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WHY ARE OUR CATHOLIC LAITY SO ILLITERATE WHEN IT COMES TO THE CATHOLIC FAITH
Southern Orders ^ | May 31, 2013 | Fr. Allan J. McDonald

Posted on 05/31/2013 2:44:05 PM PDT by NYer

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To: Natural Law
The biggest failure of the Church over the last 50 years has been poor catechesis. As a result too many Catholics are in fact practicing Protestants believing that they and their consciences can determine Truth and declare their own Salvation if they are a "good person".

Too many parents and too many Faith Formation personnel believe that Confirmation means graduation from catechism and we are losing people at the most critical time in their formation, their teen years. Too often we don't see them again until they are shopping for a parish that will marry them and then not again until Grandma insists that the babies get baptized.

When we look at the religious education materials, as compared to the high school texts and materials we see the equivalent of comic books, concentrating on "hip" imagery and void of any real theological content. Banners and Balloons are not what young adults need when they are first learning about and struggling with the temptations of all of that new hard ware they just grew and the social and peer pressure to take it for a test drive.

To get this thread back on track and answering the original question appropriately from a Catholic POV, I vote this best post. The only thing I would add is that the poor catechesis we're experiencing isn't just in CCD class. It's at Mass as well. Too many of our priests give watered down versions of our Faith. Probably afraid of upsetting the apple cart. It's not just the kids that are being poorly catechized.

981 posted on 06/02/2013 2:29:36 PM PDT by piusv
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans
What I’m actually surprised about is that you are unaware that Christ and the Bible teach on marriage and divorce.

Why don't you tell me. How many times may someone marry and divorce? The Bible does talk about contraception ... but where is that pesky in vitro fertilization?

“it is not good that man should be alone.” Evidently a command ignored by the RCC in their establishment of a celibate Priesthood.

It may surprise you to learn that the Catholic Church allows for married priests. Celibacy is a discipline chosen by others, like Paul.

Obviously a plan that backfired, considering all the molester Priests working in all those charitable organizations setup by the RCC.

You need to update your dossier. Report: Protestant Church Insurers Handle 260 Sex Abuse Cases a Year

Awareness Center

Worse still, is the sex abuse of children in the education system.

WHEN BOYS ARE MOLESTED BY TEACHERS AND OTHERS IN POSITIONS OF AUTHORITY

And then there are the camp counselors, Big Brothers of America, Boy Scouts of America and the list goes on and on. There is plenty of guilt to go around.

982 posted on 06/02/2013 2:33:21 PM PDT by NYer ( "Run from places of sin as from the plague."--St John Climacus)
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To: RPTMS; Elsie
The thing is, you only think you're right. We know we're right.

Know you're right about what?

There isn't a Catholic around who is sure of making it to heaven. Officially, Catholicism claims it is the only true church and the way to get to heaven, and yet can't even guarantee that it works.

So one becomes a Catholic and does all that for their life for what? To burn anyway because they missed something, like going to mass one day and forgot to confess it?

That's not being saved.

983 posted on 06/02/2013 2:38:44 PM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: JCBreckenridge

I’ve posted the Scripture to show that sin comes through the man. Go back and read it.


984 posted on 06/02/2013 2:39:45 PM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: JCBreckenridge

Sure she sinned, but it wasn’t until Adam ate that the eyes of them were both opened and sin entered the world.

Sin enters through the man because Adam wasn’t deceived.


985 posted on 06/02/2013 2:40:48 PM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: Natural Law
So man's sin was in permitting a woman to sin. Can you imagine the treatment some poor guy would get if he tried to tell some of the women on this thread what was and was not acceptable behavior? The term "hell to pay" doesn't come close to what I imagine it would be.

Man's sin was because he ate.

Maybe Catholics are better off with the magisterium interpreting Scripture for them considering the ob I see them doing all on their own.

986 posted on 06/02/2013 2:42:46 PM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: NYer; sasportas

Luke 18:10 Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican. 11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican. 12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess. 13 And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner. 14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.


987 posted on 06/02/2013 2:45:39 PM PDT by CynicalBear (For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ)
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To: NYer
First of all, thank God for the Catholic Church. Guided by the Holy Spirit, we compiled the Bible. With God‟s grace, we started hospitals to care for the sick. We establish orphanages, and help the poor. We are the largest charitable organization on the planet, bringing relief and comfort to those in need. We educate more children than any other scholarly or religious institution. We developed the scientific method. We founded the college (university) system. We defend the dignity of all human life, and uphold marriage and family. Ours is one family united in Jesus Christ, our Lord and Savior.

Luke 18:9-14 9 He also told this parable to some who trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and treated others with contempt: 10 “Two men went up into the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. 11 The Pharisee, standing by himself, prayed thus: ‘God, I thank you that I am not like other men, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even like this tax collector. 12 I fast twice a week; I give tithes of all that I get.’ 13 But the tax collector, standing far off, would not even lift up his eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, ‘God, be merciful to me, a sinner!’ 14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified, rather than the other. For everyone who exalts himself will behumbled, but the one who humbles himself will be exalted.”

