Yes; I've heard of things like that.
Seems the practice has been around a long time...
Posted on 04/18/2014 6:24:00 AM PDT by SeekAndFind
Did Jesus have a wife? According to Karen L. King, an academic from Harvard, the answer might exist in the fragment of an ancient Coptic manuscript. On this slip of papyrus, Jesus is quoted as saying “my wife,” and because of that, King notes, “this fragment seems to be the first case where we have a married Jesus who appears to be affirming that women who are mothers and wives can be his disciples.”
This story broke in 2012 and was immediately qualified by protests from other academics, who claimed the textual fragment King cited was likely a forgery. These protests arose not because King asserted that Jesus had a wife or that mothers and wives could be disciples but because the text King cited was likely bogus.
However, just in time for Holy Week this year, the pesky “Jesus wife” fragment has reemerged, this time with a verification of the fragment’s authenticity and, with it, a possible vindication for King’s claims. At least that’s what the headlines suggest.
Excited newspapers and websites speculate that if the text is actually authentic, might King’s claims about a married Jesus also be true? Before answering that question, we should add some qualifiers. First, King herself clarified that she never intended to present the fragment as evidence that Jesus was married, but merely as evidence that some Christians may have believed that he was. Second, the fragment’s authenticity, even if it were established, would not mean its provenance is the same as that of the canonical Gospels. King claims her tests show it was written four to eight hundred years after the New Testament texts.
One would think these qualifiers would defuse any controversy, but that hasn’t been the case. Sensational stories have incessantly raved that Jesus had a wife, meaning he likely had sex, thus presenting us with a juxtaposition of two realities that perennially vex and stimulate the culture: religion and human sexuality.
To add more heat to the fire, observers have insinuated that if Jesus was married, it proves he was not who the Church claims him to be. The Church’s privileged authority to interpret Christ’s identity and mission therefore collapses. The Church must have been either misguided about Jesus or, worse, guilty of an intentional hoax. This last possibility has fueled pulp-fiction dreams for decades, from Irving Wallace’s The Word to Hugh Schonfield’s The Passover Plot to Dan Brown’s The Da Vinci Code. You would have thought the culture had exhausted this pipe dream by now, but evidently not. The rabbit hole only grows longer.
All of that said, what’s most problematic about this controversy is that it centers on an uncontroversial question. Christians readily agree that Jesus was and is married, and the Church has always presented him this way. However, the real controversy is about who, precisely, his spouse is — and that question has nothing to do with a papyrus fragment.
The texts of the New Testament, which are far older than the “Jesus wife” fragment, make the extraordinary claim that Jesus of Nazareth speaks and acts in the person of the God of Israel. This is the reason the Gospel of Mark testifies that those who encountered Christ were “amazed and afraid,” and it was for this reason that the charges of blasphemy were leveled against him, accusations that led to his torture and execution. The New Testament authors suggest that Jesus’ claim to divinity was vindicated by the extraordinary event of his resurrection from the dead. Jesus of Nazareth simply is the God of Israel, who has come to his people in a manner that took all of Israel, indeed all of the world, by surprise.
The purpose of this extraordinary revelation was to effect reconciliation between God and the people he had chosen as his own. This relationship is identified in the Old Testament as that of a covenant, and the best way to understand this covenant is to look at it as a kind of marriage between God and his people. Or to say it another way, God’s purpose throughout history was to marry his people.
We see this intention throughout the Biblical narrative. It’s evident in the erotic poetry of the Old Testament Song of Songs. It’s clear in the prophecies of the Book of Hosea, in which God desires reconciliation with an estranged wife. The New Testament uses nuptial imagery in presenting Christ as the long-anticipated bridegroom and the Church as a transformed bride, reconciled to her spouse. Finally, in the Book of Revelation, all things come to their fulfillment in the wedding feast of Christ and the Church.
In other words, Jesus, the God of Israel, has a wife. She is just not the kind of wife we might expect. Her identity becomes clear only once we understand who Jesus of Nazareth was and is. Only then do we see that he married the Church, the people of God.
We don’t need an centuries-old fragment to reveal Jesus’ wife, for we can meet her today wherever the Church resides.
