Posted on 11/13/2014 6:49:41 PM PST by Heart-Rest
Sure it is.
Jeremiah 1:5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.
Psalm 139:13 For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb.
Exodus 20:13 Thou shalt not kill.
Thou shalt not murder covers abortion. Abortion has been around much longer than the 20th century and likely practiced predating Christ earthly birth. Remember the Romans 2000 years ago who did the first recorded C-Section.
Birth control is a different issue all together. It too has been around for several thousand years. The Egyptians IIRC developed the condom. Scripture taken out of context has lead to a lot of beliefs that aren't accurate. One man was ordered by GOD to marry his brothers wife and produce a child. That was under the Law of Moses. It was for the womans sake to be provided for as much as it was to continue a bloodline. The law was if a mans brother passed without a male heir the brother was to take her as his wife. This was in a time of plural marriages. Would you want to marry your sister in law? That thought terrifies me LOL. I've never met mine and in my previous marriage both were repulsive.
OK back to the point. The man refused to finish his appointed task GOD ordered him to do and was punished. From that one passage has come a lot of misunderstanding and adding too.
A couple should have what children they can provide for. Now follow me close on this. If they have six kids and say this is all we can provide for then yes birth control should be acceptable because there are heirs etc. They have procreated IOW.
At the same time if they have a slip up they should say GOD's Will be done and tighten the belt so to speak and raise the child or in worse case scenario allow others too.
Should a couple be required say to place the woman at risk of life to have a child just to have a child? Meaning simply this. If the wife has health issues that make pregnancy a great danger both to her and the child "IF" she were to conceive should birth control be allowed? There is no Biblical prohibition for not having kids. If she became pregnant that is a different issue. It becomes a wait and see situation allowing the pregnancy to continue. If the baby becomes distressed and will die if not delivered even at an age it may not survive who is gonna be Solomon? If the mothers health becomes endangered by the babies distress or a tubular pregnancy as another example most doctors by medical protocol even in Catholic Hospitals for the past century of modern medicine have taken the child unless the mother herself says otherwise. Sometime the child makes it sometime it does not.
My wife when much healthier, by her first husband had two kids which I helped raise since their very early teens. Now we have grown grandkids. At the time we married the doctors warned us please use birth control because the medications will either kill or greatly harm the baby or likely do same to her trying to carry a child. They had very legitimate reasons for their concerns and at least two were Roman Catholic doctors in a Roman Catholic based hospital ran by then Mercy healthcare. I got thinks taken care of so she would be safe.
Both of us are very pro-life. Had she became pregnant we would have welcomed the child and let the pregnancy if GOD willed go to term. If she had been in trouble and the loss of her life pending we would have waited as long as possible & said take the child and prayed the baby lived. That's just common sense.
I know the passage "Go forth and multiply". It was a blessing making reproduction possible. That too has been taken to extremes by some sects. But again by the original scripture laws I do not see anyone marrying their sister in law because their brother did not produce a son before his death.
Do you watch it on TV ?
I associate with "it" in real life both physicaly and spiritualy.
“Furnish that, i.e. information that can be verified or refuted, or else you implicitly confess to making a supercilious taunt.”
What I said was true. It doesn’t need to be verified by you to be true. I really seem to have struck a nerve. Enjoy that.
“Thou shalt not murder covers abortion.”
I would agree. Some Protestant sects do not.
“Birth control is a different issue all together.”
No, it is related and similar. And you’re missing the point. What is the Biblical teaching on birth control? Give me the verse which explains it? If you can’t provide one, then please tell me how Protestants - using the Bible alone - opposed birth control for almost 400 years and now - using the Bible alone - say it is okay. The Bible did not change. What did?
“Oh really?”
Yes. Not one of the verses you posted actually uses the word Bible. Not one. Saying that it uses a Greek plural for books is not the same thing. And I think you know that.
I know there are home kind people in wheelchairs and nursing homes who are unable to assemble. They can only watch it on TV, although the church will come to them.
Judge me, O Lord; for I have walked in mine integrity: I have trusted also in the Lord; therefore I shall not slide. Examine me, O Lord, and prove me; try my reins and my heart. For thy lovingkindness is before mine eyes: and I have walked in thy truth. I have not sat with vain persons, neither will I go in with dissemblers. I have hated the congregation of evil doers; and will not sit with the wicked. I will wash mine hands in innocency: so will I compass thine altar, O Lord: That I may publish with the voice of thanksgiving, and tell of all thy wondrous works. Lord, I have loved the habitation of thy house, and the place where thine honour dwelleth. Gather not my soul with sinners, nor my life with bloody men: In whose hands is mischief, and their right hand is full of bribes. But as for me, I will walk in mine integrity: redeem me, and be merciful unto me. My foot standeth in an even place: in the congregations will I bless the Lord.
Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus, By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh; And having an high priest over the house of God; Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water. Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised;) And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works: Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.
“Sure it is.”
No, it is not. Post the verse that actually mentions abortion. Remember, I said, “but it is never once mentioned in scripture.” That is irrefutably true. Undoubtedly you will fail because I’ve asked you to do the impossible. There is no such verse.