988 posted on 06/02/2013 2:47:17 PM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: Rashputin; metmom
>> Making the flat statement that God CANNOT do something. Disgusting.<<

Oh really? Can God sin or disobey His own laws?

989 posted on 06/02/2013 2:48:49 PM PDT by CynicalBear (For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ)
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Comment #990 Removed by Moderator

To: NYer

“Why don’t you tell me. How many times may someone marry and divorce?”


Figure it out for yourself, it’s not like it isn’t in there for you to read:

Mat 19:4-9 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, (5) And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? (6) Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. (7) They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away? (8) He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. (9) And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.

Mat 5:31-32 It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement: (32) But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.

1Co 7:10-15 And unto the married I command, yet not I, but the Lord, Let not the wife depart from her husband: (11) But and if she depart, let her remain unmarried, or be reconciled to her husband: and let not the husband put away his wife. (12) But to the rest speak I, not the Lord: If any brother hath a wife that believeth not, and she be pleased to dwell with him, let him not put her away. (13) And the woman which hath an husband that believeth not, and if he be pleased to dwell with her, let her not leave him. (14) For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy. (15) But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases: but God hath called us to peace.

“It may surprise you to learn that the Catholic Church allows for married priests. Celibacy is a discipline chosen by others, like Paul.”


This is only allowed as exceptions, particularly with converts. It is not the rule. The RCC does not allow for married men to become Priests, or for a Priest to marry. The exception in minor cases does not void the fact that it is generally forbidden. The scripture considers the Marriage bed Holy, and no “discipline” of celibacy was ever commanded for any evangelist. It was merely suggested by Paul during a time when they were always on the move, and under the threat of persecution. Paul stated himself:

1Co 7:6-7 But I speak this by permission, and not of commandment. (7) For I would that all men were even as I myself. But every man hath his proper gift of God, one after this manner, and another after that.

Then again, the scripture does not teach anything about any special office of the Priesthood, since all Christians are regarded as Priests already.

“You need to update your dossier. Report: Protestant Church Insurers Handle 260 Sex Abuse Cases a Year”


There is no centralized “Protestant Church,” where its members claim to be THE voices of God on Earth, who hold the body of Christ and insert it into the mouths of the faithful, and are able to forgive sin, or are shuffled about from one diocese to another whenever they get in trouble. My church has never had a single sex abuse case in its history.

Your guilt is institutional, for us, there is no general institution.


991 posted on 06/02/2013 2:54:17 PM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans
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Comment #992 Removed by Moderator

To: Rashputin
Making the flat statement that God CANNOT do something. Disgusting.

Sure there are things God cannot do.

He cannot lie. He cannot change. He cannot be faithless and deny Himself.

Hebrews 6:17-18 17 So when God desired to show more convincingly to the heirs of the promise the unchangeable character of his purpose, he guaranteed it with an oath, 18 so that by two unchangeable things, in which it is impossible for God to lie, we who have fled for refuge might have strong encouragement to hold fast to the hope set before us.

Malachi 3:6 “For I the Lord do not change; therefore you, O children of Jacob, are not consumed.

2 Timothy 2:10-13 Therefore I endure everything for the sake of the elect, that they also may obtain the salvation that is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory. 11 The saying is trustworthy, for: If we have died with him, we will also live with him; 12 if we endure, we will also reign with him; if we deny him, he also will deny us; 13 if we are faithless, he remains faithful— for he cannot deny himself.

Seems like Catholicism is pretty weak on teaching the true character of God from the Bible they claim they wrote.

993 posted on 06/02/2013 3:00:51 PM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: metmom
A shallow, obvious, attempt to change the subject from the narrow issue of what God can do with what God has created to an issue not in question, the attributes of God, doesn't in any way salvage the lame fantasy theory that was asserted and that I totally smacked down into the garbage where it belongs.

In fact, thank you for trying to change the topic to something not in question because it shows clearly that folks who weave their own Most High and Holy Self Worship fantasies from the Pharisee Approved Luther Subset of Scripture do not and cannot deal with the Truth of Jesus Christ and have to constantly resort to playing their little games.

994 posted on 06/02/2013 4:38:57 PM PDT by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)
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To: Rashputin
I didn't change the topic at all.

The contention you raised was that there was nothing that God could not do.

The exact quote was......

Making the flat statement that God CANNOT do something. Disgusting.

You were shown that indeed there are things that God cannot do by Scripture.

Would you care to address the Scripture I posted instead of throwing out spurious accusations?

BTW, thanks for again confirming that when a Catholic is cornered by the truth of Scripture, the typical knee jerk reaction is to attack the messenger.

995 posted on 06/02/2013 5:17:11 PM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: Elsie

1,000


996 posted on 06/02/2013 5:53:29 PM PDT by Tennessee Nana
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To: Elsie

1,000


997 posted on 06/02/2013 5:53:38 PM PDT by Tennessee Nana
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To: Elsie

1,000


998 posted on 06/02/2013 5:53:46 PM PDT by Tennessee Nana
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To: Elsie

1,000


999 posted on 06/02/2013 5:53:53 PM PDT by Tennessee Nana
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To: Elsie

1,000


1,000 posted on 06/02/2013 5:54:00 PM PDT by Tennessee Nana
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