Replies

So in the two descriptions of Paul's experience, the Greek word akuo, to hear, could in one case be emphasizing that they heard something but didn't know what it was, and as Paul described it later, he uses akuo to make it clear they didn't hear the sound with any understanding. No contradiction in affirmed fact.

You've proven my point for me. The fact that you have to go to another language to find your meaning, proves that the Bible as it is delivered today is not perfect and can't be read singly and lead the reader to the correct understanding.

But we're an agreement with that point, you do need to seek other text, other than the Bible to get the correct understanding of it's teachings.

You've proven my point for me. The fact that you have to go to another language to find your meaning, proves that the Bible as it is delivered today is not perfect and can't be read singly and lead the reader to the correct understanding.

False, as you are presenting a straw man fallacy. Actually two for the price of one:

1) No one is arguing that knowledge of language is unnecessary to understand language. That is utter nonsense.

2) No one (except the KJV Onlyists) is arguing that every or any translation is inspired, not in the sense of the original writing, God-breathed. I've done some amateur translating of my own. I would never present that as inspired and authoritative except as verified against the original.

The truth on the ground is that everyone who wants to know about God and sin and salvation in Jesus Christ can find it in the pages of Scripture in almost any translation you can imagine. I've looked at the typical translation variances between many them, and have never found anything, not one thing, that substantially changed the message from the original. Probably the biggest issues are some minor problems with semantic drift, where you have an old translation like the KJV using archaic expressions, or bigger problems like translations customized for a specific group, such as the NWT, which was crafted specifically to support the false prophet CT Russell (JWs). But among the good translations, imperfect though they may be, the flawless original shines through so well that they are sufficient to present a person with the whole of the Gospel message, and everything they need to live godly lives, just as Paul said in 1 Timothy 3:14-17. Nobody needs to know Greek to know what God is saying to a certainty.

So it is a mistake to point to an implied dependency like language and extrapolate from that to the necessity of an alternate proposed revelation. The testimony of the first revelation was that it was sufficient for the purposes intended, including knowing the fullness of the Gospel and the means of living godly, and if that assertion is true then no subsequent revelation can countermand it and those that purport to fill in missing "Gospel essentials" should be held as suspect, just as the early Gnostic writings rightly were, of issuing from antichrist spirits in the world.

Likewise it is a mistake to point to a relatively small and well know set of imperfections and suggest they defeat the entire purpose of knowing anything about the message in the original. That is 1) a fallacy of appealing to extremes that are untrue, and 2) a fallacy of ignoring game-changing facts, such as the unstoppable power of God to get His message anywhere He wants to get it.

Peace,

SR

But we're an agreement with that point, you do need to seek other text, other than the Bible to get the correct understanding of it's teachings.

Well; we are STILL awaiting your posting of the Inspired Versions corrections.

Quit beating around the bush.

But we're an agreement with that point, you do need to seek other text, other than the Bible to get the correct understanding of it's teachings.

Here are a couple of MORMON sources.

SURELY they are accurate and similar in tought!

Trinity:

found in the Book of MORMON ----------- rejected in the Doctrines and Covenants

Book of Mormon:

Now Zeezrom said: Is there more than one God? And he answered, No. (Alma 11:28-29)

...and be arraigned before the bar of Christ the Son, and God the Father, and the Holy Spirit, which is one Eternal God, to be judged according to their works, whether they be good or whether they be evil. (Alma 11:44)

...doctrine of Christ, and the only and true doctrine of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost, which is one God, without end. Amen. (2 Nephi 31:21)

...praises with the choirs above, unto the Father, and unto the Son, and unto the Holy Ghost, which are one God, in a state of happiness which hath no end. (Mormon 7:7)

...power of God; and the Son, because of the flesh; thus becoming the Father and Son--And they are one God, yea, the very Eternal Father of heaven and of earth. And thus the flesh becoming subject to the Spirit, or the Son to the Father, being one God, (Mosiah 15:3-5)

...of Jared, that whoso should possess this land of promise, from that time henceforth and forever, should serve him, the true and only God, or they should be swept off when the fulness of his wrath should come upon them. (Ether 2:8)

"Behold, I am Jesus Christ the Son of God. I created the heavens and the earth, and all things that in them are. I was with the Father from the beginning. I am in the Father, and the Father in me; and in me hath the Father glorified his name." (3 Nephi 9:15)

"And again the Lord called others, and said unto them likewise; and he gave unto them power to baptize. And he said unto them: On this wise shall ye baptize; and there shall be no disputations among you. Verily I say unto you, that whoso repenteth of his sins through your words and desireth to be baptized in my name, on this wise shall ye baptize them--Behold, ye shall go down and stand in the water, and in my name shall ye baptize them. And now behold, these are the words which ye shall say, calling them by name, saying: Having authority given me of Jesus Christ, I baptize you in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. Amen. And then shall ye immerse them in the water, and come forth again out of the water. And after this manner shall ye baptize in my name; for behold, verily I say unto you, that the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Ghost are one; and I am in the Father, and the Father in me, and the Father and I are one...And thus will the Father bear record of me, and the Holy Ghost will bear record unto him of the Father and me; for the Father, and I, and the Holy Ghost are one." (3 Nephi 11:22-27, 36)

Doctrine and Covenants:

According to that which was ordained in the midst of the Council of the Eternal God of all other gods before this world was, that should be reserved unto the finishing and the end thereof, when every man shall enter into his eternal presence and into his immortal rest. (Section 121:32)

And again, verily I say unto you, if a man marry a wife, and make a covenant with her for time and for all eternity, if that covenant is not by me or by my word, which is my law, and is not sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise, through him whom I have anointed and appointed unto this power, then it is not valid neither of force when they are out of the world, because they are not joined by me, saith the Lord, neither by my word; when they are out of the world it cannot be received there, because the angels and the gods are appointed there, by whom they cannot pass; they cannot, therefore, inherit my glory; for my house is a house of order, saith the Lord God. And again, verily I say unto you, if a man marry a wife by my word, which is my law, and by the new and everlasting covenant, and it is sealed unto them by the Holy Spirit of promise, by him who is anointed, unto whom I have appointed this power and the keys of this priesthood; and it shall be said unto them--Ye shall come forth in the first resurrection; and if it be after the first resurrection, in the next resurrection; and shall inherit thrones, kingdoms, principalities, and powers, dominions, all heights and depths--then shall it be written in the Lamb's Book of Life, that he shall commit no murder whereby to shed innocent blood, and if ye abide in my covenant, and commit no murder whereby to shed innocent blood, it shall be done unto them in all things whatsoever my servant hath put upon them, in time, and through all eternity; and shall be of full force when they are out of the world; and they shall pass by the angels, and the gods, which are set there, to their exaltation and glory in all things, as hath been sealed upon their heads, which glory shall be a fulness and a continuation of the seeds forever and ever. Then shall they be gods, because they have no end; therefore shall they be from everlasting to everlasting, because they continue; then shall they be above all, because all things are subject unto them. Then shall they be gods, because they have all power, and the angels are subject unto them. (Section 132:18-20)

Abraham received concubines, and they bore him children; and it was accounted unto him for righteousness, because they were given unto him, and he abode in my law; as Isaac also and Jacob did none other things than that which they were commanded; and because they did none other things than that which they were commanded, they have entered into their exaltation, according to the promises, and sit upon thrones, and are not angels but are gods. (Section 132:37)