— Father Stephen Grunow is the CEO of Word on Fire Catholic Ministries.
(There seems to be a bit of snarkiness in what Paul has written here...)
It appears that they don't post here often.
Usually it's "Luther was a heretic and his followers are fools."
;^)
You’ve explained it quite well.
There's a story told about a building event a LOOOooong time ago.
Seems some folks were building this REALLY high tower; and...
The same effect is still in the world today.
People argue and fuss about IDENTICAL things, but since they use slightly different words and meanings; each think the other is wrong.
Different 'churches' argue on just HOW to get your name written there; on the page bright and fair.
Yes. The thing John replied when he and his disciples met Jesus along the road:
"Behold; the LAMB of GOD, who (which) takes AWAY the since of the world."
And, at the Last Supper (Passover meal), Jesus remarked about the food (which had been consumed faithfully and ritually, once a year, ever since GOD instituted it) "THIS is my body..."
AHhhh... the old, exclusive "We're Number One!!!" strikes again.
It reads catholic, not Catholic in my book.
Here is a MASS of verses, pointing out the FACT that men should listen to what's been WRITTEN...
NIV Matthew 2:5
"In Bethlehem in Judea," they replied, "for this is what the prophet has written:
NIV Matthew 4:1-11
1. Then Jesus was led by the Spirit into the desert to be tempted by the devil.
2. After fasting forty days and forty nights, he was hungry.
3. The tempter came to him and said, "If you are the Son of God, tell these stones to become bread."
4. Jesus answered, "It is written: `Man does not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.' "
5. Then the devil took him to the holy city and had him stand on the highest point of the temple.
6. "If you are the Son of God," he said, "throw yourself down. For it is written: "`He will command his angels concerning you, and they will lift you up in their hands, so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.' "
7. Jesus answered him, "It is also written: `Do not put the Lord your God to the test.' "
8. Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor.
9. "All this I will give you," he said, "if you will bow down and worship me."
10. Jesus said to him, "Away from me, Satan! For it is written: `Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only.' "
11. Then the devil left him, and angels came and attended him.
NIV Matthew 11:10
This is the one about whom it is written: "`I will send my messenger ahead of you, who will prepare your way before you.'
NIV Matthew 21:13
"It is written," he said to them, "`My house will be called a house of prayer,' but you are making it a `den of robbers.' "
NIV Matthew 26:24
The Son of Man will go just as it is written about him.
NIV Matthew 26:31
Then Jesus told them, "This very night you will all fall away on account of me, for it is written: "`I will strike the shepherd, and the sheep of the flock will be scattered.'
NIV Mark 7:6-7
6. He replied, "Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you hypocrites; as it is written: "`These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me.
7. They worship me in vain; their teachings are but rules taught by men.'
NIV Mark 9:11-13
11. And they asked him, "Why do the teachers of the law say that Elijah must come first?"
12. Jesus replied, "To be sure, Elijah does come first, and restores all things. Why then is it written that the Son of Man must suffer much and be rejected?
13. But I tell you, Elijah has come, and they have done to him everything they wished, just as it is written about him."
NIV Mark 11:17
And as he taught them, he said, "Is it not written: "`My house will be called a house of prayer for all nations' ? But you have made it `a den of robbers.' "
NIV Mark 14:27
"You will all fall away," Jesus told them, "for it is written: "`I will strike the shepherd, and the sheep will be scattered.'
NIV Luke 1:1-4
1. Many have undertaken to draw up an account of the things that have been fulfilled among us,
2. just as they were handed down to us by those who from the first were eyewitnesses and servants of the word.
3. Therefore, since I myself have carefully investigated everything from the beginning, it seemed good also to me to write an orderly account for you, most excellent Theophilus,
4. so that you may know the certainty of the things you have been taught.
NIV Luke 4:17-19
17. The scroll of the prophet Isaiah was handed to him. Unrolling it, he found the place where it is written:
18. "The Spirit of the Lord is on me, because he has anointed me to preach good news to the poor. He has sent me to proclaim freedom for the prisoners and recovery of sight for the blind, to release the oppressed,
19. to proclaim the year of the Lord's favor."
