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To: daniel1212
I did not say as you are suggesting. And what is the hangup with circumcision? Timothy was circumcised by Paul and Titus was not. Why? Because their situations were different. One, Timothy did it our of love and obedience as He was entering God's shepherd-ship and Titus stood firm in that circumcision is not a requirement for receiving the free gift. One can pluck any verse and make it what they want without considering the surrounding text around it and that is what Christendom has done, plucked to make doctrine that fits their fleshly desires. But with that said, as I have said before, our works is evidence of our faith, our belief as one is steered to do and act out that which they believe and that is work manifested is our fruit. Just as it was for Abraham, our father.

Jas 2:17 So also belief, if it does not have works, is in itself dead. 18 But someone might say, “You have belief, and I have works.” Show me your belief without your works, and I shall show you my belief by my works. 19 You believe that Elohim is one. You do well. The demons also believe – and shudder! 20 But do you wish to know, O foolish man, that the belief without the works is dead? 21 Was not Abraham our father declared right by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar? 22 Do you see that the belief was working with his works, and by the works the belief was perfected? 23 And the Scripture was filled which says, “Abraham believed Elohim, and it was reckoned to him for righteousness.” And he was called, “Elohim’s friend.” 24 You see, then, that a man is declared right by works, and not by belief alone. ... 26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so also the belief is dead without the works.

216 posted on 05/14/2013 10:03:39 AM PDT by patlin ("Knowledge is a powerful source that is 2nd to none but God" ConstitutionallySpeaking 2011)
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To: patlin
How can someone be placed “back under” something they were never under before?

That is what the Galatians were in danger of supposing.

For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God. (Romans 2:28-29)

For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God. (Romans 2:28-29)

And certain men which came down from Judæa taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved. (Acts 15:1)

You are no preaching any new heresy. You cannot be under the law without having to be circumcisied as a matter of obedience, but the literal command to do so is clearly abrogated. . As will be explained, saving faith does not mean one must be circumscribed and keep all the law, as the censored Judaizers taught. .

Timothy did it our of love and obedience as He was entering God's shepherd-ship...

Rather, Timothy "would Paul have to go forth with him; and took and circumcised him because of the Jews which were in those quarters: for they knew all that his father was a Greek." (Acts 16:3)

This was wise in accordance with "And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law." (1 Corinthians 9:20)

Timothy was under no obligation to be circumcised as a matter of the obedience of faith, any more than one needs to observe regulations regarding "meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation." (Hebrews 9:10)

And it was thus that foods that were aforetime unlawful due to being unsanctioned or defiled, which typified the Gentiles, are cleansed and lawful. (Acts 10:11-16; Rm. 14:14; 1Tim. 4:3-5) The attempts to negate this are examples of cultic sophistry (like trying to make Rm. 14 to simply refer to meats sold in pagan markers!) .

For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature. (Galatians 6:15)

For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God. (Romans 2:28-29)

as I have said before, our works is evidence of our faith

I have maybe said the latter more than you, as it is true that the faith that appropriates justification without works is of a kind that effects obedience toward its Object, the Lord Jesus. And which works justify one as having saving faith. The issue is whether this means ones is under obligation to literally keep all the law as a matter of the obedience of faith, and the answer to that is manifestly no.

223 posted on 05/14/2013 1:38:25 PM PDT by daniel1212 (Come to the Lord Jesus as a contrite damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save you, then live 4 Him)
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To: patlin
But do you wish to know, O foolish man, that the belief without the works is dead?


HMMMmmm...


Galatians 3

You foolish Galatians, who has bewitched you, before whose eyes Jesus Christ was publicly portrayed as crucified?

This is the only thing I want to find out from you: did you receive the Spirit by the works of the Law, or by hearing with faith?

Are you so foolish? Having begun by the Spirit, are you now being perfected by the flesh?

230 posted on 05/14/2013 4:09:08 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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