“That is exactly what the Targums say about the Messiah - He would be a branch (netzer) out of Jesse and that was what the city of Nazareth was called. Also, this isn’t a quibble, but Matthew 2:23 says, “That which was spoken through the prophets...” . It doesn’t say, “It was written. So, I agree with you and RC that there isn’t any speculation required.”
Either way you have proved my point: it is an extrapolation through an oral tradition. There is NO VERSE IN THE OLD TESTAMENT that says it as Matthew says it. Thanks for the assist. You guys keep proving me right again and again.
Careful now, don't throw your shoulder out of its socket patting yourself on the back! You aren't anywhere close to being "right" this time, much less over and over again. Why don't we go back to the posts that STARTED all this?
Wait. Remember when you said, “Going beyond what is written and building doctrine upon assumptions will always lead to trouble, regardless of denomination”? Okay, now you’re saying Mary “says as much” that she is “fallen and sinful, and in need of salvation.” She only says that Jesus is her Savior. She never says she is fallen and sinful. You’re doing exactly what you were complaining about a matter of minutes ago.
“Therefore, this doctrine created via extrapolation built upon assumptions found nowhere in scripture, scholarly no doubt they might have been, is error.”
Again, explain Matthew 2:23 by giving me an EXACT verse from the Old Testament that says EXACTLY what Matthew says or else Matthew is guilty of what you just accused others of doing. And if Matthew is guilty, but you still believe he was inspired, then what are you saying about the Holy Spirit? Do you think before you post?
88 posted on 9/17/2014 11:19:09 PM by vladimir998
“He was relying upon the Old Testament, vlad.”
State the EXACT verse he was relying on RC. If you fail, you will not only be showing that you are wrong about Matthew, but you are wrong and hypocritical about the other issue. Have at it. State the EXACT Old Testament verse, RC.
You have been provided with numerous proofs FROM the Old Testament prophets that back up the truth spoken of by Matthew including from Roamer_1 about the actual city of Nazareth not existing at the time Isaiah wrote the prophecy concerning the Messiah - who would come from a "branch" out of Jesse. There are numerous prophecies we can see that speak of things yet to come and we only know they have been fulfilled exactly once we look back. That's why your demand to show you a verse in the OT that is specifically quoted in the NT - though it CAN be done in hundreds of cases - isn't what you should be expecting to see in ALL cases. That's short sighted and carnal and pointing that out is hardly hypocritical!
This line of discussion began over the RCC's claim of Mary being "sinless", let's not forget, and there ARE numerous and clearly stated verses that disprove such a claim - "oral" tradition, or not.