But I’m a good Mormon wife: Sean and I had the perfect life. Then his faith started to crumble...

Salon ^ | June 1, 2012 | Maren Stephenson

[Colofornian]

...When Sean replaced his temple garments — the sacred underwear he’d promised to wear day and night — with boxers, I couldn’t take it anymore. It was too much betrayal. I called up a neighbor with a husband like mine and cried. But instead of empathy, she offered questions that stunned me into silence. Was Sean addicted to pornography? Watching R-rated movies? What sin had brought him to this terrible place?

...Her questions were so off-base...She was sincere, and trying to help, but she believed what the Church teaches — that a man would only leave because he’s disobeying the commandments. She couldn’t understand this was a rational inquiry. She saw everything as the result of sin.

...The Church was wrong about him. What else might they be wrong about?...

...I often found him hunched over his iPad reading everything he could find on Mormon origins...“I’m sorry, but I just have to tell you. Did you know that…” and then he’d tell me...About how Joseph Smith mistranslated some Egyptian hieroglyphics that are part of our canonized scripture. About how he translated the Book of Mormon while looking at a stone inside of a hat.

I listened half-heartedly...though I wasn’t about to go looking at them myself...until one night it was about polygamy, my archnemesis.

“Did you know that Joseph Smith married a 14-year-old girl against her will? Did you know that he’d send men on missions and marry their wives in secret when they were gone?” ...he kept talking, a horror growing in my gut. I knew that if Sean was right, then Joseph Smith was a fraud. I saw no difference between his acts and the modern-day acts of Warren Jeffs, whom I abhorred. And if Joseph Smith was a fraud — then what did that make the Church?

[geologist]

Who can possibly read this mess? Not wanting to get arrested, perhaps.?

[Colofornian]

That’s the problem with an “evolved” deity. As in Gnosticism, the progression is infinite. NO god ever fully arrives at the top, no matter how long the struggle. Therefore there is really is no way to be certain whether there might not be an even bigger fish lurking about to upset the whole moral order. Monotheism does not have that problem, and we can therefore believe in and function as a society in which the one and only eternal God has created each of us with those famously unalienable rights which define our freedom. Now this is speculation on my part, but I believe this polytheistic instability in the moral order is directly reflected in the vacillating moral positions of Romney and other big ticket Mormons on, for example, abortion. Gods give life, and gods take away life. If you’re going to be a god someday on Kolob or wherever, with teeming throngs worshipping at your feet, you would be, theoretically, in a position to give or take life. So if a person really believes that megalomaniacal nonsense about themselves, why would it not affect their attitude toward our puny mortal struggles? We are all so inferior to them, after all, not being on the fast track to deification and all that rot. But if necessary to gain power, a public position on any given subject can always be adjusted to current circumstances. Oh, did I just say Etch-a-Sketch? I think I did.

Good post...Here's what I've regularly said re: this...the last part especially winds back to how a no "buck-stops here" god in Mormonism winds up lacking in absolutes:

If people want to understand how Mormonism's approach to the socio-political realm, they may want to read these two articles (the first written by a Mormon; the second by an ex-Mormon):

* Mitt Romney mirrors his Mormon church [Lds writer says Romney flip-flops 'cause Lds church has/does]
* Who is Mitt Romney? [Ex-Lds author reveals why Mitt's wishy-washy culture waffles & flip-flops]

In the first linked article above, Mormon Neal Chandler highlights how in the 19th century...
* Mormons forced communism upon its people -- and then not (United Order)
* Adhered to theocracies under its first two "prophets" -- and then slowly drew back
* Said polygamy was a condition of the highest degree of glory -- and then not
* Encourage its Utah Territory voters to be Democrats -- and then told whole groups of people wholesale to "balance it out" as Republicans as statehood approached
* Excluded blacks -- and then late in the 20th century not

From the second article linked above: What makes Mitt the kind of person he is — ruthlessly opportunistic, dishonest, insincere, willing to say anything for advantage, lacking in conscience, preoccupied with appearance, etc., on the one hand, yet squeaky clean, family-oriented, disciplined, boring, and predictable, on the other? My new e-book, A Mormon Story, sheds light on the culture that produced Mitt Romney.

Good question. (It's one I've raised -- and answered numerous times on various FR threads)

The answer, says this ex-Mormon in the book referenced above is: (From the article): The book reveals a value system that ultimately has no absolutes, other than the need to conform to deep-seated, highly-controlling authoritarianism that pervades LDS culture. That culture emphasizes a Mormon tradition known as "eternal progression" — undoctrinal spiritual evolution in which even God is changing. It also emphasizes the notion that the latest words of governing church leaders trump the Word of God found in the scriptures (including LDS scripture).

