Posted on 12/10/2014 6:32:20 AM PST by marshmallow
"Christian unity" is one of those terms that stir up a whole spectrum of—sometimes emotional—opinions.
On the one hand, we know that Jesus prayed to the Father concerning future believers "that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you" (John 17:21a, NIV).
On the other hand, charismatics know it is almost pointless to discuss the gifts of the Holy Spirit (1 Cor. 12, 14) with Baptists or most anyone else from a mainline denomination. And Protestants of just about any stripe get riled up when they hear Catholics talking about papal infallibility or their adoration of the Virgin Mary.
It's on this latter point that Rick Warren, senior pastor of Saddleback Church in Lake Forest, California, and successful author, has waded into a hornet's nest of controversy by telling a Catholic News Service interviewer that Protestants and Catholics "have far more in common than what divides us" and that Catholics do not "worship Mary like she's another god."
Regarding Warren's view that Catholics do not worship Mary, Matt Slick, writing on the website of the Christian Apologetics & Research Ministry, goes into great detail with material from Roman Catholic sources that say Mary is "the all holy one," is to be prayed to, worshipped, that she "brings us the gifts of eternal life" and she "made atonement for the sins of man."
If that's not putting her in the place of Christ as a god-like figure to be worshipped, then what is it?
"We believe in Trinity, the Bible, the resurrection, and that salvation is through Jesus Christ. These are the big issues," Warren says. "But the most important thing is if you love Jesus, we're on the same team."
To Warren's point about being on the same team, Slick.....
(Excerpt) Read more at charismanews.com ...
well........isn't that what Christianity is all about....one true religion, only one God, one path to salvation, the muslims, hindus, atheists, bhuddists, whateverists are done for??????
the Catholics just take one step further (in your opinion) and they insist that you follow their form of Christianity..
tc:isn't that what Christianity is all about
No.
Just when you think you've heard it all from a Catholic, one comes along and proves that you aren't done scraping the bottom of the barrel.
one true religion, only one God, one path to salvation, the muslims, hindus, atheists, bhuddists, whateverists are done for??????
Christ is not a religion. If you think that stating that there's only one way to God is being a control freak, then you are stuck accusing Jesus of being a control freak. HE'S the one who said that He was the way, the truth, and the life, and that no man comes to the Father but through Him.
However, the RCC can certainly be accused of control freakism. They claim authority over everyone, Catholic or not, over Scripture in claiming they wrote it, and even over God when they state that they have the power to bind and loose and God has to act on what they determine.
the Catholics just take one step further (in your opinion) and they insist that you follow their form of Christianity..
And it's one step too far. But thank you for proving my point. They DO state that you have to follow their religion or you'll burn in hell. The epitome of control freaks.
I do, too, and have said so many times when discussing the topic. Sadly, some Catholics are so anti-Protestant that they consider ANYONE who identifies as a Christian but not a Roman Catholic is a Protestant by default.
when you run out of semi-intelligent things to say you revert to nothing...as usual.
Yes they love to point out their shortcomings in others.
When someone convinces themselves that they are never wrong, they end up in China. If the hole doesn’t cave in on them before they dig that far... Accuser, thy name is Hypocrisy.
Of course, because we are “all the same” it doesn’t matter if they get cornfuzed and sputter more nonsense.
It’s really sad to see people fall apart like that.
Then do you denounce the use of abortifacients?
I use these figures as they're the best I could find. If you will/can follow the discussion you suggested my comment on catholic gals getting abortions was "an inference of mine", as if catholic girls are as all pure as the driven snow. I posted those numbers, sad as they are, to show that you have no clue what you're talking about.
On the contrary, I know exactly what I'm talking about. You inferred that I was implying by my posts that Catholic women do not have abortions. I did nothing of the kind. Like I said, this isn't about who does more than whom but protestants want to make it about that to deflect from the fact that they've already accepted abortion as a matter of practice in contracepting their marriages because the marital bed is,"my domain. Not God's." Seeing that the construct of sola scriptura does not explicitly prohibit it.
So it kinda burns me that you would accuse me of being "in league" with people who support the murder of the unborn child.
Personal story aside (as commendable as it is), do you support the use of artificial birth control that leads to the death of unborn children? Because that certainly has nothing to do with God's plan. That's man's plan.
Next time you make some asinine comment I suggest you think before you type. You need to retake that class in logic.
Your suggestion is noted.
Wow, you are not aware of all the scandals with Priests and children?? It’s nothing to you??
That’s sick, you should be ashamed.
now, that post 1350 is really funny..a bunch of people yell and scream and try to deny 2,000 years of truth and you say....well, we showed them!!!!!
yup, no need to go to Mass tomorrow, metmom says that it is all nonsense so what's the point.........Oh, heck...I'll just waste an hour or so and do it anyway...what have I got to lose????
“Thank you. This is why, I think, Roman Catholics should have stuck with the term “God-bearer” (Theotokos) rather than the disputed “Mother of God” title given to Mary.”
boatbums, the titles mean the same thing. You do realize that right? Mother of God IS God-bearer. The one who “bears” is the mother. And ONLY Protestants, and not all of them by any means, “dispute” the idea that Mary is the mother of God. It’s YOUR problem and there is NO DISPUTE over it in the historic Churches. NONE.
“I know many RCs understand this point but there are probably just as many, if not more, who do not and this confusion is what has led to Mary-worship.”
