Posted on 12/14/2014 11:57:21 AM PST by ealgeone
The reason for this article is to determine if the worship/veneration given to Mary by the catholic church is justified from a Biblical perspective. This will be evaluated using the Biblical standard and not man’s standard.
And that is what escapes most of those we talk to.
We share that sort of thing time and again, and it goes without comment, except to accuse us of *easy believism* and that we can live however we want in unrepentant, wanton sin, and still expect to get to heaven.
Telling them about the change that happens is more than falling on deaf ears. It doesn't even register to them. It's like it never happened when we relate it.
she has PLENTY of snake oil in her life now...
Here is my response:
another intellectual response!!
Good grief....in biblical days no one tried to keep the Bible out of anyones hands...didn't happen.....there were virtually no Bibles to be had and they were prohibitively expensive....you could have all that you could find and afford.
1,600 years later, when dissidents came along and provided their own versions of what the Bible should say, The Catholic church did, indeed, try to restrict the dissemination of the perverted versions that appeared.
you are a Democrat???
you didn't really say that, did you??? and without the naughty Pope list, and the Mary's too busy to do that list, and the Book of Mormon list??????
AMAZING!!!
absolutely not...free gift from Chrisst....BUT...we are free to reject it if we so choose and our ACTIONS indicate our desire to retain the gift....
Thank you; I intended no ambiguity. The reference was to circumcision, but by extension we can mention any Jewish ceremonial practice of the Law of Moses, which we know, do not save. I don’t think St. Paul made any distinctions of the kind that you do, — am I wrong in that regard?
Paul was absolutely serving Satan as he persecuted the followers of The Christ, up until his conversion on the Damascus road. Paul cited that God called David "A man after mine own heart" in Acts 13:22, but 1 Sam 16:7, 12.
No, that is clearly not about law of Moses. This is the passage in context:
For we ourselves also were some time unwise, incredulous, erring, slaves to divers desires and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful, and hating one another. But when the goodness and kindness of God our Saviour appeared: Not by the works of justice, which we have done, but according to his mercy, he saved us, by the laver of regeneration, and renovation of the Holy Ghost; Whom he hath poured forth upon us abundantly, through Jesus Christ our Saviour: That, being justified by his grace, we may be heirs, according to hope of life everlasting. It is a faithful saying: and these things I will have thee affirm constantly: that they, who believe in God, may be careful to excel in good works. These things are good and profitable unto men. (Titus 3:3-8)
"Righteousness" instead of "justice" is fine, -- it is the same Greek word. The passage speaks of good works in relation to Divine Mercy, and surely mercy is unearned and not of works; mercy is a component of grace, by which alone we are saved. Appropriately, the passage ends with an exhortation to good works. It is very similar to the beginning verses of Ephesians 2, and like Ephesians 2 speaks of salvation by grace (or mercy) alone, to which men respond with faith and with good works.
Because that is what I try to do: I convey the meaning of the text and do not build my own theories about it. If my explanation is inaccurate, any better informed Catholic is invited to correct me, and I will study the Church doctrine and will adhere to it more closely in the future. That is the difference.
Generally, this is what Catholics are supposed to do: not interpret for themselves but explain the fixed meaning, -- well, to the extent that it is fixed, that is, -- sometimes there is a wider berth of ways to understand and explain the passage.
no prophecy of scripture is made by private interpretation. For prophecy came not by the will of man at any time: but the holy men of God spoke, inspired by the Holy Ghost. (2 Peter 1:20-21)
Do you not think Uriah would have been in the thick of the fight anyway? Was he not committed to his pals in his battalion?
And Did not God have it pre-planned that David was to marry Bathsheba whether David was acting out of less-than-honorable motives or not?
You need to start thinking out of the "let's-condemn-David" box, like God did. Your reasoning on this seems kind of limited, pedestrian, unimaginative. God often has ways above your ways, and thoughts above your thoughts. Give Him some credit for solving problems in a new and novel yet righteous way.
The answer is in the Bible. Find the holiness in it. Show how it glorifies Jehovah!
Thank you. We did not get to go out to eat. My daughter broke her back years ago when a bookcase fell on her. She went to have a spinal injection yesterday and she has been in bed all day. I had a fun day though. I started getting bd messages on FB this morning which continued all day. It was fun hearing from people I went to school with 50+ years ago and relatives/ friends. Sad to say, we have not been together since our school days. Maybe one of these days. They live all over the country now. One lives in Alaska.
I’m sorry—I let Post #6509 get through without making the html and punctuation do what I wanted. I hope you can work it out -—
WRONG, WRONG, WRONG...see you don't pay attention....Catholics and Muslims HAVE the same God...(There's only one) Muslims have chosen to invent another god to serve, as have the buddhists,Hindus, Mormans etc....but ALL of them were created by the one and only God.
no they didn't, they taught you that where there might be, in your mind any confusion whatsoever...seek someone more educated than you to assist you in your interpretation...Kind of like seeking the advice of a Math TEACHER, or a history TEACHER, or an English TEACHER.....what a unique concept...ask for assistance from an expert in the field.......not someone who sprang out of nowhere in the 1930's....just saying.
You have totally missed the point. The judgment is on you, because you have called David a murderer of Uriah, and that claim is simply not so. That claim is eisegesis, reading into Scripture something that is not there, and thus making God a liar.
what's the rush....He likes to reveal things as we are capable of understanding them.....no hurry!!
Again, nobody has denied believers should be careful to excel in good works. We do so out of gratitude to God for His grace. But these works are "good and profitable unto men", they honor God and help our fellow man. God rewards our righteous living in this life and into eternity. BUT...it doesn't say they are for our salvation. God HAS saved us by His grace and mercy and we receive His gift of eternal life through faith - not by our works, as if we must add to Christ's work or do our work to keep the gift He freely gave us.
You have been arguing this topic for as long as I can remember and there are times that I think you're right on the edge of finally getting it but then you step back and go downhill to the accursed Gospel of works righteousness.
When we face the Lord at our judgment, we won't be carrying a bag with all our good deeds to lay on a scale hoping to outweigh all the bad deeds we did in this life to determine if we go to heaven or not. No, we will approach Him either clothed in the righteousness of Christ, His white linen garment of salvation washed in HIS blood draped across our shoulders or our own filthy rags of righteousness. This is because it is ONLY by the shedding of blood that we have our atonement for our sins. All the good deeds, law keeping, works of love or kindness or corporal works of mercy - no matter how many we did - can never take away our sins. Only Christ, in our place, can do that. We won't be saved by any righteous deeds we have done, but because of HIS mercy and grace. Eternal life is His gift to us and we receive this gift by faith, trusting in HIM to save us. We respond to His offer by our faith and the changed life that results from being a new creation, having a new spirit nature with the indwelling Holy Spirit within us as the earnest of our inheritance, we now have the desire to please God by how we walk in newness of life. Our works don't save us, Jesus saves us. Our works don't keep us saved, Jesus saves us to the uttermost.
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