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If Scirpture is the authority by which the RCC has its authority, then it cannot have more authority than the document (Or person) which gave it that authority.

You have it backward. The Church does not derive it's authority from Scripture; Scripture derives it's authority from the Church.

If Scripture is the authority by which the RCC has its authority, then it cannot have more authority than the document (Or person) which gave it that authority.

Your syllogism is flawed. Since the Church received its authority from God no higher authority is possible or necessary. Scripture itself is not God. Scripture, like the Holy Tradition and the Church draws its authority directly from God.

You have it backward. The Church does not derive it's authority from Scripture; Scripture derives it's authority from the Church.

I combined both responses so that I can address them together because you are both saying the same thing. It is the Roman Catholic Church which USES Holy Scripture to "prove" its authority. Holy Scripture, which even the Catholic Church attests to, IS the Word of God and "all Scripture is given by inspiration of the Holy Spirit". It is GOD-breathed truth revealed to men and recorded in a format that is both accessible as well as transcendent. The Catholic Church claims that "it" wrote Scripture and in the next breath proceeds to quote the verses that it says it has derived its authority. "Thou art Peter and upon this rock I will build my church and the gates of hell will not prevail against it.", the magesterium quotes and then proceeds to interpret from that that only the Roman Catholic Church still has a person sitting on Peter's seat, they're still here ERGO it alone is the One, True Church.

Without the Bible, the Catholic Church would have nothing but its own word to lay claim to being the church Christ established. So this is why I question every time a Catholic makes such statements as, "Scripture derives its authority from the Church". Holy Scripture is the authority by which ALL truth claims must be measured and this was confirmed by ALL the early church fathers and leaders of the first and second century church as well as Scripture ITSELF. Jesus confirmed HIS authority by appealing to Scripture. Without Scripture, the Catholic Church has only its own statements to go on and its own selective history to back up its claims. That is why these few verses are even cited in the first place.

What I think is fundamentally wrong in stating the Church is the authority over Scripture is that they can - and they have - decide whatever they choose is or is not the doctrine of the Christian faith. It no longer is a prerequisite that the doctrines be based on Scriptural grounds and, when that happens, the Church sets itself ABOVE the very Word of God. Now, that may be perfectly acceptable to some people because they have become convinced that their church is always right about everything it says and nothing it proclaims or even does is subject to error. But, by the same token, there are others to whom the Scriptures have preeminence and the Word of God, IT IS WRITTEN, is the authority by which all truth claims are measured. And that makes the church SUBJECT to it and not the other way around.

You have it backward. The Church does not derive it's authority from Scripture; Scripture derives it's authority from the Church.

just......

wow......

The brainwashing is complete.

I guess Jesus didn't know what He was doing when He stated *It is written* as the final authority BEFORE the Catholic church came into existence. Eh?

The Church does not derive it's authority from Scripture; Scripture derives it's authority from the Church.

LolWHUT?