Posted on 06/27/2014 3:58:36 PM PDT by NYer
Two prominent Fort Worth-based Christian ministers led a delegation of Evangelical Christian leaders to Rome to meet privately with Pope Francis.
James and Betty Robison, co-hosts of the Life Today television program, and Kenneth Copeland, co-host of Believer’s Voice of Victory, met the Roman Pontiff at the Vatican on Tuesday. The meeting lasted almost three hours and included a private luncheon with Pope Francis.
Mr. Robison told the Fort Worth Star Telegram, “This meeting was a miracle…. This is something God has done. God wants his arms around the world. And he wants Christians to put his arms around the world by working together.”
Mr. Robison said he was impressed by Pope Francis’ humility and courtesy to the visiting delegation of Evangelical Protestant Christian leaders.
In a written statement, Mr. Robison said he believes “the prayers of earnest Christians helped lead to the choice of Pope Francis.” He described Jorge Mario Bergoglio, the Argentine Archbishop chosen as Pope, as “a humble man…filled with such love for the poor, downtrodden…”
In addition to Mrs. Betty Robison, the high-profile Protestant delegation included Kenneth Copeland, co-founder of Kenneth Copeland Ministries in Newark, TX; Reverend Geoff Tunnicliff, CEO of the World Evangelical Alliance; Rev. Brian Stiller and Rev. Thomas Schirrmacher, also from the World Evangelical Alliance; and Rev. John Arnott and his wife, Carol, co-founders of Partners for Harvest ministries in Toronto, Canada. Gloria Copeland did not travel to Rome because of a previously scheduled commitment.
The ecumenical meeting in Rome was organized by Episcopal Bishop Tony Palmer. Rev. Palmer is an ordained bishop in the Communion of Evangelical Episcopal Churches, a break-away alliance of charismatic Anglican-Episcopal churches. Bishop Palmer is also the Director of The Ark Community, an international interdenominational Convergent Church online community, and is a member of the Roman Catholic Ecumenical Delegation for Christian Unity and Reconciliation.
Bishop Palmer developed a friendship with Pope Francis when the future Roman Pontiff was a Catholic official in Argentina. Prior to becoming a CEEC bishop, Rev. Palmer was the director of the Kenneth Copeland Ministries’ office in South Africa. He is married to an Italian Roman Catholic woman. He later moved to Italy and began working to reconcile Roman Catholics and Protestants. Kenneth Copeland Ministries was one of Mr. Palmer’s first financial contributors over 10 years ago in support of his ecumenical work in Italy.
Earlier this year, Pope Francis called Bishop Palmer to invite him to his residence in Vatican City. During the meeting, Bishop Palmer suggested that the Pope record a personal greeting on Mr. Palmer’s iPhone to be delivered to Kenneth Copeland. Mr. Copeland showed the Papal video greeting to a conference of Protestant ministers who were meeting at Mr. Copeland’s Eagle Mountain International Church near Fort Worth, TX. In the video, Pope Francis expressed his desire for Christian unity with Protestants.
Later, James Robison telecasted the video on his daily TV program, Life Today. “The pope, in the video, expressed a desire for Protestants and Catholics to become what Jesus prayed for — that Christians would become family and not be divided,” Mr. Robison said the response to the video was very positive, and that Pope Francis asked Bishop Palmer whether a meeting could be arranged with Evangelical Protestants seeking Christian unity in the world.
In his written statement released after the Papal meeting, Mr. Robison said he was “blessed to be part of perhaps an unprecedented moment between evangelicals and the Catholic Pope.” He described the Protestant delegation’s private meeting with the leader of the Roman Catholic Church as “an intimate circle of prayerful discussion and lunch to discuss not only seeing Jesus’ prayer answered, but that every believer would become a bold, joy-filled witnesses for Christ.
In describing the ecumenical gathering as a miracle, Mr. Robison said, “This is something God has done. God wants his arms around the world. And he wants Christians to put his arms around the world by working together.”
During the luncheon on Tuesday, Mr. Robison got a high-five from Pope Francis after the Pope and Protestant guests talked about the need for all people to have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. According to the Life Today host, the Roman Pontiff did not know what a high-five was until Bishop Palmer explained it to him in Italian. Mr. Robison said, “The Pope made it very clear that he wanted every believer to become Spirit-filled, joy-filled witnesses.”
Mr. Robison said Pope Francis had written recently, “Too many Catholics look like they’ve been to Lent with no Easter. It’s a mistake for them to look like they’ve been to a funeral” as he challenged Catholics to witness and never try to control the Holy Spirit, but yield to Him.
