Posted on 09/19/2013 5:41:50 PM PDT by James R. Aist
The world rejected Jesus, and it rejects His followers as well.
Quote:
Well, instead of just saying *I’m right, you’re wrong*, how about explaining where and why you think you’re right and others are wrong.
Nobody is going to take your say so on the matter unless you have something, preferably Scripture, to back it up.
_________________________________________
Good point. I’m not sure if you saw the Scriptures that I used to back up what I said:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/3068921/posts?page=8#8
Yes, you did at that. Good post, BTW.
You do realize that I was not addressing you, don’t you? I had courtesy pinged you because you were one of the ones being told you were wrong with nothing to substantiate it.
Quote:
1010RD pointed out your errors. Let me try and set you straight as well. But on just one issue.
You said; “The thief on the cross was saved without water baptism.”
And I say; “So what?” The thief on the cross was no different than Abraham or Moses or the prophets who also died prior to Pentecost. But after Pentecost when they asked “What must we do to be saved”? Acts 2:38 and many more verses point out the need to be baptized in order to be saved.
________________________________________
________________________________________
Just a few of the many post-Pentecost Scriptures that teach that we receive the free gift of eternal life by faith in Christ as Savior:
Acts 16:31
BELIEVE in the Lord Jesus and you will be saved
Acts 10:43
Every one who BELIEVES in him receives forgiveness of sins through his name.
Ephesians 1:13
In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation — having also BELIEVED, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise.
Ephesians 2:8
For by grace you have been saved through FAITH; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God.
Romans 5:1
Therefore being justified by FAITH, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ
Romans 5:2
Through him we have also obtained access by FAITH into this grace in which we stand, and we rejoice in hope of the glory of God.
Romans 4:5
But to him who does not work, but BELIEVES on him who justifies the ungodly, his FAITH is counted for righteousness.
____________________________________________________
Does Acts 2:38 teach baptismal regeneration and salvation by works?
Acts 2:38
Then Peter said to them, “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
Here’s some helpful commentary from Dr. Robert Dean of http://www.deanbible.org -
Hebrews series - Lesson 60 - excerpt from transcript:
... This is an extremely complex Greek construction in this passage. And it is poorly translated in the English. It makes this phrase in the middle “let each of you be baptized in the name of Christ for the forgiveness of your sins” as if that is a second command after repent. Actually repent is a second person plural imperative. That means – y’all repent.
Do you see in that last phrase? That is a second person plural. Am I making myself clear? The “you” in the middle - what do you think that “you” is? That is a singular you. It starts with a second person plural (repent). Then it goes to a second person singular; then it goes back to a second person plural. To make it a little clearer in the English it is…
Literal translation: Repent and each of you will receive the Holy Spirit. Then be baptized in the name of the Holy Spirit on the account of the forgiveness of your sins.
That is how it should be understood. It has the idea of on the account or because of the forgiveness of your sin. We receive forgiveness when we put our faith in Christ. That is what Peter is saying here by repent. He is indicating changing your mind about who Jesus is. He just got finished talking to the Jews about how they crucified Jesus as the Messiah and rejected Him. Now they need to change their minds and accept Jesus as their Savior. As a result of that they too would receive the gift of the Holy Spirit just as they did and then subsequent to that “let each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ.”
Oops! Sorry, metmom. Been busy and haven’t had time to read the whole thread and was just trying to answer posts addressed to me. Thanks!
It’s really not difficult.
“This is an extremely complex Greek construction in this passage”. Oh, puh-leaze.
Can you be saved without repenting? What about being saved but not actually believing?
Yes, I can cherry-pick scripture afer scripture outlining verses that do not mention repentance or faith or baptism or whatever. But when I look at the simple basic plan of salvation found throughout the Bible - and I look at the dozens of examples of those being saved in Acts - I see baptism.
Those who would preach salvation is acheived by praying “The Believers Prayer”, or teach baptism is not essential unto salvation teach a false doctrine.
It’s. Just. That. Simple.
Not being perfect, but following and being obedient to the commands of God and repenting when we do sin is a sign we indeed are saved. We desire to do the will of God and tell others about Jesus and believing the Word of God.
We are to tell others. ... “GO and tell Thy brethren”
As did these translators made Passover into Easter, does not make them correct. Nicodemus was unlearned and did not understand what he was being told... hallmark of the sect of Pharisees. No need to continue their errors.
