Replies

Protestantism = protest against Catholic Church

Regardless of what individual protestants believe, Protestantism was the result of the Reformation which came about in protest of the Catholic Church.

Yes, Protestants in their many forms are against us. So, in this case, the Bible verse posted above doesn’t apply because Protestants are against us, not with us.

There is nothing more for us to say because it is that black and white.

Yes, Protestants in their many forms are against us.

Golly; I wonder WHY???

Pope Stephen VI (896–897), who had his predecessor Pope Formosus exhumed, tried, de-fingered, briefly reburied, and thrown in the Tiber.^[1]

Pope John XII (955–964), who gave land to a mistress, murdered several people, and was killed by a man who caught him in bed with his wife.

Pope Benedict IX (1032–1044, 1045, 1047–1048), who "sold" the Papacy

Pope Boniface VIII (1294–1303), who is lampooned in Dante's Divine Comedy

Pope Urban VI (1378–1389), who complained that he did not hear enough screaming when Cardinals who had conspired against him were tortured.^[2]

Pope Alexander VI (1492–1503), a Borgia, who was guilty of nepotism and whose unattended corpse swelled until it could barely fit in a coffin.^[3]

Pope Leo X (1513–1521), a spendthrift member of the Medici family who once spent 1/7 of his predecessors' reserves on a single ceremony^[4]

Pope Clement VII (1523–1534), also a Medici, whose power-politicking with France, Spain, and Germany got Rome sacked.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bad_Popes

Yes, Protestants in their many forms are against us. So, in this case, the Bible verse poste

d above doesn’t apply because Protestants are against us, not with us.

It does indeed apply, as like the apostles, traditional (vs. V2) Catholicism wrongly holds that one cannot validly do ministry in the name of the Lord without their sanction, while Christ said such are for Him. Thus the latter are for Christ, while the sectarian Rome is against Him.

Anyone who does ministry in the name of the Lord as the one whom the apostles reproved, is indeed against elitist Rome, as they are against Christ in this.

It is not complicated at all, but it is expected that RCs will not admit it.

Protestantism was the result of the Reformation which came about in protest of the Catholic Church.

Actually, the word "protest" entered the conversation on political grounds more than theological, though the two were intertwined:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protestation_at_Speyer

In short form, the free princes of Germany were promised in 1526 a relaxation of the persecution they were undergoing from the Holy Roman Empire, but that promise was rescinded three years later. In prospect of losing their freedom to worship as Lutherans, they issued a protest against the decision of the majority to resume the persecution. From thence their detractors called them the "protestants," and I would have been glad to be among them. Bringing the temporal forces of government against religious minorities, even those which might be in error, is not how Jesus taught His apostles to advance the Gospel.

Furthermore, if one does not accept the principle of religious freedom, why be on a conservative political website like FreeRepublic at all? Don't we spend a sizable chuck of bandwidth "protesting" our loss of freedom, both religious and otherwise? Don't we consider that generally a healthy thing to do, not let tyrants rule over us? Our rights, after all, are grounded in our mutual recognition that we are all made in the image of God, that our Creator has granted us these rights, and we hold them and fight for them against anyone but Him. This applies even if we are in error, so long as that error does not cross the line of the civil and criminal law as illuminated by the natural law. So we are free to have any idea of the body and blood of Christ, and we answer only to God, whether we have been faithful to Him or not. But no one in the temporal power has the right to do us harm over it. Only if we were, for example, to follow a religion that encouraged murder or fraud, would we expect to be curt short in those pursuits.

And so the "protest" in Germany was for religious freedom, and against the conduct of violence against those who did not deserve such uncivil treatment. It would be interesting to observe how many here, that always come to these online debates because they are soft, easy, safe things, I wonder which side of the line people would cross to. I am not a Lutheran, though we do have much in common, but I have no doubt I would have stood with the German princes for freedom. If that makes me a "protester," so be it. Make mine loud and strong.

Peace,

SR