Seven things we wish ELCA, PCUSA, UCC, and Episcopal pastors knew biblically about homosexuality
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This immediately reminded me of Paul's discourse on the power of the flesh in Romans Chapter 7.
I really don't care which style genitals you like to rub.
Really, I don't.
You go on with your life and I will go on with mine. Don't be an attention whore, don't act like your preference in genitalia defines your being and we will get along just fine. Act like an ass and demand special treatment and we have a problem. The problem is yours because you make the choice to act out like a 12 year-old that hasn't gotten over puberty.
Grow up.
Thank you for posting this.
Anybody who has kids knows you can love somebody without approving everything they do.
This is an important issue in the church today, even in more conservative denominations. It seems the church either falls into apostasy, denying that homosexual acts are sin or it falls into hellfire and brimstone by practically declaring homosexual acts unforgivable.
There is a middle ground, just like there is with all sin. We must forgive those who repent, we must encourage them to flee the sin of homosexual conduct. There is forgiveness in Jesus Christ alone. The church must never tolerate the acceptance of this sin as normal or even desirable. The flip side is that it must not shut out a group of people who are in desperate need of Christ.
Have you ever confronted your abuser?
How about the pastor responds with “7 things I wish homosexuals knew about the gospel”
Interesting - thanks for posting. Point #5 is one that I wish was emphasized more often, but in today’s world of self-gratification, it is the ultimate sin to suggest that a person refrain from same-sex desires...
Good article overall, but the author incorrectly disparages fire-and-brimstone preaching about proud, unrepentant sin. This used to be the default in much gospel preaching. Jonathan Edwards stands out as a well-known example. We should shy away from rejecting this method for the culture’s sake.
Some believe the Bible. Some do not. Some go to heaven. Some go to hell. Choose one or the other. Can not have it both ways.
So, ANYTHING other than heterosexuality is a CHOICE. I looked up as much information that I could find on this. Youngsters CHOOSE homosexuality or bisexuality sometime between their early to mid teens, which would be 13-16 years of age.
What scientists can't figure out is WHY these young people make that choice or why more males choose it than females.
If those people happen to be Catholics, then they commit sin if they engage in homosexual sex, even if their state allows a formal union, which I refuse to call "marriage."
Every culture in the world considers non-heterosexual unions as wrong, sinful or just plain aberrant. Ours doesn't and that is just plain wrong,
Jean Lloyd pleads:
May I make two requests? Love me, but remember that you cannot be more merciful than God.
It isn’t mercy to affirm same-sex acts as good. Don’t compromise truth; help me to live in harmony with it.
One must always remember that first, before anything else, The God is Absolutely Righteous; but in His Grace and Mercy to the confessing human, He is not implacable (Heb. 7:2).
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"Let love be without dissimulation." Love me and tell me the truth.
"Let love be without dissimulation. Abhor that which is evil; cleave to that which is good" (Rom. 12:9 AV).
"And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation" (Gal_2:13 AV).
(Paul withstood Peter to the face with Truth, because Peter was to be blamed.)
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Practice compassion according to the root meaning of “compassion”: Suffer with me.
"And there shall cleave nought of the cursed thing to thine hand: that the LORD may turn from the fierceness of his anger, and shew thee mercy, and have compassion upon thee, and multiply thee, as he hath sworn unto thy fathers;
When thou shalt hearken to the voice of the LORD thy God, to keep all his commandments which I command thee this day, to do that which is right in the eyes of the LORD thy God" (Deut. 13:17 AV).
"And Jesus, moved with compassion, put forth his hand, and touched him, and saith unto him, I will; be thou clean" (Mk. 1:41 AV)
Jesus, the Messiah and in His earthly ministry the teacher of twelve disciples that he specially selected, exhibited a wisdom greater than that of His lineal royal predecessor Solomon.
In teaching them, and also others who were drawn to--and followed--Him, he personified The Truth as well as The Way, through application of the quality of Wisdom known only to The God, and shared with His disciples through the voice of the Holy Spirit..
It will take a certain measure of such wisdom to discern and answer the matter that still troubles the author of this cry for understanding and healing.
Said Solomon's father David, the coming Viceroy of Redeemed Israel in his Song of degrees:
"Blessed is every one that feareth the LORD; that walketh in his ways.
For thou shalt eat the labour of thine hands: happy shalt thou be, and it shall be well with thee" Ps. 128:1-2 AV) (my emphasis).
And so shall it be, and the way described, and the fruit promised.
The God did not intend for you to suffer for this, for The Anointed One has already done your suffering for you, should you confess and abandon your sin, and accept Jesus' payment for it, and healing from its source, on The Cross.
That is Truth, is it not?