Mr. Robison said he received a divine call from God to seek Christian unity while he was hospitalized several years ago with a serious staph infection following hip surgery. Robison recalled, “[I] was so weak I could not lift a cup of water to my lips…God got my full attention…He spoke to me through Isaiah 58:6-12 and I saw the importance of living in freedom, touching the suffering, the hungry, poor, and downtrodden. I recognized the promise that our prayers would be answered quickly and we would become a free-flowing stream and a well-watered garden, restoring the foundations upon which we must build. During that time God instructed me to focus my attention on Jesus’ prayer and encouraging others to begin fulfilling it through us in our day.”
During that time, he said, he was impressed by a prayer of Jesus in John 17:21, pleading that all Christian believers be one. “We’ve tried to focus on being an answer to Jesus’ prayer,” Robison said. “We want to see Jesus’ prayer for unity answered in our day.”
Aware that the meeting with the Pope will be troublesome among staunch Protestants, Mr. Robison said he and the other visiting Evangelical Christian leaders talked about diversity and their belief that Roman Catholics and Protestants could work together without compromising their beliefs.
“The world is suffering,” said Robison. “We as Christians have too much love to share without fighting one another.”
Mr. Robison said he and other “respected Evangelical leaders and Spirit-filled Catholics began meeting together to pray for God’s will to be done and to bring true believers together in supernatural unity….We have been commanded to love God with all of our heart and our neighbors as ourselves. The enemy has kept many Christians from loving one another as Christ loves us and have failed to recognize the importance of supernatural unity even with all of the unique diversity.”
Mr. Robison, whose ministry digs water wells and supplies food for impoverished people in third-world nations, recounted that he was christened as a fatherless boy in an Episcopal Church. As an adult, he joined the Southern Baptist Church. In the 1980s, he became one of the first prominent Southern Baptist ministers to openly proclaim he had received the baptism o
He is one of the theologians that I was referring to. He has always been one of the more provocative theologians. In fact, he and then “Cardinal Ratzinger” use to write about various topics in Catholic journals critiquing each others work
It does not prevent the Church and Popes from doing stupid things pastorally and administratively.
“Same goes for Copeland.”
So are you a member of church that follows Copeland or his style of preaching and teaching?, I never had you as a prosperity Pentecostal protestant. I suspected you were at the most extreme Baptist maybe a Reformed Presbyterian.
That question itself is something of a non sequitur, arising as it does from assumptions of your own, that were based not on my own words themselves, but merely your musings or possible assumptions as to what there may be further beyond what I wrote.
I owe you nothing, including explanation, but will say that Copeland in my own eyes and opinion has long been an embarrassment to the true and actual universal church. He was standing there and handy, as included in the subject matter of this thread, my speaking of him be as example for the thoughts I intended to express, as poor as example as he may be in some regards (depending upon who is asked what :^')).
With such as that in mind, if you could but know my meaning (though you may need to further assume or guess, I do admit) then my previous words need no restating.
The intent was meant as food for thought more than anything, other than some notes of humor also hoped to lighten the mood, and further enlighten if possible, more than simply jeer at the likes of Copeland, Popes, or Bishops, who as you rather humorously noted have not been able to destroy the church, regardless of how much effort and how long they have been at it.
Same technique; and you know it.
HArdball!
What’s not to love?
And we Prots get blasted for being our oWn POPE!
By inviting non-Catholics to Rome, I think Pope Francis is following the spirit of Pius XI, and going one step further, inviting them.
Matthew 4:8-9
Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor.
“All this I will give you,” he said, “if you will bow down and worship me.”
Therefore, desiring to remove from the minds of your Eminences, and of all faithful Christians, this vehement suspicion, justly conceived against me, with sincere heart and unfeigned faith I abjure, curse, and detest the aforesaid errors and heresies, and generally every other error, heresy, and sect whatsoever contrary to the said Holy Church, and I swear that in the future I will never again say or assert, verbally or in writing, anything that might furnish occasion for a similar suspicion regarding me; but that should I know any heretic, or person suspected of heresy, I will denounce him to this Holy Office, or to the Inquisitor or Ordinary of the place where I may be. Further, I swear and promise to fulfill and observe in their integrity all penances that have been, or that shall be, imposed upon me by this Holy Office. And, in the event of my contravening, (which God forbid) any of these my promises and oaths, I submit myself to all the pains and penalties imposed and promulgated in the sacred canons and other constitutions, general and particular, against such delinquents. So help me God, and these His Holy Gospels, which I touch with my hands.
I, the said Galileo Galilei, have abjured, sworn, promised, and bound myself as above; and in witness of the truth thereof I have with my own hand subscribed the present document of my abjuration, and recited it word for word at Rome, in the Convent of Minerva, this twenty-second day of June, 1633.