That comment makes no sense whatsoever. First, your starting premise over God-bearer vs. Mother of God is wrong. Second, there is NO worship of Mary in the Church. Third, what you cite as a reason for “Mary-worship” would not even make sense as a cause of “Mary-worship” if it did exist. Think about it: Hundreds and hundreds of millions of Catholics believe Mary is the Mother of God and none of them worship Mary as a god. None. If your idea - that the title, or confusion over the title leads to worship of Mary - were correct then we should see examples of this everywhere and instead we see exactly none. On every street corner in every place where there are Catholics, according to your logic, wouldn’t there be people saying, “Yeah, Mary is God ‘cause, you know, she’s the mother of God”? Yet that isn’t happening.
“I just think a lot of that confusion could have been avoided.”
But the confusion is YOURS. Also, do you realize that Lutherans and Anglicans commonly refer to Mary as Mother of God? Where are they worshiping Mary? Oh, right, not happening. Your theory is laughable.
when you run out of semi-intelligent things to say you revert to nothing...as usual.
post 1361....other than your misguided opinion, I see no error there...
Well we do the best we can, if you stop denying the Truth that would be very rewarding for you.
And it's not just yelling and screaming it's also false claims in posts, some not even knowing who they are posting to because everyone not Catholic are/is "all the same"
I think my position on pro-life is clear. If you can’t determine that, then maybe you need a class on reading comprehension in addition to logic.
as usual
Thank you for making my point. The protestant cites the work of liars and murderers. Agents of Lucifer to support their argument.
Where is the lie here? There are more Prots than Caths so the first figure is higher, while the rate is higher for Caths. And why would that be surprising? 40% Roman Catholics vs. 41% Non-R.C. see abortion as "morally acceptable". Also, the fact that these figures could not include California, Maryland, and New Hampshire would not really help the Catholic side.
Or is this just another recourse to charging bias when faced with stats that impugn Rome, and or the genetic fallacy a source cannot be right if it is liberal and sometimes wrong? Let Donohue answer:
INTERPRETING ABORTION DATA
Catalyst January/February Issue 2013, From The President's Desk
From The President’s Desk
William A. Donohue
..the CDC cites as reliable the work of the most prominent pro-abortion research group in the nation, the Guttmacher Institute (formerly the research arm of Planned Parenthood). Does this mean they cook the books, making up data to suit their politics? No. But it does mean that the lines of inquiry that they pursue, and their interpretation of the data, can readily be challenged.
Media coverage of the report was revealing. Here is how the Associated Press (AP) reported on one CDC finding: “The majority of the abortions are performed by the eighth week of pregnancy, when the fetus is about the size of a lima bean.” This is true but it is incomplete. More important, it is incomplete for entirely ideological reasons... - Media coverage of the report was revealing. Here is how the Associated Press (AP) reported on one CDC finding: “The majority of the abortions are performed by the eighth week of pregnancy, when the fetus is about the size of a lima bean.” This is true but it is incomplete. More important, it is incomplete for entirely ideological reasons.
Can there be any doubt that the protestant is in league with them?
This is also a fallacy, since may RCs sources site the same source as valid, while the numbers also impugn Prots, whose abortion rate is about as high as Caths.
Now that is GREAT....the kiddy pool is the 2,000 year old cradle of Christianity and the latest "church of what's happening now" is reality.....O.K. I guess...PATHETIC!!
What's "laughable" is the blatant ignoring of the many examples that are given that prove there IS a cult of Mary in Catholicism. A simple reading of the prayers, books, encyclicals, bulls, words supposedly said BY Mary in so-called apparitions, the parades, statues, kneeling, kissing, bowing down to, guilds, groups dedicated to her...I could go on. It's obvious that no matter how many of these references are given, posted, pictures shown, books cited, it will NOT be accepted because there is as much spiritual blindness about Mary as there is about Jesus in Catholicism.
It's there, plain as day, for anyone who hasn't already shut their eyes to it. It's fine and good to say your religion doesn't teach "Mary worship", but actions speak louder than words. Denying it exists won't make it go away.
Good point.
“Yes, and no back up for false claims, they are just right because you post them. Got it.”
What I post is correct because it is correct. I rarely make mistakes about anything related to the content of the issues discussed. I make my fair share of typos. I rarely get facts wrong.
“True, you have nothing.”
No, I have plenty. I just see absolutely no chance of you doing the right thing so what’s the point? Recently, in the last year or two I caught two or three anti-Catholics here lying. I don’t mean they were “disagreeing” with me. I mean they were outright, indisputably, unquestionably, objectively lying. These examples were not matters of interpretation or representation. Now, one of the usual anti-Catholics, I don’t remember who, challenged me when I said I had caught these people lying and that they had admitted that they had lied. I told that person to check the link on my webpage. He did so. He then played a game essentially saying, “Well, it’s a lie, but it’s not important.” And that’s how it goes with the anti-Catholic crowd. I have no reason to believe any anti-Catholic is actually interested in the truth when they countenance such things. The link is STILL on my webpage. I wish I had saved the others.
“Thanks for outing what kind of video you posted (that’s what it is called when someone posts a link to a video.)”
I have no idea what you call it, and I frankly don’t care. All I know is that you were wrong about the contents of the video so I can’t see how you watched it, but you claimed you did. How can I believe anything you say when you make a claim that is so patently - and OBJECTIVELY - false?
“No need to see your leftist actor what ever he is doing.”
Nope. There isn’t any need. It served its purpose nonetheless - especially in regard to you falsely claiming what the video was about while you claim to have watched it. Yep, served its purpose indeed.
“It’s the polite thing to do—describe what a video is when posting it.”
I only do so when I want to. I have no particular interest in being polite to people who make false claims.
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