NIV Luke 7:27
This is the one about whom it is written: "`I will send my messenger ahead of you, who will prepare your way before you.'
NIV Luke 10:26
"What is written in the Law?" he replied. "How do you read it?"
NIV Luke 18:31-33
31. Jesus took the Twelve aside and told them, "We are going up to Jerusalem, and everything that is written by the prophets about the Son of Man will be fulfilled.
32. He will be handed over to the Gentiles. They will mock him, insult him, spit on him, flog him and kill him.
33. On the third day he will rise again."
NIV Luke 20:17-18
17. Jesus looked directly at them and asked, "Then what is the meaning of that which is written: "`The stone the builders rejected has become the capstone ' ?
18. Everyone who falls on that stone will be broken to pieces, but he on whom it falls will be crushed."
NIV Luke 21:22
For this is the time of punishment in fulfillment of all that has been written.
NIV Luke 22:37
It is written: `And he was numbered with the transgressors' ; and I tell you that this must be fulfilled in me. Yes, what is written about me is reaching its fulfillment."
NIV Luke 24:44-47
44. He said to them, "This is what I told you while I was still with you: Everything must be fulfilled that is written about me in the Law of Moses, the Prophets and the Psalms."
45. Then he opened their minds so they could understand the Scriptures.
46. He told them, "This is what is written: The Christ will suffer and rise from the dead on the third day,
47. and repentance and forgiveness of sins will be preached in his name to all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.
NIV John 2:17
His disciples remembered that it is written: "Zeal for your house will consume me."NIV John 6:31
Our forefathers ate the manna in the desert; as it is written: `He gave them bread from heaven to eat.' "
NIV John 6:45
It is written in the Prophets: `They will all be taught by God.' Everyone who listens to the Father and learns from him comes to me.
NIV John 12:14-16
14. Jesus found a young donkey and sat upon it, as it is written,
15. "Do not be afraid, O Daughter of Zion; see, your king is coming, seated on a donkey's colt."
16. At first his disciples did not understand all this. Only after Jesus was glorified did they realize that these things had been written about him and that they had done these things to him.
NIV John 15:25
But this is to fulfill what is written in their Law: `They hated me without reason.'
NIV John 20:30-31
30. Jesus did many other miraculous signs in the presence of his disciples, which are not recorded in this book.
31. But these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.
NIV Acts 1:20
"For," said Peter, "it is written in the book of Psalms, "`May his place be deserted; let there be no one to dwell in it,' and, "`May another take his place of leadership.'
NIV Acts 7:42
But God turned away and gave them over to the worship of the heavenly bodies. This agrees with what is written in the book of the prophets: "`Did you bring me sacrifices and offerings forty years in the desert, O house of Israel?
NIV Acts 13:29
When they had carried out all that was written about him, they took him down from the tree and laid him in a tomb.
NIV Acts 13:32-33
32. "We tell you the good news: What God promised our fathers
33. he has fulfilled for us, their children, by raising up Jesus. As it is written in the second Psalm: "`You are my Son; today I have become your Father. '
NIV Acts 15:15-18
15. The words of the prophets are in agreement with this, as it is written:
16. "`After this I will return and rebuild David's fallen tent. Its ruins I will rebuild, and I will restore it,
17. that the remnant of men may seek the Lord, and all the Gentiles who bear my name, says the Lord, who does these things'
18. that have been known for ages.
NIV Acts 23:5
Paul replied, "Brothers, I did not realize that he was the high priest; for it is written: `Do not speak evil about the ruler of your people.' "
NIV Acts 24:14
However, I admit that I worship the God of our fathers as a follower of the Way, which they call a sect. I believe everything that agrees with the Law and that is written in the Prophets,
and I have the same hope in God as these men, that there will be a resurrection of both the righteous and the wicked.
NIV Romans 1:17
For in the gospel a righteousness from God is revealed, a righteousness that is by faith from first to last, just as it is written: "The righteous will live by faith."
NIV Romans 2:24
As it is written: "God's name is blasphemed among the Gentiles because of you."
NIV Romans 3:4
Not at all! Let God be true, and every man a liar. As it is written: "So that you may be proved right when you speak and prevail when you judge."
