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Where Does the Bible Say We Should Pray to Dead Saints?
catholic-convert ^ | July 11, 2012 | Steve Ray

Posted on 07/14/2013 3:02:43 PM PDT by NYer

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To: presently no screen name

Does the church of presently no screen name have an address?


621 posted on 07/15/2013 3:07:17 PM PDT by JCBreckenridge ("we are pilgrims in an unholy land")
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To: JCBreckenridge
I attend St. Ignatius’ parish in Austin, although by Territorial boundaries (as I recently moved) put me in Holy Cross.
I usually go to the 5pm service unless I’ve got things to do that day, when I go to the 11.30 service.
You can find me about pew 6 or 7 in the middle, or in the left-most pew 6 or 7 back.
I last confessed the 30th of June.
Ok - now you’re up!

Amazing. You haven't sinned since June 30th?

You've already been told what I believe, if you're interested in having an intelligent discussion about what I believe.

622 posted on 07/15/2013 3:11:42 PM PDT by Alex Murphy ("...Someone handed the keys to the Forum to the OPC and its sympathizers...")
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To: Alex Murphy

How hard is it to say, “I’m Reformed”?

I’m sorry that you feel people asking, “what are your beliefs” is construed as a personal attack. It’s not.

And besides, the original post wasn’t directed at you.


623 posted on 07/15/2013 3:17:16 PM PDT by JCBreckenridge ("we are pilgrims in an unholy land")
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To: Alex Murphy

“Amazing. You haven’t sinned since June 30th?”

You asked, “when was the last time I went to confession”.

The answer is, “June the 30th”. 2 weeks ago.

Have I sinned since then, yes, I have.

Now, since you’ve asked what congregation I attend, I’ll ask you the same questions.

What congregation of Reformed do you attend? When do you attend? Which service do you attend?


624 posted on 07/15/2013 3:19:35 PM PDT by JCBreckenridge ("we are pilgrims in an unholy land")
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To: JCBreckenridge
How hard is it to say, “I’m Reformed”?

What part of "I'm Reformed" did you not find in The Westminster Confession of Faith?

I’m sorry that you feel people asking, “what are your beliefs” is construed as a personal attack. It’s not.

And I'm sorry that you failed in your attempt at mind-reading. I've never construed the question “what are your beliefs” to be a personal attack.

625 posted on 07/15/2013 3:29:23 PM PDT by Alex Murphy ("...Someone handed the keys to the Forum to the OPC and its sympathizers...")
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To: Alex Murphy

Ok, so how’re them questions coming along?


626 posted on 07/15/2013 3:32:46 PM PDT by JCBreckenridge ("we are pilgrims in an unholy land")
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To: editor-surveyor

Indeed!


627 posted on 07/15/2013 3:35:58 PM PDT by .45 Long Colt
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To: JCBreckenridge
Now, since you’ve asked what congregation I attend, I’ll ask you the same questions. What congregation of Reformed do you attend? When do you attend? Which service do you attend?

There is no such body as a "congregation of Reformed". Did you mean "member congregation of The Reformed Church In America"? I don't attend services under that denomination, FWIW, but I did attend services and offered worship just yesterday at 10:45. Communion offered and received too, FWIW.

628 posted on 07/15/2013 3:41:52 PM PDT by Alex Murphy ("...Someone handed the keys to the Forum to the OPC and its sympathizers...")
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To: Alex Murphy

“I don’t attend services under that denomination”

So where DID you attend?


629 posted on 07/15/2013 3:46:13 PM PDT by JCBreckenridge ("we are pilgrims in an unholy land")
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To: JCBreckenridge

What gibberish!

My church is magically connected to the universal body of believers known as Christians. We are connected in Christ. My particular flavor happens to be baptist and reformed. After reading about the millions of Christians slaughtered by Rome, you can move on and study the history of baptists and the doctrines of the Reformation if you find it interesting.

And it’s not me or some mystical barrier that separates Catholic and Christian, it’s Rome herself. It’s the many of truths of Scripture trod under the foot of Rome. It’s Rome’s pagan invention. It’s the gospel that divides us. We have two different gospels! Why would Rome even want unity with those anathematized at Trent?


630 posted on 07/15/2013 3:51:45 PM PDT by .45 Long Colt
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To: .45 Long Colt

“mystical barrier that separates Catholic and Christian, it’s Rome herself.”

