I know that St. Patrick used a shamrock to explain this. Three leaves but all attached to one stem.
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Posted on 12/22/2013 7:28:20 AM PST by DouglasKC
“The Christian faith has not been tried and found wanting. It has rather been found difficult and left untried.” —Chesterton
I am the Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending.The story of Jesus is either the greatest event in history or the cruelest hoax. If it is a hoax, then the whole of the Christian message crumbles together with the hopes of those multitudes of lives built on his name. The apostle Paul said:
“And if Christ is not risen, then our preaching is empty and your faith is also empty. Yes, and we are found false witnesses of God, because we have testified of God that He raised up Christ, whom He did not raise up; if in fact the dead do not rise. For if the dead do not rise, then Christ is not risen. And if Christ is not risen, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins! Then also those who have fallen asleep in Christ have perished. If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men the most pitiable.” -1 Corinthians 15:14-19 (NKJV)
But if the story is true, then this world has been hit with extraordinary news of earth-shaking consequences. Have you taken the trouble to decide which it is?
In a matter this weighty, it is in your interest to explore the truth or falsity of Christ's claims. Amazingly however, many people who don't believe have never bothered to explore the evidence in support of Jesus,[1] but to the contrary, often run away from it. At the same time, many Christians themselves are not sure, at bottom, whether the claims of their faith are solid. Is the Christian claim a hoax? Is it just wishful thinking? Or is it actually true?
(Excerpt) Read more at christiananswers.net ...
Instead of just repeating yourself, why don't you post the Scripture references to validate your claim?
Even if we agree to disregard the Deity passages in Colossians, Philippians and John, How do you explain this?
Jesus created everything (John 1:3), holds it all together(Col 1:17), received worship (Matt 28:9), forgave sins (Mark 2:5), and raised himself from the dead (John 10:17-18).
All of these actions are attributed to God, and reserved for him. So what does this make Jesus?
John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Who is coming again?
Rev 1:8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.
Paul said that Jesus was Yewah.
Psalm 24:1 A Psalm of David. The earth is of Yah•weh, and the fulness thereof; the world, and they that dwell therein. 1 Corinthians 10:26 For the earth is the Lord's, and the fulness thereof.
Those who deny that jesus is God will rue the day.
Is your point that Jesus in not God and as not being God (in your opinion) could still breathe on the apostles to receive the Holy Spirit?
I know that St. Patrick used a shamrock to explain this. Three leaves but all attached to one stem.
???
You quoted the same verse that I used. Do you mean this isn’t the verse that you were quoting or were you confused? If John 5:19 isn’t the verse you meant, what was it?
Did Jesus, Peter or later Paul rebuke Thomas for this statement?:
John 20:
28 And Thomas answered and said to Him, “My Lord and my God!”
Or do you have an Arian bible that says different? Or perhaps you find a different lexicon in which "God" is omitted in the text?
Yes.
God Bless you and thank you for the reminder of the shamrock! This is how my mother instructed me on the Trinity as a mere lad of 5 when I asked about it. Yes she was raised in Ireland!
It’s OK if you disagree, though no Christian would wish that fate upon you.
I too disagreed for over half my life. It took special circumstances to come about before I realized I was blind. It’s as though no amount of reasoning could alter my opinion, and then one day, WHAM! I could see!
I hope that can happen for you, and please don’t take that as condescending, I mean no offense. I truly understand your position. You are probably more sincere than a majority of “posers” in pews.
Keep asking questions of believers and presenting your own views. Those offended are not focused on their purpose as Christians.
I’m glad to hear that.
Supposedly the Messiah (and probably false Messiah) will show up around 2017 based on different things I have been reading.
Let’s put the question to him when he goes public.
“I am trying here to prevent anyone saying the really foolish thing that people often say about Him: I’m ready to accept Jesus as a great moral teacher, but I don’t accept his claim to be God. That is the one thing we must not say. A man who was merely a man and said the sort of things Jesus said would not be a great moral teacher. He would either be a lunatic — on the level with the man who says he is a poached egg — or else he would be the Devil of Hell. You must make your choice. Either this man was, and is, the Son of God, or else a madman or something worse. You can shut him up for a fool, you can spit at him and kill him as a demon or you can fall at his feet and call him Lord and God, but let us not come with any patronising nonsense about his being a great human teacher. He has not left that open to us. He did not intend to. ... Now it seems to me obvious that He was neither a lunatic nor a fiend: and consequently, however strange or terrifying or unlikely it may seem, I have to accept the view that He was and is God.”
—C. S. Lewis, “Mere Christianity”
How is this for you. Peter says Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the living God. He doesn’t say he is God.
In the three Gospel accounts, after asking about the views of “the multitudes”, Jesus asks his disciples about their own opinion: “But who do you say that I am?” Only Simon Peter answers him: “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God”.[1][11]
Only in Matthew 16:17 Jesus blesses Peter for his answer, and later indicates him as the rock of the Church. This begins with:
Blessed art thou, Simon Bar-jonah: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father who is in heaven.
Anyone may post on an “open” Religion Forum thread. That said, Greetings_Puny_Humans, if your pinging the same poster over-and-again with your comments is causing disruption then it is best to post to “all” or some other poster on the thread.
Merry Christmas!
:) (((((Hugs)))))
And another thing about Trinitarians is that many believe a person cannot be saved unless they believe Jesus is God. This flies in the face of the fact that the thief on the cross WAS saved,yet he heard and knew Nothing about the Trinity.
He was repentant and saw that Jesus was a good man who did not deserve to die and asked Him to remember him when He came into his kingdom.
Thanks I love that quote. Have not seen it in years, so great post. God Bless and Merry Christmas!
nope..you miss it..they were one and the same because they have the same spirit. But Jesus subjected himself to God. The very word father connotes power over the son. There is a very severe brainwashing going on in today’s church, and it was all foreseen...apostasy. Period.
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