perspective.

Jdg 8:27 Gideon made a sacred ephod from the gold and put it in Ophrah, his hometown. But soon all the Israelites prostituted themselves by worshiping it, and it became a trap for Gideon and his family.


127 posted on 05/26/2016 9:09:04 AM PDT by PeterPrinciple (Thinking Caps are no longer being issued but there must be a warehouse full of them somewhere.)
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To: BipolarBob
It's a principle of Scriptural interpretation-- observed by all exegetes, not just by Catholics, though if this is not the case, please tell me --- that the understanding of an obscure or symbolic passage has to start with the literal meaning. You start with the literal meaning, then work from there to other senses of the text: the allegorical, the moral, the anagogical, etc.

Another important principle, shared by all of us, I think, is that you use Scripture to interpret Scripture. Though presented in the words of many human authors, Scripture is essentially one work with one Divine Author. So you can go from cover to cover, from Genesis 1 to the last words of Revelation, to find the full dimensions, the depths and heights, the ramifications and implications of the particular passage you are studying.

We're agreed on this, I think?

OK, as for Revelation 12: It's not just "the Catholic Church" that says this is a Great Sign: the passage itself says its a Great Sign. The passage itself says this is the Mother of the Messiah (because he Son, the one who "rules the nations with an iron rod" is identified as the Messiah in Psalms 2; the one "snatched up to God and to His throne" is likewise Jesus, and is an image of His ascension.) All his fortifies the identification of the woman of the Great Sign with Mary, since as we know from the Gospels, she is the mother of Jesus.

A third image is that this Woman of the Sign, and the Dragon, are enemies. This sends us back to Genesis 3, where we read that God said to the Serpent, Satan, that the woman's seed would crush his head. It is Jesus Christ, the Incarnate Word, who ultimately cruses Satan and is the victor over sin and death. Once again we have the woman identified as Mary, since she is the mother of the Incarnate Word: Christ is her offsprng, the seed of the woman.

Interestingly, the passage refers to "the seed of the woman," but not to the "seed of the man." This is the earliest trace of the prophecy of the virgin birth.

This is the symbolic and moral interpretation of the images in Revelation 12. There's yet more levels of meaning: there's the sense in which this Great Sign, this woman, this virgin mother of the Messiah, is also Daughter Zion, which is to say the people of Israel; and Lady Ecclesia, which is to say the Church.

I think you'll agree that Biblical symbolic language is often multivalent: it can have different layers of meaning that become apparent only at different historic epochs. The Bible makes tremendous use of polysemy, the coexistence of many valid meanings --- usually related, overlapping meanings --- for a word or phrase.

129 posted on 05/26/2016 11:13:40 AM PDT by Mrs. Don-o (Our blessed Mother, Mary: "All generations will call me blessed.")
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