Posted on 09/03/2014 6:36:07 AM PDT by NKP_Vet
But that is what your argument is based upon, even if conjecture.
__________________________
That is why, I said that I might not have been clear enough. I was, indeed, conjecturing, based on logical possibilities. However, that is not what the Church teaching is based on.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Let us cease arguing over such things and commit ourselves to prayer for the conversion of the MANY peoples who have no clue of what is coming.
But which places you at odds with RCs which interpret Rome as teaching Prots need conversion, while the feeling is mutual among evangelicals here.
_____________________
There are Catholics who have their own misunderstandings about what the Church teaches and why. That is one of the reasons that recent popes have called for a new evangelization...beginning with those in the pews. The Church actually teaches that those who have accepted Christ as Lord and Savior and are trying to follow Him ARE my brothers and sisters in Christ. I have very good friends who are Evangelicals and we have no problems praying with/for one another. We understand that we have some differences but we don’t focus on that. We focus on the Lord, Jesus and try to be attentive to the guidance of the Holy Spirit. As I have stated before. THAT will become vital in the next few years. Gee...it’s actually vital NOW.
Those of us with ears....need to hear. We need to humble ourselves before our God and let HIM heal the differences. There are millions who need to really HEAR the Good News because of what is ahead of us.
HaHa...One would have to give up Catholicism to do that...
salient...
The statement “a Catholic who does not practice the faith” is rather interesting. Are all Catholics saved? Only Catholicism cs who “practice the faith”? Exactly what part of “practicing the faith” is it that saves? If one does not “practice the faith” are they saved by still being Catholic? If those who are not “practicing the faith” are not saved why do they insist they are still Catholic?
Let's see what God says in the scriptures...
Thy Catholic Church is truth...
NOPE, that's not it...
Joh_17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
Ahhh...There it is...
1Ki_17:24 And the woman said to Elijah, Now by this I know that thou art a man of God, and that the word of the LORD in thy mouth is truth.
The word of God condemns yur religion...And we can see that the word of the Lord, which is truth, is not in your mouth...Therefore..........
Of course! As it is in every instance. Their so called saints are given credit as is Mary. It's always "man" with them.
But Catholics teach to come to 'Mary' for conversion (to your religion) while we pray and teach as the bible does to come to Jesus for salvation...Can't be much unity there...
Jesus went to hell for me. I guess you didn’t read the post I suggested you read or I am misinterpreting the large font as sarcasm. Your statements are hard to define. Don’t assume everyone will understand what or how you are trying to say something.
Mary was not a virgin after the birth of her first Son. She had other children. What is the big deal? Is she on the judgment throne? Did she die for me? Do I have to answer to her? No, I’ll have dinner with her and the rest of her family in heaven/earth.
By the way, Mary, the mother of Jesus, is my sister.
This makes no sense. The Catholic Church through its early Fathers sanctioned the books we call the Bible. They did not fall form the skies. Such was the primary authority of the Church, not some silly corner street FourSquare church pastors throwing out out of context texts from scripture. This is what Rev. Moon, Rev. Jeremiah Wright, Rev. Al Sharpton, Rev. JimJones,Rev. David Koresh, the soapy televangelsist and every other self appointed street preacher from Billy Graham to Tammy Faye Baker to Rev. Schuller do. This is the curse as well as the rot of modern Protestantism that leading Protestant theologians from Protestant colleges and university both in the US and abroad have jumped ship and converted to Catholicism, I trust they know far more than you and I.
Here’s another example.