Jean Lloyd says:
Over thirty years have passed since same-sex attraction rushed up from deep within my twelve-year-old frame. This attraction was unbidden and unwanted, yet simultaneously forceful and compelling.
As a Christian, the conflict between my sexuality and my faith would become the deepest and most intense of my life.
First, one must address the terms being used, their definition, and implementation, so we can discuss them in the sphere of Biblicity. Underlying all this discussion is the word "homosexual" or "homosexuality." To deal with this at all on the basis of Truth, one must prepare to fully discard this word as useful. Without getting into a lot of detail, the activity is an act of gratification, not of propagation.
It is time for all to stop using the misleading term "homosexual" and replace it with "same-sex gratification" and/or the Biblical "sodomy." Secondly, the term "Christian" in today's language is so loosely used that one often does not know if it refers to a person actually possessing the distinctives of a spiritually regenerated, wholly owned servant of the Lord Jesus who is demonstrably a child of the God of the Bible.
To estimate that conformity to Christ, the process of formation of one claiming that title must be examined, what it is, and what it is not.
The raw material from which a child of The God is formed is, of course, an individual who is born with Adam's sin unavoidably intertwined with one's DNA; and thus is, at the outset, a progeny of Satan's effect on the human race.
The forming tool is the generative seed, the Word Of God, applied to the human's intellect sometime in his/her life after he/she is conceived, but only comes into play sometime after, maybe Long after, the child has become accountable for his/her beliefs, attitudes and, the actions resulting from them (1 Jn. 3:9).
The agent is another human who has been brought to spiritual maturity in knowledge and conduct by the Jesus-practiced and Christ-commanded discipling method, who is willing and able to individually supervise the training of a student in The Faith, a summary of the facts pertaining to creation, original sin, the students condition, and the means of escape from it.
The process is called "discipling," the student is called a "disciple," and the teacher/agent is called a "discipler," and it starts with the teacher finding a student willing to undertake the process of learning the facts of The Faith, which is "being discipled."
Such disciples are found by a method of recruitment of faniliarizing them individually or corporately, privately or publicly, by spoken or written communication, of the reason for their condition before their Creator God, and His plan for saving them from that condition and into close, loving, intimate relationship with Him. If they thus experience a desire to learn more, the process of discipling can be initiated. This invitation to discipleship is commonly called "preaching The Gospel" just as in the old days, a town crier announced the news of the day, or a herald announced the coming of royalty (Mk. 16:15; Lk. 24:47; 1 Cor. 1:21, 15:1-8) .
Up to a point, this process may be suspended or even terminated by the decision of the person being discipled, but now leaving that person ever more greatly responsible for remaining in their initial condition of being accountable for their own physical and spiritual death, and unable to avoid a continuing life of practicing a lifestyle unacceptable to their Creator Who, at the end, is also their Judge as to their eternal disposition.
But at that point of having the full amount of the facts of The Faith, the beginner has and is accountable for the decision to admit his/her need of a Savior from condition into which he/she was born, and desires to fully and continuously yield him/herself into the care of the Jesus Christ of the Bible from this point on and forever. Neither the discipler, nor the association of fellow disciplers, nor the Savior Himself can make this decision. It is a fully guaranteed acceptance, but the decision is wholly up to the informed and accountable disciple to make for him/her self. However, the decision to go forward by abandoning all claims to self-determination of the future, to continuing with Sin as a master, and to the world and its affections, is an awesome concept, for it is an irreversible decision. Going on is an acceptance of a life of continuing discipleship.
But if and when the decision to go forward has been made, and the person has experienced a sense of death to self, to sinfulness, and to the claims of the world, and has experienced a new birth in spirit, into the sphere of the Kingdom of The God, and into the life and culture of its King, Jesus, it is also the point at which this discipleship process can now proceed under (a) valid designate of Christ, a spiritually mature discipler who himself has made the same decision and been discipled into spiritual maturity by yet another discipler before him, in repeated cycles tracing back to Jesus, The God Incarnate, who established and initiated this process.
That this decision has been made, and permanent enlistment validated, and the official training to begin, an induction ceremony is conducted in accordance with the commandment of the Savior and King, Jesus. It consists of immersion of the new recruit in water, under the Name and delegated Authority of The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit, into the Eternal Life of Discipleship. Of seven baptisms enumerated in the New Testament/Will of the Bible, this is the baptism officially recognizing the enlistment of a new-spiritually-born disciple, in whom the principle of conduct is to be The Holy Spirit, sent from The Father by His Son, to guide and teach the newly inducted soldier, band-slave, and priest follower of the Christ.
This person is now fit to be called "Christian." He/she is a volunteer meeting induction specifications, not a draftee, or merely a wanna-be hanger-on, nor a child wishing to please his/her parents or grandparents through copying their religious inclinations.
