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What Does Faith Look Like?
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Posted on 08/25/2015 8:14:25 AM PDT by LearsFool

Perhaps that seems like a strange question. Can we see faith? You decide.

- Noah built the ark by faith (Heb. 11:7). What did the people without faith do?

- Rahab hid the spies by faith (Heb. 11:31). If she hadn't had faith, wouldn't she have turned them in instead? Did the people hunting for the spies have faith?

- Abraham left his home and went where God led him, not even knowing where he was going, because he had faith (Heb. 11:8-9). If he hadn't had faith, would he have gone or stayed home?

It is faith that causes us to do what the Lord tells us. We do it without asking - and often without being told - why He want us to do it. We do it because He said so. The servant doesn't ask his lord "Why?" He just does it. The disciple doesn't demand an explanation from his master, he just submits and obeys. That's what faith looks like.

"But we want answers!" Sometimes we develop a stubborn streak, and refuse to do as we're told until somebody explains it and we're convinced it's necessary, beneficial, whatever. But when we do this, who are we obeying? Not Jesus, but ourselves. The servant of Jesus doesn't say, "Explain it to me, Lord, and then I'll do it."

No, instead he says, "Command it, Lord, and I'll obey." This was the attitude of 3000 people on Pentecost, who asked, "What shall we do?" When the Lord through Peter commanded repentance and baptism, 3000 submitted to Christ's authority and obeyed.

"Then those who gladly received his word were baptized; and that day about three thousand souls were added to them." - Acts 2:41

What about those who rejected his word? Yes, some refused to submit to Christ's authority, just as some refuse to submit now. Rather than bow before this King, they bray and kick like stubborn mules against the Lord's authority and commands. Though they claim to have faith, their "faith" is actually no faith at all. This is why Jesus could sort hearers of the gospel into two groups in Mark 16:16...

1. "He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;
2. "but he that disbelieveth shall be condemned."

Why is there no third group - "he that believeth but won't be baptized"? Because Jesus knew that only disbelievers will disobey. Believers will obey.

Which group are you in?


TOPICS: General Discusssion
KEYWORDS: discipleship; faith; unbelief
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To: LearsFool

Read the Letter of James. You will find your answer there.


21 posted on 08/25/2015 3:19:25 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: LearsFool

***Gentiles are candidates for salvation on the same basis as Jews.***

No, you got it backwards. Cornelius was saved when the Holy Spirit fell on him. Baptism came later.

To the Jew, believe, baptized, filled with Holy Spirit.

Samaritan, Believe baptized, Holy Spirit when later apostles laid hands on them.

Gentile, Believe, Holy Spirit fell on them BEFORE baptism.

So the Gentiles were saved BEFORE they were baptized, which most Evangelical churches teach today.


22 posted on 08/25/2015 3:31:02 PM PDT by Ruy Dias de Bivar (Never trust anyone who promotes "sensible" gun control laws!)
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To: Ruy Dias de Bivar
Cornelius was saved when the Holy Spirit fell on him.

That's not in the Bible. Once again, that's merely your version.

So the Gentiles were saved BEFORE they were baptized, which most Evangelical churches teach today.

Okay, maybe it's not merely your version. Maybe it's what you've been taught and can't turn loose of.

Few people are able to abandon all and cling only to the Lord. They have family and friends and upbringing and other pressures holding them back. They're not worthy to be Christ's disciples (Mt. 10:34-38, Lk. 14:26-33, etc.). They're in His second group.
23 posted on 08/25/2015 5:07:23 PM PDT by LearsFool (Real men get their wives and children to heaven.)
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To: Ruy Dias de Bivar
I phrased that last part poorly. I should've said:

MOST have family and friends and upbringing and other pressures holding them back. They're not worthy to be Christ's disciples (Mt. 10:34-38, Lk. 14:26-33, etc.). They're in His second group.
24 posted on 08/25/2015 5:13:21 PM PDT by LearsFool (Real men get their wives and children to heaven.)
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To: LearsFool

“Cornelius was saved when the Holy Spirit fell on him.”

***That’s not in the Bible. Once again, that’s merely your version.***

Oh yeah? HERE is how Cornelius was saved!

Ephesians 1:13King James Version (KJV)

13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

Eph 2
4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,

5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)

6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

And WHAT has quickened us? The Holy Spirit which Cornelius received BEFORE he was baptized.