Amen. And we are to “go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.”
Why? Why, why, WHY do so many Christian have a problem with that - I do not know.
We can never pay God for what Jesus did for us on the cross. How can we even begin to pay for the love of God and the grace of God where Jesus would become a sacrifice for us and become our sin-bearer? That’s why throughout all of eternity we’re going to be debtors to God, and that’s why I think Heaven is going to be so filled with praises is that we are going to see more beautifully than we can even imagine here on earth the fact that we were saved by God’s grace and entirely by God’s grace.
Amen!
Because only Protestants condemn others to Hell, as if that was their job, responsibility and a Christian thing to do!
English translations of the Bible are not infallible, so yes, it’s important to look at the original languages of Scripture. The quote that I posted didn’t merely allege that Acts 2:38 involves an “extremely complex Greek construction,” but backed up that statement by explaining the particulars. Here’s more about the unusual construction of the verse:
Acts 2:38, “Then Peter said to them, ‘You (in the Greek, ‘you’ is plural) turn to God, for the forgiveness of your (in the Greek, ‘your’ is plural) sins; and you (in the Greek, ‘you’ is plural) shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit (and let every one of you [in the Greek, this switches to the singular] be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ).’”
A correct understanding of the meaning of the Greek:
“Repent (change your mind, turn to God) and each of you will receive the Holy Spirit. Then be baptized in the name of the Holy Spirit on the account of the forgiveness of your sins.”
You wrote: “Can you be saved without repenting?”
To repent is the Greek word metanoeo which means to change
your mind, to turn. Repentance is a change of mind, which involves changing from unbelief to belief in Christ as one’s Savior. The issue is believing in Christ as one’s Savior.
You wrote: “What about being saved but not actually believing?”
Faith in Christ as Savior is the way of salvation taught by Scripture. I previously posted just a few of the many verses that teach this wonderful truth:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/3068921/posts?page=8#8
However, if one dies before reaching the point of accountability - for example, a young child who dies before reaching accountability, or a person who never reaches accountability due to mental deficiency - then that individually is saved automatically.
But for those of us who do reach accountability, Scripture is clear that the issue is believing in Jesus Christ as one’s Savior. He died on the cross to pay the penalty for our sins. Our sins were poured out on Him and judged by God the Father. God offers the free gift of eternal life to all who believe in Jesus Christ as Savior.
You wrote: “Those who would preach salvation is acheived by praying ‘The Believers Prayer’, or teach baptism is not essential unto salvation teach a false doctrine.”
The first part of your statement is correct. Nowhere does Scripture say that one must say a prayer in order to be saved.
The rest of your statement is a misunderstanding. The ritual of water baptism is not necessary for salvation. However, the baptism by means of God the Holy Spirit is something that God does for every Church Age believer.
In order to interpret correctly the book of Acts, we need to realize that it’s a transitional book, describing what took place during that unique phase of the Church Age prior to the completion and circulation of the canon of Scripture. There are things in the book of Acts, pertaining for example to the baptism by means of the Holy Spirit, that are sometimes misconstrued as establishing a precedence for what should be normative now.
Here’s an excellent verse-by-verse series on the book of Acts:
http://deanbible.org/andromeda.php?q=f&f=/Audio%20Files/2010%20-%20Acts
This is an ongoing series that can be downloaded or live-streamed, free of charge. Live-stream link here: http://deanbible.org
In my post above re Acts 2:38, sorry, I wrote “baptized in the name of the Holy Spirit” when I meant to say “baptized in the name of Jesus Christ.”
By the way, if you don’t mind my asking, what does “Responsibility2nd” mean? Thanks.
The one's saying "Works are required for Salvation" in these threads will be surprised!
Those unnamed bible guys who asked Jesus sure wanted to know; and He told them.
RE: post 94. You overcomplicate things. Back to my example of the Great Commission. If Jesus commands us to baptize, and we clearly see salvation is acheived in various commands to repent or believe or confess or BAPTIZE or whatever - then I ask HOW DARE YOU delete the word of God to suit your beliefs?
RE: post 95. I was Responsibility1st. That changed in 2005, so I just moved from 1st to 2nd. No other reason.
Then do Mankind a favor;
YOU produce a CORRECT translation or else be blamed for a LOT of souls going to Hell.
HERETIC!
Please!
Share some more!!
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.