In the end, if the necessary element of the discipling process is left out, one cannot Biblically be called a "Christian," because this (as in Antioch of Syria) is the employment of a disciple-maker, not merely a convert to that way of believing in and associating with a religious element.
Sadly, this fundamental necessary concept has been minimized--or even eliminated--from the practices of local associations (churches), whether independent or denominational, claiming to be loyal to the Christ/Messiah/Anointed One of the Bible. By one method or another, the discipleship element is eliminated (baptizing reallocated as a form of assurance of untutored "belief" as a reaction to guilt-bringing preaching), or minimized (baptizing infants, followed later by catechizing children, "confirmation" of undedicated young adults), or simply claiming to be "Christian" by being born into a family whose tradition was always that of calling themselves "Christian," regardless of their common lifestyles and behaviors.
Very few of these associations any longer recognize this water baptism as a rite of induction into the Spirit-filled, Christ-following life of the regenerated believer-disciple-priest Company of the Committed.
Here is the invitation to discipleship, as made by the Jesus of the Bible, to His followers:
"All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.
Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light" (Mt. 11:27-30 AV).
Please note that the above, in contrast to the way some evangelizers would use it, it is not an invitation principally to salvation. It is an invitation to discipleship, leading to salvation and beyond. In the phrase translated as ". . . learn of me . . ." the preposition "of" is not "peri" meaning "about" in the Greek; it is "apo" meaning "from," and is more precisely ". . . learn from me . . ." thus conveying the sense "come and be taught/discipled by me." Then later in His ministry of training disciples He adds the thought:
"Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me" (Mat 16:24 AV; cf. Mk. 8:34, Lk. 9:23).
In the above, "take up his cross" is a menotomy for "go forth and preach as a herald the gospel of Jesus' death on The Cross." This is a daily opportunity to relate to others the message by which you can begin to lay out a plan for enlisting a disciple interested in altering his/her approach to a lost and dying world that is taking him/her with it.
The missional order given by the Risen Christ to His disciples was as follows:
"And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen." (Mt. 28:18-20 AV)
This Commander of The Company of The Committed is giving them His Marching Orders. Stating His authority, He gives the command to the ones He is sending to go, make disciples of peoples of all the world's nations, to exercise His delegated authority by inducting the disciples they have made by the rite of publicly immersing them individually in living water to signify their death, burial, and resurrection with Him into never-ending life of following Him, and subsequently to congregate them for indoctrination into the discipline of keeping watchfully secure and without changing in any way, whatsoever He has commanded them. A further rite is to remember His death whenever they assemble in honor to bow in homage to him by partaking of the bread of remembrance, a symbol of themselves, and by partking of the unleavened blood of the red grape, a symbol of the blood shed to pay for their sins and as the payment to purchase them, body, souls and spirit as His Eternal possession. Also in remembering His love, They are to love each another in truth, in the same way He loved them as their Rabbi and Savior (Jn. 13:34-35).
That is the description of how true Christians come into being, and what distinguishes them above all others to the onlooking world of people and company of angels, bad and good.
And yes, the bottom line is that I suspect that you were not really discipled (by parents who themselves had been and were continuing as disciples, or by another genuinely discipled and spiritually adult person) as a child, so as to build in your psychological constitution the process of becoming a "Christian." I contend that, for the lack of being willingly enlisted and Scripturally indoctrinated, you thus became a prey to the influences of the world that neither your parents nor your church group had much of any chance to deflect. I suspect that you were only subjected to a regular regimen of typical Sunday School, youth group, and/or church meetings in which the discipleship paradigm was not the controlling theme of the organization, and that your parents were relying simply on exposure to "churchification" to lead you to a moral life based on conduct according to Biblical standards. That would be typical of what most people of this age deem as being "Christian" and having a "faith." It is then more of believism than true belief, and much less than being led as a hedged-about child into the New Testament acculturation of true Christians.
Can you admit that as a twelve-year-old experiencing an influx of mind-bending hormones and '70s culture shock from sixth grade to junior high, it was possible you might not really have been a committed, responsible regenerated disciple of Christ, being personally supervised in one-on-one discipleship into salvation and growth, and thus having preferences unreachable by homogratification influences? Where did those thoughts come from? Was your experience only that of a religious atmosphere that itself had forgotten the plan of how Jesus intended to build His church (by disciples following the plan of bearing the fruit of more Spirit-born disciples (Jn. 15:4, 5, 16)?
Let's address the truths bearing on love, on church-community leadership, and on the influx of pity for those giving themselves up to abnormal attachments, in a following post in this thread.
(This is the second post in dealing with this issue of following wrong cues.)