So you believe that Catholics themselves believe that protestants are not Christians? This is not true.

“Why would Rome even want unity with those anathematized at Trent?”

Because we believe you are Christians and that there is just one Church, under Jesus Christ.


631 posted on 07/15/2013 3:55:10 PM PDT by JCBreckenridge ("we are pilgrims in an unholy land")
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To: JCBreckenridge
So where DID you attend?

The name of the church I attend is (unfortunately for you) specific enough in name, that IMO neither you nor the government have any legitimate need to know.

But let's assume that you had a need, for the sake of argument. You know the creed that I profess. What specific, additional value would the name of my church pass on to you, given that you already know WHAT I believe?

632 posted on 07/15/2013 4:03:05 PM PDT by Alex Murphy ("...Someone handed the keys to the Forum to the OPC and its sympathizers...")
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To: JCBreckenridge; .45 Long Colt
“Why would Rome even want unity with those anathematized at Trent?”

Because we believe you are Christians and that there is just one Church, under Jesus Christ.

I can think of at least one solution for that:
What does a Roman Catholic need to do to join the Orthodox Presbyterian Church?

633 posted on 07/15/2013 4:07:25 PM PDT by Alex Murphy ("...Someone handed the keys to the Forum to the OPC and its sympathizers...")
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To: JCBreckenridge

“That’s your standard, not mine.”

Then I encourage you to step up to inspired truth!

“Where’s the justification for your beliefs that X is bad?”

I never said it was bad. I said it wasn’t a Christian practice, not an Apostolic Tradition and not in Holy Writ.

“Where’s the statements from Church fathers that X is bad?”

I love that approach. You’ve got nothing but dead air and you want me to prove it isn’t bad. Hardly. My claim was never that it was bad. My claim is that it isn’t a Christian practice. The article claims it is - with no proof. Where’s the beef. You have to support them. You are making a truth claim in the article that praying to departed saints is a valid Christian practice. Prove it. I do not have to disprove your unsupported claims.

“Oh, that’s right, your fathers believe that Catholics are the whore of Babylon which automatically makes everything we do wrong. We’re supposed to magically believe that if the Bible says nothing about it that the Catholic church is automatically wrong. Odd that, eh?”

I have no “fathers”. Nor do you know what I am other than a believer in the Lord Jesus Christ. I’ve never made the claims you just described. It would appear that being caught short of proof- of which you’ve offered zilch - now you want to attack me because I am asking you to prove your claims.


634 posted on 07/15/2013 4:10:41 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( “The more corrupt the state, the more numerous the laws.” - Tacitus)
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To: Alex Murphy

Wow! Has it really been 8 years since that thead was started!?!


635 posted on 07/15/2013 4:13:03 PM PDT by Gamecock ("Ultimately, Jesus died to save us from the wrath of God." R.C. Sproul)
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Comment #636 Removed by Moderator

To: Greetings_Puny_Humans; SumProVita
Presumably the Old Testament always existed.

Seriously, you really meant to say something this obviously wrong? You mean the OT predated Moses who is credited with writing the first 5 books, How about Isiah, Jeremiah and Malachi which is the last book of the OT.

You are so silly when you try to pretend you have even the slightest clue.

637 posted on 07/15/2013 4:33:07 PM PDT by verga (A nation divided by Zero!)
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To: count-your-change
But then again FR is a discussion forum. not a dating service.

Indeed, quite a contrast!

638 posted on 07/15/2013 4:33:41 PM PDT by daniel1212 (Come to the Lord Jesus as a contrite damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save you, then live 4 Him)
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To: verga

I have no clue what you’re talking about or what you’re trying to dispute. I’m sure it’s only something that makes sense in your own mind.


639 posted on 07/15/2013 4:35:50 PM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans
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To: HarleyD
So the question is should we be praying to anyone (or anything) that is not truly holy?

"My soul, wait thou only upon God; for my expectation is from him. He only is my rock and my salvation: he is my defence; I shall not be moved. " (Psalms 62:5-6)

"Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus, " (Hebrews 10:19)

...to meet directly with God, not via saintly sectaries. Now to do so better.

640 posted on 07/15/2013 4:39:27 PM PDT by daniel1212 (Come to the Lord Jesus as a contrite damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save you, then live 4 Him)
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