Posted on 01/21/2015 4:47:04 PM PST by RnMomof7
As a church history professor, I am sometimes asked how certain practices developed in church history. For example: When did the Roman Catholic (and Eastern Orthodox) emphasis on praying to saints and venerating relics and icons begin?
A somewhat obscure, but extremely helpful, book by John Calvin answers that question directly.
In his work, A Treatise on Relics, Calvin utilizes his extensive knowledge of church history to demonstrate that prayers to the saints, prayers for the dead, the veneration of relics, the lighting of candles (in homage to the saints), and the veneration of icons are all rooted in Roman paganism. Such practices infiltrated the Christian church after Christianity became the official religion of the Roman Empire in the fourth century.
Here is an excerpt from Calvin’s work that summarizes his thesis:
Hero-worship is innate to human nature, and it is founded on some of our noblest feelings, — gratitude, love, and admiration, — but which, like all other feelings, when uncontrolled by principle and reason, may easily degenerate into the wildest exaggerations, and lead to most dangerous consequences. It was by such an exaggeration of these noble feelings that [Roman] Paganism filled the Olympus with gods and demigods, — elevating to this rank men who have often deserved the gratitude of their fellow-creatures, by some signal services rendered to the community, or their admiration, by having performed some deeds which required a more than usual degree of mental and physical powers.
The same cause obtained for the Christian martyrs the gratitude and admiration of their fellow-Christians, and finally converted them into a kind of demigods. This was more particularly the case when the church began to be corrupted by her compromise with Paganism [during the fourth and fifth-centuries], which having been baptized without being converted, rapidly introduced into the Christian church, not only many of its rites and ceremonies, but even its polytheism, with this difference, that the divinities of Greece and Rome were replaced by Christian saints, many of whom received the offices of their Pagan predecessors.
The church in the beginning tolerated these abuses, as a temporary evil, but was afterwards unable to remove them; and they became so strong, particularly during the prevailing ignorance of the middle ages, that the church ended up legalizing, through her decrees, that at which she did nothing but wink at first.
In a footnote, Calvin gives specific examples of how Christians saints simply became substitutes for pagan deities.
Thus St. Anthony of Padua restores, like Mercury, stolen property; St. Hubert, like Diana, is the patron of sportsmen; St. Cosmas, like Esculapius, that of physicians, etc. In fact, almost every profession and trade, as well as every place, have their especial patron saint, who, like the tutelary divinity of the Pagans, receives particular hours from his or her protégés.
You can read the entire work on Google Books.
Calvin’s treatment includes a historical overview, quotes from the church fathers, and even citations from sixteenth-century Roman Catholic scholars. The result is an air-tight case for the true origin of many Catholic practices.
Calvin’s conclusion is that these practices are nothing more than idolatrous superstitions, rooted in ancient Roman paganism. Even today, five centuries later, his work still serves as a necessary warning to those who persist in such idolatry. Hence his concluding sentence: “Now, those who fall into this error must do so willingly, as no one can from henceforth plead ignorance on the subject as their excuse.”
If you’re getting answers it’s from demons.
You may and do CLAIM this, but CANNOT prove that there were not others Christians, some of whom fled for their lives from the Catholic hierarchy, who brought the Good News about the Lord Jesus Christ to different parts of the world in spite of the RCC efforts to quash the Gospel knowledge to the common people.
I never claimed anything of the sort. There are many who are not of the Apostolic succession... but no one who proclaims the name of Jesus Christ is our enemy. Unfortunately, that courtesy is not normally returned.
John said to Him, “Teacher, we saw someone casting out demons in Your name, and we tried to prevent him because he was not following us.” But Jesus said, “Do not hinder him, for there is no one who will perform a miracle in My name, and be able soon afterward to speak evil of Me. “For he who is not against us is for us." Mark 9:38-40
Ever read any of Paul's writings? How about Acts 15?
Acts 15:28 For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things; 29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.
Why do Catholics now try to demand more "necessary things"?
If you put such limitations on God and His Spirit then it's a wonder you hold any reverence for His Word. It is inarguable that the Pentateuch was written a very long time after events recorded and, when it was, it was the oral tradition that was codified.
The Gospel came through the Holy Spirit, both the written and the oral.
You mean like this?
1 Cor 11:23 For I received from the Lord that which I also delivered to you, that the Lord Jesus in the night in which He was betrayed took bread; 24 and when He had given thanks, He broke it and said, “This is My body, which is for you; do this in remembrance of Me.” 25 In the same way He took the cup also after supper, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in My blood; do this, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of Me.” 26 For as often as you eat this bread and drink the cup, you proclaim the Lord’s death until He comes.It's interesting that St Paul didn't reference the burdens you mentioned but actually delivered them the Supper of the Lord. Maybe you're just reading Acts 15 out of context again?27 Therefore whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner, shall be guilty of the body and the blood of the Lord.
So simply say what you mean... you reject our tradition in favor of your own. We know it's true. Why is it so hard to acknowledge?