Ephesians 4:30King James Version (KJV)

30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

Again, Cornelius and family had it BEFORE he was baptized.


25 posted on 08/25/2015 6:33:07 PM PDT by Ruy Dias de Bivar (Never trust anyone who promotes "sensible" gun control laws!)
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To: Ruy Dias de Bivar
We know more about the salvation of the Ephesians than Paul mentions in his letter. (After all, they already knew how they had been saved, didn't they?) And what we know gives us a complete picture of the gospel - more complete than we get from selective quotations. When we read more of the Bible, we're immunized against false doctrine.

"And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper country came to Ephesus, and found certain disciples: and he said unto them, Did ye receive the Holy Spirit when ye believed?

And they said unto him, Nay, we did not so much as hear whether the Holy Spirit was given.

And he said, Into what then were ye baptized? And they said, Into John's baptism.

And Paul said, John baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people that they should believe on him that should come after him, that is, on Jesus.

And when they heard this, they were baptized into the name of the Lord Jesus.

And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Spirit came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied."
- Acts 19:1-6

So there we have it. God quickened them (brought them to life) the same way He did everyone else, and still does.

We have here the same gospel Jesus instructed His apostles to teach. The same gospel Peter taught on Pentecost. The same gospel taught all through the Scriptures.

Quite different from the perverted one so often taught by false teachers, which leads people into the Lord's second group doomed to damnation. Much better to join the first group, as these Ephesians did, by simply believing the Lord and being baptized so that we can be saved, isn't it?

But apparently salvation requires more than some people are willing to do. After all that God, His Son, and His Holy Spirit have done, some still insist on rejecting the gospel. God will deal with these unbelievers.

Others insist on leading astray those seeking to serve the King. I wouldn't want to be in their shoes.

"And whosoever shall cause one of these little ones that believe on me to stumble, it were better for him if a great millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea." - Mk. 9:42
26 posted on 08/25/2015 7:45:51 PM PDT by LearsFool (Real men get their wives and children to heaven.)
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To: LearsFool

You are reading something into it that is not there.

These Jews were ALREADY BELIEVERS. Paul recognized them as such.
He merely asks “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?” and they said no because they did not know if the Holy spirit had come yet.

What was John’s baptism to the Jews? The baptism of repentance for THE REMISSION OF SIN. and they were to look for the one to come after him who would baptize them with the Holy Spirit.

So why would they need to be rebaptized since they had already been baptized by JOHN?

In an old commentary and study bible printed in England over a hundred twenty five years ago I found the answer, they weren’t.

This is the way this verse is in our bibles.

And Paul said, “John baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people that they should believe on him that should come after him, that is, on Jesus.”

And when they heard this, they were baptized into the name of the Lord Jesus.

This is the way the old English commentary and bible has it printed. Note the quotation marks.

And Paul said, “John baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people that they should believe on him that should come after him, that is, on Jesus. And when they heard this, they (who heard John speak) were baptized into the name of the Lord Jesus.”

The Englishman’s Greek texts has it a little different, “And having heard they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.”
And in the ancient Greek texts those sentences are run together without gaps or punctuation.

This would mean that those men who heard Paul were not rebaptized, no need for it, but merely had hands laid on them.

Of course, most churches teach the opposite, but being rebaptized makes no sense except to an immersionist.


27 posted on 08/26/2015 8:46:04 AM PDT by Ruy Dias de Bivar
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To: Ruy Dias de Bivar

Huh? They went to John to be baptized by him, who then told them to believe on the One to come afterward, and then he baptized them again?

Seriously? You go digging through the archives for this stuff as a way around the plain teaching of the Scriptures?

See ya ‘round.


28 posted on 08/26/2015 1:54:33 PM PDT by LearsFool (Real men get their wives and children to heaven.)
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To: LearsFool

***who then told them to believe on the One to come afterward, and then he baptized them again?***

Not paying attention are you. John baptized them telling them to look for the one coming after him. Then he proclaimed JESUS as the one he told them about.

29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

30 This is he of whom I said, After me cometh a man which is preferred before me: for he was before me.

So why did PAUL have to rebaptize them? Again I don’t believe he did as I’ve shown.

Both Zondervan and Kreigel publishing houses have commentaries that say Paul did not rebaptize them.

But then, they are not Campbellite publishing houses.


29 posted on 08/26/2015 4:56:35 PM PDT by Ruy Dias de Bivar
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