NIV Romans 3:10-12
10. As it is written: "There is no one righteous, not even one;
11. there is no one who understands, no one who seeks God.
12. All have turned away, they have together become worthless; there is no one who does good, not even one."
NIV Romans 4:17
As it is written: "I have made you a father of many nations." He is our father in the sight of God, in whom he believed--the God who gives life to the dead and calls things that are not as though they were.
NIV Romans 4:23-24
23. The words "it was credited to him" were written not for him alone,
24. but also for us, to whom God will credit righteousness--for us who believe in him who raised Jesus our Lord from the dead.
NIV Romans 8:36
As it is written: "For your sake we face death all day long; we are considered as sheep to be slaughtered."
NIV Romans 9:13
Just as it is written: "Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated."
NIV Romans 9:33
As it is written: "See, I lay in Zion a stone that causes men to stumble and a rock that makes them fall, and the one who trusts in him will never be put to shame."
NIV Romans 10:15
And how can they preach unless they are sent? As it is written, "How beautiful are the feet of those who bring good news!"
NIV Romans 11:7-10
7. What then? What Israel sought so earnestly it did not obtain, but the elect did. The others were hardened,
8. as it is written: "God gave them a spirit of stupor, eyes so that they could not see and ears so that they could not hear, to this very day."
9. And David says: "May their table become a snare and a trap, a stumbling block and a retribution for them.
10. May their eyes be darkened so they cannot see, and their backs be bent forever."
NIV Romans 11:26-27
26. And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: "The deliverer will come from Zion; he will turn godlessness away from Jacob.
27. And this is my covenant with them when I take away their sins."
NIV Romans 12:19
Do not take revenge, my friends, but leave room for God's wrath, for it is written: "It is mine to avenge; I will repay," says the Lord.
NIV Romans 14:11
It is written: "`As surely as I live,' says the Lord, `every knee will bow before me; every tongue will confess to God.'"
NIV Romans 15:3-4
3. For even Christ did not please himself but, as it is written: "The insults of those who insult you have fallen on me."
4. For everything that was written in the past was written to teach us, so that through endurance and the encouragement of the Scriptures we might have hope.
NIV Romans 15:7-12
7. Accept one another, then, just as Christ accepted you, in order to bring praise to God.
8. For I tell you that Christ has become a servant of the Jews on behalf of God's truth, to confirm the promises made to the patriarchs
9. so that the Gentiles may glorify God for his mercy, as it is written: "Therefore I will praise you among the Gentiles; I will sing hymns to your name."
10. Again, it says, "Rejoice, O Gentiles, with his people."
11. And again, "Praise the Lord, all you Gentiles, and sing praises to him, all you peoples."
12. And again, Isaiah says, "The Root of Jesse will spring up, one who will arise to rule over the nations; the Gentiles will hope in him."
NIV Romans 15:21
Rather, as it is written: "Those who were not told about him will see, and those who have not heard will understand."
NIV 1 Corinthians 1:19
For it is written: "I will destroy the wisdom of the wise; the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate."
NIV 1 Corinthians 1:31
Therefore, as it is written: "Let him who boasts boast in the Lord."
NIV 1 Corinthians 2:9
However, as it is written: "No eye has seen, no ear has heard, no mind has conceived what God has prepared for those who love him" --
NIV 1 Corinthians 3:19-20
19. For the wisdom of this world is foolishness in God's sight. As it is written: "He catches the wise in their craftiness" ;
20. and again, "The Lord knows that the thoughts of the wise are futile."
NIV 1 Corinthians 4:6
Now, brothers, I have applied these things to myself and Apollos for your benefit, so that you may learn from us the meaning of the saying, "Do not go beyond what is written." Then you will not take pride in one man over against another.
NIV 1 Corinthians 9:9
For it is written in the Law of Moses: "Do not muzzle an ox while it is treading out the grain." Is it about oxen that God is concerned?
NIV 1 Corinthians 10:7
Do not be idolaters, as some of them were; as it is written: "The people sat down to eat and drink and got up to indulge in pagan revelry."
NIV 1 Corinthians 10:11
These things happened to them as examples and were written down as warnings for us, on whom the fulfillment of the ages has come.