"They [heretics] gather their views from other sources than the Scriptures...We have learned from none others the plan of our salvation, than from those through whom the Gospel has come down to us, which they did at one time proclaim in public, and, at a later period, by the will of God, handed down to us in the Scriptures, to be the ground and pillar of our faith" - Irenaeus, Against Heresies, 3.1.1 - Irenaeus, Against Heresies, 3.1.1 Sola Scriptura !
"I beg of you, my dear brother, to live among these books [scripture], to meditate upon them, to know nothing else, to seek nothing else." - Jerome (Letter 53:10)
“Have thou ever in your mind this seal, which for the present has been lightly touched in my discourse, by way of summary, but shall be stated, should the Lord permit, to the best of my power with the proof from the Scriptures. For concerning the divine and holy mysteries of the Faith, not even a casual statement must be delivered without the Holy Scriptures; nor must we be drawn aside by mere plausibility and artifices of speech. Even to me, who tell you these things, give not absolute credence, unless thou receive the proof of the things which I announce from the Divine Scriptures. For this salvation which we believe depends not on ingenious reasoning , but on demonstration of the Holy Scriptures.” (Cyril of Jerusalem, Cat. Lecture 4, Ch. 17)
"There is, brethren, one God, the knowledge of whom we gain from the Holy Scriptures, and from no other source. For just as a man, if he wishes to be skilled in the wisdom of this world, will find himself unable to get at it in any other way than by mastering the dogmas of philosophers, so all of us who wish to practice piety will be unable to learn its practice from any other quarter than the oracles of God. Whatever things, then, the Holy Scripture declare, at these let us look; and whatsoever things they teach, these let us learn; and as the Father wills our belief to be, let us believe; and as He wills the Son to be glorified, let us glorify Him; and as He wills the Holy Spirit to be bestowed, let us receive Him. Not according to our own will, nor according to our own mind, nor yet as using violently those things which are given by God, but even as He has chosen to teach them by the Holy Scriptures, so let us discern them." - Hippolytus, Against Noetus, ch 9
"For how can we adopt those things which we do not find in the holy Scriptures?" - Ambrose (On the Duties of the Clergy, 1:23:102)“Let the inspired Scriptures then be our umpire, and the vote of truth will be given to those whose dogmas are found to agree with the Divine words.” - Gregory of Nyssa (d.ca, 395) “On the Holy Trinity”, NPNF, p. 327
“We are not content simply because this is the tradition of the Fathers. What is important is that the Fathers followed the meaning of the Scripture." - Basil the Great (ca.329–379) On the Holy Spirit, 7.16
“Neither dare one agree with catholic bishops if by chance they err in anything, but the result that their opinion is against the canonical Scriptures of God.” - Augustine (354–430) De unitate ecclesiae, 10
Is it their tutelage you were talking about? Surely not. They claim Sola Scriptura.
Show me the first time it is recorded that any Father of the Church complained about the practice of asking saints for their intercession.
If no Father of the Church complained about it, it must not have been an innovation.
Acts 15:28 For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things; 29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.
If Jesus was drinking real blood He was sinning and was encouraging others to do so.
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>> “Men such as St Polykarp (direct disciple of St John), St Irenaeus,...” <<
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Irenaeus wrote a large volume, Against Heresies, declaring that the teaching had already been changed, or did you miss that little detail?
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So if the 7 sacraments got handed down from the Apostles why did it take to the COT to make it official? That’s fifteen hundred years after the fact. It was also established at COT that the 7 sacraments are needed for salvation and that Grace isn’t enough.
The people being derided followed God's teaching- to the very letter when it meant losing their lives. When our times each come, may God say the same of all of us!
Live in poverty and humility literally from the Scriptures, owning NOTHING as did St. Francis of Assisi;
Get drawn, quartered and decapitated for your conscience as did Thomas More and John Fisher;
Volunteer to die in the place of another man IN A CONCENTRATION CAMP like St. Maximilian Kolbe;
Until then, you can say "King James" chapter and verse, Greek and whatever, it is sound and fury and signifying nothing unless you back it up with your life- or death.
MEMORIZING SCRIPTURE IS NOT THE SAME AS LIVING IT, OR DYING FOR WHAT YOU BELIEVE, OR SHOWING WHAT CHRIST HIMSELF SAID TO BE THE GREATEST LOVE-THAT A MAN GIVE HIS LIFE FOR ANOTHER!
Let us all get our OWN houses in order. God bless you, one and all!
The Council of Trent did NOT “make it official” for the first time. The CoT restated the Church’s teaching because it was being denied by the Protestants.
Teh Council of Trent also said that Jesus rose from the dead. Are you going to argue that it took the Catholic Church 1500 years to “invent” the Resurrection?
Many anti-Catholic propagandists make the same blunder: They find an instance where the Church’s teaching is restated, and they proclaim that THAT is the moment when the teaching was “invented.”
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