It is certain that they believe that there is NO salvation outside of the catholic church! Furthermore, if you claim that you know you are saved, then you have committed the “mortal sin of presumption” and you go straight to Hell when you die, (no purgatory for you,) unless you confess it to a priest and receive absolution.
I was referring to the cva66snipe's use of the term "The Bible", not the individual biblos. "The Bible" as a whole was not compiled until the late 4th century and then it was compiled by a Catholic saint (St. Jerome) at the request of a Catholic pope (St. Damasus I). So how were the early Christians saved if they did not possess the entire written "Word of God" to follow His teachings?
Making you??? He simply informs about where to get more information if one desires and you see it as "making us"??
It was not even my blog. Hard dare she impugn James Swan!
Protestantism is a false religion, teaching errors of the gospel for more than 500 years. Everyone and their brother is an “authority”. And their all right. Just ask them.
As said, it is RCs who quite evidently seem to feel the need to constantly repeat propaganda , as if to comfort themselves that their fantasy is true.
Genesis ch 38 v8-10.
8 And Judah said unto Onan, Go in unto thy brother's wife, and marry her, and raise up seed to thy brother. 9 And Onan knew that the seed should not be his; and it came to pass, when he went in unto his brother's wife, that he spilled [it] on the ground, lest that he should give seed to his brother. 10 And the thing which he did displeased the LORD: wherefore he slew him also.
Now what was the actual sin? Birth Control of disobedience to GOD's order specific to him under the Laws handed Israel in verse 6? Like I asked do you wish to do the same if your brother passed without a son? There you go. Now your turn chapter and verse and please no posting from the RCC writs. Where is it in The Bible that specifically prohibits birth control? It is either sin or it isn't and the RCC of "abstaining during more prone to fertilization times" would still be the same if it is sin as it too would be withholding.
Are you ready to do this as well? Deuteronomy 25:5-6 - If brethren dwell together, and one of them die, and have no child, the wife of the dead shall not marry without unto a stranger: her husband's brother shall go in unto her, and take her to him to wife, and perform the duty of an husband's brother unto her.
The majority of related scripture specific to birth control deals with one man Onan. Actually it is the only passage I can find even in KJV. There are passage related to warnings of harming a woman carrying a child and harming {abortion or causing miscarriage by injury}
Exodus 21:22 - If men strive, and hurt a woman with child, so that her fruit depart [from her], and yet no mischief follow: he shall be surely punished, according as the woman's husband will lay upon him; and he shall pay as the judges [determine]
There are passages saying children are a blessing. There are passages saying before you were formed in the womb I knew you. There is this as well.
Genesis 1:28 - And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.
That one was a blessing it says it was. You do not have to have babies every fertile time possible to accomplish such. None are prohibitions against preventing fertilization except the one related to Onan under The laws of Moses of the laws handed Israel. Now are you ready to abide in those? If the RCC doctrine is based on the passages related to Onan then some members best be marrying widowed sister in laws right?
We could not fulfill the Laws given Israel they were too many and too complex.
Jesus Christ fulfilled the law in His perfection. We are to obey the Commandments given us including the ones Christ Himself added.
Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.<<
They were able to check to see if even Paul was teaching correctly. That's something the Catholics are not allowed to do with their Church leaders. Even the Jews were expected to understand from the Old Testament writings that Jesus was the Messiah. Plus the writings of the apostles were spread amongst the different assemblies very early.
I just showed you were it does and provided the Greek support for it.
Ok
As soon as you show the word Trinity in scripture. Run down those rabbit trails on your own.
I wonder how the Bereans were able to check to see if even what Paul taught was true. The writings of the apostles also were distributed to all of the early assemblies. The hubris of the Catholics notwithstanding.
They were not able to check if Paul was teaching correctly. They were not qualified. Only another apostle could do that. What those Berean Jews could do is check if what Paul told them was found in the Hebrew scriptures. The Jews were not expected to understand from the Old Testament writings unless they responded to God's spiritual call and someone with apostolic teaching explained it. How do we know that apostolic writings were widely distributed to churches except for holy tradition ? 2 Peter does not explain which writings of Paul are being referred to, nor the audience itself. Without holy tradition we would not even know Peter and Paul were martyred in Rome. Jesus therefore answered and said unto them, Murmur not among yourselves. No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day. It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me. Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken: Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory? And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself. And the angel of the Lord spake unto Philip, saying, Arise, and go toward the south unto the way that goeth down from Jerusalem unto Gaza, which is desert. And he arose and went: and, behold, a man of Ethiopia, an eunuch of great authority under Candace queen of the Ethiopians, who had the charge of all her treasure, and had come to Jerusalem for to worship, Was returning, and sitting in his chariot read Esaias the prophet. Then the Spirit said unto Philip, Go near, and join thyself to this chariot. And Philip ran thither to him, and heard him read the prophet Esaias, and said, Understandest thou what thou readest? And he said, How can I, except some man should guide me? And he desired Philip that he would come up and sit with him. The place of the scripture which he read was this, He was led as a sheep to the slaughter; and like a lamb dumb before his shearer, so opened he not his mouth: In his humiliation his judgment was taken away: and who shall declare his generation? for his life is taken from the earth. And the eunuch answered Philip, and said, I pray thee, of whom speaketh the prophet this? of himself, or of some other man? Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus. And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized? And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him. And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing.
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