NIV 1 Corinthians 14:21
In the Law it is written: "Through men of strange tongues and through the lips of foreigners I will speak to this people, but even then they will not listen to me," says the Lord.
NIV 1 Corinthians 15:45
So it is written: "The first man Adam became a living being" ; the last Adam, a life-giving spirit.
NIV 1 Corinthians 15:54
When the perishable has been clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality, then the saying that is written will come true: "Death has been swallowed up in victory."
NIV 2 Corinthians 1:13-14
13. For we do not write you anything you cannot read or understand. And I hope that,
14. as you have understood us in part, you will come to understand fully that you can boast of us just as we will boast of you in the day of the Lord Jesus.
NIV 2 Corinthians 4:13-14
13. it is written: "I believed; therefore I have spoken." With that same spirit of faith we also believe and therefore speak,
14. because we know that the one who raised the Lord Jesus from the dead will also raise us with Jesus and present us with you in his presence.
NIV 2 Corinthians 8:15
as it is written: "He who gathered much did not have too much, and he who gathered little did not have too little."
NIV Galatians 3:10
All who rely on observing the law are under a curse, for it is written: "Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law."
NIV Galatians 3:13
Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us, for it is written: "Cursed is everyone who is hung on a tree."
NIV Galatians 4:22
For it is written that Abraham had two sons, one by the slave woman and the other by the free woman.
NIV Galatians 4:27
For it is written: "Be glad, O barren woman, who bears no children; break forth and cry aloud, you who have no labor pains; because more are the children of the desolate woman than of her who has a husband."
NIV Hebrews 10:7
Then I said, `Here I am-- it is written about me in the scroll-- I have come to do your will, O God.'"
NIV 1 Peter 1:15-16
But just as he who called you is holy, so be holy in all you do; for it is written: "Be holy, because I am holy."
NIV 2 Peter 3:16
He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction.
NIV 1 John 2:12-14
12. I write to you, dear children, because your sins have been forgiven on account of his name.
13. I write to you, fathers, because you have known him who is from the beginning. I write to you young men, because you have overcome the evil one. I write to you, dear children, because you have known the Father.
14. I write to you, fathers, because you have known him who is from the beginning. I write to you, young men, because you are strong, and the word of God lives in you, and you have overcome the evil one.
I've invited folks, numerous times, to make a similar list that encourages men to listen to the traditions of men; but nothing ever seems to come of it.
And no one can find anything but RUINS of them today...
Heck... I reveal mine all the time: Wesleyan.
I await flames, but, surprisingly, they never seem to come.
Oh; folks (certain ones anyway) manage to jump all the way back to Luther, and, to figuratively de-finger him and toss him in the Tiber once again; MY present affiliation escapes the wrath that is saved for ALL of Protestantism, collectively.
There is only one true Church. It is made up of all the Saints who have believed and washed their robes in the Blood of Christ. It will be revealed at His coming. And by the way it will be comprised of people from every earthly denomination and a few that belonged to no earthly church.
Even Paul saw only through a glass darkly. No denomination has the power to save you. Only Christ can do that. There are true Christians in all churches, and plenty of those that Christ never knew in all churches as well. Only at His coming will the true Church be revealed.
There's doctrine; and then there is DOCTRINE.
And then there is a WHOLE lot of speculation.
Indeed, you’ve stated it correctly; and left out all the extraneous things that a church, headquartered in Rome, manages to ‘teach’ that ALSO must be ‘believed’.
Yes; I've heard of things like that.
Seems the practice has been around a long time...
John 3:18
Then there are the groups whose 'jesus' does not line up with the One we all know and love.
Mormonism has a differently empowered jesus, as does Jehova's Witnesses, The Way..., Islam... ETC.
I'll bet that FEMALE believers don't think this way!
We've been blessed WAY more than we deserve already...
Habakkuk 3:17-18
Though the fig tree should not blossom And there be no fruit on the vines,
Though the yield of the olive should fail And the fields produce no food,
Though the flock should be cut off from the fold And there be no cattle in the stalls,
Yet I will exult in the LORD, I will rejoice in the God of my salvation.…
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