IOW, EVERYTHING in Mormonism -- from its theology to its social practices -- is up for potential change at the whim of the Mormon god. Bottom-line: There is no bottom-line in Mormonism! There is no bedrock doctrine that cannot be replaced!

There isn't even an Ultimate god in Mormonism...Nobody knows who the gods are that were part of the council which appointed the god of this world -- a former man, say Mormons.

So there's not even any Ultimate Authority in Mormonism!

[LibLieSlayer]

You did an excellent job. I was just posting back with an attaboy!

Thanks!

LLS

[svcw]

Your question was How many Mormons ran for President before Romney...NONE.

These people all ran for president and they are all mormon.

George Romney

Harry Reid

Orin Hatch

Mitt Romney twice

Joseph Smith

Morris Udall

Ezra Taft Benson

Parley P. Christiansen

Eldridge Cleaver

Sonia Johnson

James G. Gritz

[Elsie]

It looked ok during preview, but I OBVIOUSLY did something wrong..

I reposted the yellow in #150

[Elsie]

Try 150.

Or, SELECT the unreadable text: it’ll change color for you.

[Elsie]

Not wanting to get arrested, perhaps.?

Most everyone gets arrested; usually for traffic tickets.

But just spend a night in the clank?

Now THAT will change yer attitude!

[svcw]

Add John Huntsman to the list, forgot to add him.

[BlueDragon]

Who can possibly read this mess? Not wanting to get arrested, perhaps.?

In his next post, #150, (that's right after his own #149, where an all but entirely unreadable yellow font portion was included) he wrote clearly there, what the yellow seemed to hide.

It is nothing he has not shared here before. One can find (and use) one's very own secret decoder ring by simply right-clicking and dragging over the "yellow" text, highlighting it (most browsers use blue as the default color) which in this instance clearly illuminates the words written there are the same as in #150.

Encouraging subterfuge and misrepresentation on the part of Mormons is the issue in regards to the yellow text. Elsie wasn't trying to hide anything, but as it turns out, it's worked for what I hope is the best, for I've been given the opportunity to give it a "bump", just in case nobody has seen the info before...

[BlueDragon]

I type slow, obviously. The bump took a double bounce, too. Hope nobody spilled their coffee.

Thanks for that previous post to myself [and another], Elsie. What was it, #132 or thereabouts? Hilarious! truly LOL funny.

[SaraJohnson]

Lucy’s Aunt Matilda, too. Don’t forget Matilda! She was a Mormon Presidential candidate, too. ;D

[Elsie]

What was it, #132 or thereabouts?

Probably thereabouts...

[BlueDragon]

Yeah, I see that now. Was just to lazy to go and look, that and I usually have so many tabs open at once I'm half afraid I'm going to blow something up.

[BfloGuy]

You somehow morphed from “anti-Mormonism” to “people”

That's a fair criticism.

[aMorePerfectUnion]

“That’s a fair criticism.”

Just an observation - no criticism intended.

[BfloGuy]

Facts are not Hate.

Of course they aren't and, please, don't twist my comment into claiming that.

[BfloGuy]

Just an observation - no criticism intended.

And no offense taken. I inadvertently engaged in utilitarianism -- if the results are good, then who cares? I criticize that, myself, when I encounter it on other topics.

[T Minus Four]

get ready for a multitude of liberal-based stories making all Mormons into Warren Jeffs

Please explain one single difference between Joseph Smith and Warren Jeffs. And saying "Joseph Smith was a true prophet and Warren Jeffs is not" does NOT count.

[aMorePerfectUnion]

Ah! I found another honest FReeper :-)

Always nice.

[Springfield Reformer]

Thank you all for your kind words. My question is where are all the pastors in this? The much-vaunted Black-Robed Brigade. There should be a national call for Christian pastors of all varieties to get on the same page about the antichrist character of Mormonism, then go back to their congregations and teach them the truth, and begin a massive prayer chain begging God to have mercy on us and give us an alternative while there is still time.

But even my (law school) alma mater, Liberty University, has stepped in it, compromising their stand against false teachers by giving Romney a platform from which to peddle his quest for power.

On a lighter note, someone who obviously knows Liberty pretty well did a Hitler Finds Out spoof that, for a Liberty alumni, is pretty entertaining. For your enjoyment, I present Hitler Finds Out Liberty Students Really Still Don’t Like Romney. Well, that’s what it SHOULD have been titled .... Anyway, here it is ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D33gmGPsAuQ&feature=player_embedded