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1 posted on 09/21/2014 1:29:09 PM PDT by marshmallow
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To: marshmallow

It looks more likely.


2 posted on 09/21/2014 1:34:53 PM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: marshmallow
In the past decades many within the 1.2 billion-member Church have complained that the procedure is too complicated and archaic.

Divorce is always a major hassle and complicated. Why is this news?

3 posted on 09/21/2014 1:35:31 PM PDT by fwdude (The last time the GOP ran an "extremist," Reagan won 44 states.)
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To: marshmallow; NYer; markomalley; Salvation; piusv

I don’t know where things will lead, but this story appears to be rather straight forward.


5 posted on 09/21/2014 1:39:54 PM PDT by GreyFriar (Spearhead - 3rd Armored Division 75-78 & 83-87)
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To: marshmallow

I find all of this annulment, and can’t marry an albatross around the neck of innocents that should not be. I agree that divorce is terrible and God hates it, however, he also states to beware those ‘who forbid to marry’ and ‘strain at a gnat and swallow a camel.”

My catholic friend years ago went through an annulment he did not want, and they had three children, so she could marry someone else....He said something profound “How do I tell the best man that the marriage didn’t happen, because he was there, or my parents. How do you tell your children you have never been married to their mother, when obviously by the wedding photos you were?”

I find the Catholic Church immature and not understanding scripture when you can only site those Scriptures meant to discourage divorce. Jesus himself made it clear when he condemned adultery, ‘if you think it in your mind it’s sin”... and that includes adultery, etc’.....’he who is without sin cast the first stone’ and so on.

Also, in the same Bible it says ‘there is only ONE UNFORGIVABLE SIN and that is blasphemy against the Holy Spirit” So that would mean suicide and divorce are forgivable sins...meaning they were put in the sea of forgetfulness with all other sins forgiven.

Who in their right man believes some Priest has the right to dissolve a marriage God attended? Ha! More realistic is that he forgives those who make mistakes, and no piece of paper will change that, IMHO.

(not for you Marshmallow)....AND TO THOSE WHO WANT TO JUMP INTO THIS CONVERSATION, DO NOT SEND ME THOSE TWELVE PARAGRAPHS FROM THE BIBLE THAT CAN BE REFUTED WITH TWELVE OTHERS...just read the whole Bible, pray, and get educated about the GOD who forgives sins...period.


7 posted on 09/21/2014 1:42:27 PM PDT by Kackikat (Two wrongs do NOT make a right.... unless you are a Democrat!)
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To: marshmallow

For my wife’s father to get a RC annulment to be married to another women he had to declare his children were bastards....

I think this is one area the CC can move into the 21 st. century ....


16 posted on 09/21/2014 2:00:33 PM PDT by Popman (Jesus Christ Alone: My Cornerstone...)
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To: marshmallow

As an expert on this matter through hard experience, I would say the following:

The Church has wrestled with divorce and remarriage since the beginning. I just finished reading a book of orthodox Catholic doctrine published in the 1880s which laid out the history over 1500 years of various “solutions”, proposed and/or implemented, before Trent (as the book would have it) ended all debate. But of course, the fundamental issue remains, unchanged, except that millions of Catholics are now affected because of post-1969 changes in civil divorce practice.

The resulting annulment explosion is the problem, and (almost) all bishops hate it. It is the result of a desire to temper justice with mercy (good), but in practice it favors deception and perjury (bad). There is an entire industry that exists to facilitate a successful petition, which will inevitably be granted if certain words are used.

If there is a way to extend mercy, including the recognition of second marriages, while doing away with the lies, most of the bishops would jump at the chance.


22 posted on 09/21/2014 2:05:11 PM PDT by Jim Noble (When strong, avoid them. Attack their weaknesses. Emerge to their surprise.)
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To: marshmallow

Just give them a PO box to send their money to.


28 posted on 09/21/2014 2:18:03 PM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum ("The man who damns money obtained it dishonorably; the man who respects it earned it." --Ayn Rand)
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To: marshmallow

I’m still confused. With the sheer number of annulments since Vatican II, exactly how does the process need to be “simplified”? Getting an annulment shouldn’t be easy ... or easier.


29 posted on 09/21/2014 2:18:19 PM PDT by piusv
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To: marshmallow
There are many ignorant people posting on this thread. They act like they're really smart, but in reality, they're putting their ignorance on display for all to see.

Okay, here is how it works: When a Catholic couple gets married in the church, there are two things that happen: the couple is granted a civil marriage AND they also (ostensibly) receive the sacrament of marriage. Later on, if they decide to divorce, they are granted a CIVIL divorce, but the sacrament of marriage remains, UNLESS an annulment is granted. An annulment is granted if the tribunal determines conditions existed on the day of the wedding that nullified the bestowment of the sacrament of marriage (e.g. undisclosed alcoholism, the desire not to be open to children, etc.).

The annulment says the SACRAMENT of marriage did not happen. It does NOT negate the civil marriage. The civil marriage DID happen, therefore, any children of this union are NOT bastards.

Will this simple explanation make any difference to all you Catholic haters out there? I doubt it. You just relish in the delight of using the word "bastard" in your feeble attempt to denigrate Catholics. You really don't want to hear the truth, nor do you give a damn what the truth really is.
64 posted on 09/21/2014 3:26:51 PM PDT by Dan in Wichita
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To: marshmallow

In one particular case that I know of, including the details the woman went into the marriage with the idea “If it doesn’t work, I can always get a divorce.” So she made the vow of (till death do us part”) or (”As long as we both shall live”) with no real intent to do so. Would you say that is fraud in the sacrament and possibly null and void?


80 posted on 09/21/2014 4:22:16 PM PDT by navyblue (<u> Si vis pacem, para bellum.)
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To: marshmallow

In America, review by a second tribunal can be relatively quick. The LA diocese sends its cases to Orange county for review, and vice versa. Well, it may add a couple weeks to the process, I guess.

It seems to me that, as a legal procedure, it is not all that rigorous. A lot of lee-way is given for testimony that might not be admitted in a state court.

I think all the Pope needs to do is to tell bishops to process people faster and they will hire a couple of extra personnel, or manage the tribunal better, and get it done.


110 posted on 09/21/2014 10:22:12 PM PDT by married21 ( As for me and my house, we will serve the Lord.)
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To: marshmallow
Pope Francis has ordered a review aimed at simplifying the Church's procedures for annulments, the Vatican said on Saturday, a move that could make it easier for Catholics to end marriages.

If they're ending marriages, it's called *divorce*.

All the church is doing is making church sanctioned divorce easier for Catholics.

114 posted on 09/22/2014 4:59:23 AM PDT by metmom (...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith...)
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To: marshmallow

bumpus ad summum


143 posted on 09/24/2014 7:47:00 PM PDT by Dajjal (Justice Robert Jackson was wrong -- the Constitution IS a suicide pact.)
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