I, Galileo Galilei, have abjured as above with my own hand.
Elsie:
I never said he was not Pope. He is the Pope, the only Pope of the Catholic Church. I respect his authority and role as Pope but again, I preferred Pope Benedict’s style.
I am just part of the laity. I can have my own views about who I like and don’t like for a Bishop. For example, with respect to my local Bishop, I am just neutral. He is ok, but he too is not my style of Bishop. I still recognize his authority as Bishop of the Diocese and don’t leave the Catholic Church because of he is not of the style I care for. So no, I am not my own Pope. Pope Francis is the Pope and I recognize him as such, despite my preference for Benedict’s style, very measured, his writings always were theologically rich, and he was in terms of Liturgical style more of my liking that either Pope Francis or Pope John Paul II.
BlueDragon:
Ok then. The issue I was speaking to was why Pope Francis invited this group of protestants for a visit [assuming that is what happened]. So that was my take on it and I was just offering commentary from a Catholic perspective.
Alternatively, perhaps a visit was requested by this Episcopalian-Pentecostal who dresses in clerical clothing similar to Catholics and Orthodox and he got Copeland and those guys invited. I can’t and will not speak for the motives of why this group of prosperity gospel protestants wanted to meet with the Pope.
Also, I meant no disrespect towards you with the statement whether you were fond of Copeland and his brand of Protestantism. I was just asking a question. You clearly are not. No more on that subject as well.
With an attitude like that, who would want to convert to Catholicism?
I never said ya did...
To MAKE SURE you go to Heaven; silly!
Silly yourself. Catholicism makes no guarantees that you’ll make it.
You just have to wait and find out when you get there.
I am afraid your comment is a non-sequitur.
Beyond that;
I am aware enough of Catholic perspectives, though you of course are free to state or restate those as you will.
Not desiring to break it all down myself (from perhaps both perspectives?) in attempt to unpack and examine the whole entire thing, my own limited words avoided entering into doing that very thing, for the sort of things which are central to my own impressions, in that those are the hinges upon which much could well enough turn, are themselves difficult to fully express without unduly labeling those aspects which are right enough and just, by describing the aspects which are not -- right or fully "just", with these considerations being things of spirit, and discernment of the same.
I may need to beg pardon for myself being so cryptic, but for now that will have to be the way it is, though I do wish to remind any and all, that attempts at mind-reading when aimed towards myself most often fail --- perhaps one or two portions of things (of which there yet many more) may be understood, in that there is not only one 'elephant' (which blind men would attempt to describe) but there is a small herd of them, and other creatures besides. :^')
Who could tell me my mind? Is there a prophet [here on this forum] whom could discern it? Some here I am on similar [enough] wave-lengths with, or can be at times, if past is any prologue. I can understand them often enough, and in turn be understood (for the most part).
But not right here here and now.
No...I do not think you know that which I know...but as to Catholicism itself, and what range of things could be as thoughts there, or perspectives -- I do much understand, disagreeing with *some aspects* not for reason of not understanding particular overall "sense", and where and how things may be perceived to fit together --- which can be difficult to describe -- for the mysterious workings of the body which some Catholics seem to think only they can know of, or that those of their own church do, are much the same far from the narrower confines of Rome, both for ill, and in the last -- towards the good, which only real good being that which is truly Holy, even the Father in Heaven, as Christ himself did say.
You are confusing Heaven with the heavens.
If you believe God created the universe, then he must be outside of time as space, as he is the, what? Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end.
If God resides in Heaven, and the souls of man reside with him, then clearly, those souls are also outside of time and space.
As far as the heavens go, guess who happens to have a world-class observatory? Yeah, that would be the Vatican. It is manned by a former astronomy professor turned priest.
“But I think that this problem – and here I close the parenthesis – should be studied within the framework of matrimonial pastoral care. One of the themes that the Council of Cardinals will consider in the meeting in … October is how to proceed in relation to matrimonial pastoral care. A few days ago I met with the secretary of the Synod of Bishops, for the theme of the next Synod and, speaking … we saw this anthropological theme: how faith helps in the planning of the person, in the family, and enters into the pastoral of matrimony. We are on the way towards a deeper matrimonial pastoral care. This is a problem for many people.”
Francis’s marriage comments could be more significant than anything else he said on the plane
It was Pope Francis who first brought this topic up, not Cardinal Kasper. But now the pope has passed the ball to Kasper to take the lead (and the heat).
That doesn’t answer my question. Let me put it in “yes or no” format.
Whom are you referring to when you say, “us”? Just Roman Catholics: yes or no?
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.