Dr. Robert Webber who is recognized by many as the authority on worship renewal. He taught at Wheaton College for 32 years as Professor of Theology and has authored over 40 books. Dr. Webber had a “life changing experience” at a Catholic conference center when he decided to receive the Eucharist . His testimony is recorded in a book entitled Signs of Wonder. Following is part of his experience in his own words:
“Closing my eyes, I allowed my life in the church to pass before me. My prejudices rose up within me: What are you doing here? You never worshiped in a Catholic setting, let alone received the bread and the wine from a Catholic priest! Then I heard my Catholic friends speak of their love for Christ, pray with fervency, and express a real desire to know the Scriptures and live by its authority. Those memories said, ‘Go ahead. After all, there is only one Lord, one church, one faith, one baptism, one Holy Communion.’ In that moment, God broke through the walls I had allowed to separate me from my brothers and sisters of different denominations. I am convinced the prejudices we hold and the walls we build between ourselves and other communities of Christians actually block our experience of God’s presence in our lives. Our biases cut us off from the spiritual communion of the fullness of the body of Christ. God dwells in his church, and to reject a part of God’s church is to reject him. Furthermore, rejecting apart of God’s church keeps us from experiencing what the creed calls “the communion of the Saints.” When God broke down my walls, he brought me into richer fellowship with the body of Christ throughout the world. You might say I was surprised by joy! I had never had an experience like that in my life. In that Catholic chapel, a new worship experience had bumped up against that old prejudice of mine, and a new attitude was born. I had taken into myself the experience of another tradition, I had been in dialogue with another worship tradition, and I was surely the richer for it.”
Always trapped by their own words.
But Catholics teach to come to ‘Mary’ for conversion
_________________________________
This is NOT a teaching of the Catholic Church. The Church teaches that Salvation is due to the great sacrifice Christ made on the Cross...to atone for our sins.
Let us simply commit to pray for the salvation of those who have been almost completely secularized by our present culture. Agree?
No Porky Pig, it is not.
It's by works, of course.
Maybe.
If you do the right ones.
All the time.
And if, if, if.....
No certainty of salvation like God has given us in Christ.
The Catholic church just leaves you hanging.
Centurian Cornelius was a Roman soldier much esteemed by the Jews for his kindness. Peter was instructed to preach to him and he converted. I saws you were retired army and liked your clear level posting and saw your name and I remembered the story of Cornelius. I was paying you a compliment!(see acts 10). No insults intended!
“Most of Scripture was established as being so before a church of Rome would presume she was essential for this”
Whether you want to admit or not Christ established the Catholic Church the minute he said “You are Peter and upon this rock I will build my church”.
The NT (that’s the gospel of Jesus Christ if you don’t know), was written AFTER the Catholic Church was established.
The rest of your post is not worth discussing. It’s the same anti-Catholic rhetoric you have posted hundreds of times. It never changes.
1Cor 1:26-29 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called : (27) But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty; (28) And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are: (29) That no flesh should glory in his presence.
Further Christians don’t follow Luther..we follow Jesus Christ. Luther is one of many whose writings we might enjoy...but we sure don’t follow Luther like catholics do the Pope and mary...we don’t bow, we don’t pray to and we sure don’t kiss idols of Luther.
“The Catholic church just leaves you hanging”.
Catholicism is the fullness of the Christian faith. You have to be a tough, dedicated person to be a devout Catholic. It’s not for sissies, never has been. It takes total, complete dedication to be a practicing Catholic that lives their faith. Not all have all the capability to totally give their life to Christ. And that is the reason Catholics fall away from the faith. It’s too hard for them. They wanted to do it their way instead of God’s way. Every lapsed Catholic I have known in my life that came back to the faith said the exact same thing I just said.
The Catechism of the Catholic Church is one of the most beautiful documents ever written. It not only tells you how to be a devout Catholic, but tells you how to live the good life and be a happy, well adjusted member of society.
Whether you want to admit or not Christ established the Catholic Church the minute he said “You are Peter and upon this rock I will build my church”.
Rather, whether you want to admit or not, the church that Christ began is a fundamentally different church, as described, and thus the very Scriptures she claims she gave us reprove her of this, as would Peter.
The NT (that’s the gospel of Jesus Christ if you don’t know), was written AFTER the Catholic Church was established.
Which response once again testifies to either a lack of comprehension or blindness, as nothing you said or can say refutes the fact that "most of Scripture was established as being so before a church of Rome would presume she was essential for this.'
It seems RCs think that either the OT was written after Christ, or that no one could reference Scripture as authoritative until the church of Rome declared what Scripture consisted of, and meant!
The rest of your post is not worth discussing. It’s the same anti-Catholic rhetoric you have posted hundreds of times. It never changes.
Rather, this is just one more non-answer in avoidance of what refutes the polemic behind the oft-parroted "the Catholic church gave you the Bible," and which questions demand an answer, but which RCs do well to avoid answering honestly.
Meanwhile, your posts here in particular remain another argument against being an RC, which is a positive contribution on your part.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.