Posted on 11/24/2014 7:50:29 AM PST by Salvation
But Catholics don’t have that “You shall not make for yourself a carved image” in their ten commandments.
But the Holy Spirit does. See post 140.
Well, then to be a Roman Catholic is to be ignorant of the Scriptures.
"protestants never read the Church Fathers yet they act out as you do"
And, Roman Catholics never read the original writers of the epistles...and they clearly do not act like they do.
You don't have to refute anything? I beg to differ. Your cult-like organization makes the claim that the true body of believers, their "Church", teaches the Gospel of Jesus Christ and it includes each of those things I mentioned (and several others). I absolutely, unequivocally deny this claim and further say, these are man-made, fabrications of homemade religion. Your job of refutation is to show that I am wrong and these are, in fact, taught clearly in the Scriptures.
The topics themselves are descriptors of the content and I was challenging you, or any RC, to provide solid biblical evidence of their truthfulness. All you need to do is provide the passages wherein the ideas are taught. Where is "popery" taught? Where is an "indulgence" taught? Where is the "absolution of sin by a man" taught? Where is "purgatory" taught? Where is "veneration (and worship) of Mary as the co-redemptrix" taught? Must I go on or can you get the idea?
We biblicists can point to precisely where salvation by grace, through faith, alone is taught (Eph. 2). We can point to where it is taught that God chooses those He will rescue (Rom. 9). We can point to the sufficiency and perspicuity of the Bible (II Tim. 3:16,17). We can point to the depravity and helplessness of man (Rom. 3). All I am asking is for you, too, to point to where your organization's doctrines are taught in the Scripture. Or admit that they are made up by your organization, not supported in the Scriptures.
Methinks you protest too much. I know YOU are a member of a cult, and among the thousands of splintered offshoots from the one true Church of Christ, which has remained the same Catholic, and Apostolic, and not fabrications. I don't have to prove anything to you. You obviously don't care enough about the claims of the Catholic Church to give me a serious representation and refutation.
You probably don't even want to investigate Catholic claims. At a bare minimum, you post against other Catholics without truly going through the effort to show your homework. Its a waste of time, because you won't convince anyone.
>>>We biblicists can point to precisely where salvation by grace, through faith, alone is taught<<<
No where in scripture does it expressly say "faith alone." That sounds like the invention of Martin Luther, whose errors were condemned by the council of Trent in 1563. The Catholic Church does not hold an unassuming doctrine on justification and grace. The Church does in fact teach that Faith is the essential and necessary and sufficient requirement for justification. That justification cannot be earned. The Church disagrees practically, that a person can say they believe in Jesus on Sunday and then burn crucifixes on Saturday night. Wouldn't you agree, a Christian does not believe in Jesus the Son of God, if they teach that Jesus was only a man and just wanted to pretend he was God? There are such things as practical consequences for belief. Why else would so many street side preachers attempt to get someone to proclaim Jesus?
The teachings of the Catholic Church are not hidden in some secret room. They are open and easily accessed online or in bookstores and libraries. They can be obtained from the sources of documents distributed.
Until you want to present to me something that is not a convenient straw-man for you to denigrate, I don't have to respond any further here.
I spent the day reading about the great protestants of the second and third centuries. Those brave Baptist and Unitarian warriors who were martyred protecting the Church; the brilliant Christ the Scientist, Lutheran, Presbyterian and Anglican theologians who contributed so much in their writings. And how could one ignore the stalwart Karo Batak Protestants and their development of Sunday services and bible studies? Wow, what a rich history! I’m going to chant Amazing Grace in Latin all day.....
Well, I guess we can see who you think is worthy of praise and worship. I don’t think of any of those men. I focus on Christ and what the Holy Spirit inspired in the word God preserved for us. So you just keep focusing on those men if you wish. For me and my house we will follow Christ.
Neither do the Mormons or the Muslims. I'm seeing a trend there.
If it's apostolic please show where the apostles taught the assumption of Mary. Show where they taught the position of a pope. Show where they taught the concept of purgatory. Show where they taught the need for indulgences.
Romans 5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:
Romans 4:5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
Romans 3:28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.
Galatians 5:6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.
Galatians 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
Philippians 3:9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Romans 3:27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.
Now you might think to come back with James 2:24 but let's let Christ answer that one for you.
John 6:28 Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God? 29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.
You mean things like this?
CC 841 The Church's relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge on the last day."
So Catholics and Muslims have the same god ey!
Almost forgot. I would be remiss if I did not mention the councils and synods held by the Association of Welcoming and Affirming Baptists, Global Alliance of Affirming Apostolic Baptists, Metropolitan Community Church, Universal Foundation for Better Living, Subbotniks (post Molokan Faith split), for their tireless work affirming the Triune God as revealed in Scriptures. And kudos to the clergy from the Process Church of the Final Judgement and its battle with first century heresies, specifically that Jesus Christ had two natures, human and Divine? Also need to give a shout out to the other 34,987 protestant religions which contributed as well, though I can’t seem to recall exactly what. Finally, we need to be grateful for those monks from the Church of Christ with Elijah Message, Apostolic Overcoming Holy Church of God and the Rosicrucian Fellowship of Max Heindel. Thanks for your hard work.
Oh, VERY well written!!
C. S. Lewis was brilliant in bringing us Screwtape. Reading it, you can understand what has happened to the Anglican Church.
Interesting that you keep affirming your belief in man. True believers know it's not man but it is what the Holy Spirit revealed in God's word.
1 John 5:13 hese things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.
See there? It's not what the men you follow wrote but what the Holy Spirit wrote through the apostles. Like I said, follow men if you choose but for me and my house we will follow the Lord.
I think when you need to begin calling names you have gotten to the end of your your defence and base in scripture. I’m done with you.
Name calling and mind reading are not allowed in the Religion Forum.
Discuss the issues all you want, but do not make it personal.
I have gone back & examined my comments on this thread and I fail to find any name calling on my part.
Please elaborate with examples.
“Protestant troll” in #8
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