Posted on 01/11/2012 7:34:56 PM PST by RnMomof7
Whatever echoes you hear in your head, your statement that it's the same reasoning is still false. Tintinitis does not necessarily cause poor logic skills.
:)
By your logic you have Christians getting Christ from a babylonian god uncombined.
Same problem.
I’m glad you posted Col 3:5. It shows what I’m talking about. Prayers like what you posted earlier are not “inordinate affection”. And as I’m sure you’d agree, Col 3:5 doesn’t forbid all displays of affection.
You may disagree that the level of affection shown in the prayer you posted isn’t “inordinate”, but you would be ignoring the first post I posted to you on this thread, and what it contains. Thus, if your next post to me is to say something to the effect that, “How can you not say such a prayer is inordinate affection?”, it will be ignored, for ignoring the initial points I made to you and this being a circular argument. Also, any response that complains, “Mary is not the mediator between God and Man therefore you shouldn’t be praying to her anyway” will also be ignored as, not only has the concept of the Communion of Saints been argued as nauseaum here, and I have no desire to be drawn into such a debate, but more to the point, Christ’s status as mediator is not in dispute here, at least not to me.
FYI
"That's quite obviously what you've done,"
In order to support your dogma, you pull out several obscure, unrelated scriptures and gerrymander a thesis. This is why it is so hard to have a coherent discussion with many Catholics, your doctrine doesn't stand up to normal hermeneutics, so you muddy the waters.
It is easier to believe that Joseph and Mary, a normal married couple would have normal sexual relations and normal offspring. Mary would have no special standing whatsoever had she not been chosen by God to bare Christ, it is only because of His merit, not hers.
Mary cannot be the mother of God.
Only if Jesus is not God or Mary is not His mother.
Mary is the mother of Jesus;
Jesus is God;
therefore, Mary is the mother of God.
For "God" substitute: "President of the Student Council" or whatever, and it's the same.
It is a simple, clear, true statement of the Incarnation, fundamental to the Christian faith.
Luke 9:28 says nothing of the sort. He was not praying to either Moses or Elijah, but to the Father. He did go on to converse with Moses and Elijah, who seemed to have physically joined him there on the mountain.
In Luke 16, the rich man has died. So you have a post-death person communicating with another post-death person.
Are those two examples all you’ve got?
I can think of one example of a pre-death human trying to speak with a post-death human: In 1 Samuel 28 a godless King Saul attempts to communicate with Samuel, a practice forbidden by Scripture.
Necromancy is forbidden (see Lev. 19:31, 20:6, 20:27, Deut. 18:10, etc.). 1 Chronicles 10 says that King Saul died in part because he sought to communicate with post-death humans.
In any case, there is no example of any person — pre-death or post-death — receiving any kind of help from a post-death “saint.”
What I understand, based on the ample evidence here and elsewhere, is that the way the Christian God set the religion up, He must really like to see people confused and arguing among themselves.
Hebrews 10:10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. 11 And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins: 12 But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God; 13 From henceforth expecting till his enemies be made his footstool. 14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified. Sounds to me like everything needed for perfection is already found in scripture.
>> There's just no way to make profitable or useful mean "all that's needed" or "entirely sufficient."<<
"Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life." (John 5:24)
1 Corinthians 6:11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.
Rom. 4:5, "But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is reckoned as righteousness,"
Rom. 5:1, "therefore having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ,"
What more would you say is needed when scripture says we have it all?
God had no mother..come on now! Jesus , the son of God had an earthly mom, but he had existed far before that in heaven. Silly and ridiculous stuff that religion comes up with sometimes!
Carnal knowledge falls short. I didnt exist prior to conception. The divinity of Christ did. No analogy can be shown.
I used to think Christians were unique in this aspect. Or maybe we could also include a few other religions. Then I read more and more comparative religion and saw that arguments were the rule in religion rather than the exception.
Perhaps Confucianism is simple and clear and unarguable? But then it barely would qualify as religion. Taoism, perhaps?
In any case, I wouldn’t blame God but humans for what arises here.
Examine Mt 27:56, Mark 15:40, and John 19:25. In these James and Joses (Joseph), who are mentioned in Mt 13:55 with Simon and Judas (Jude) as Jesus adelphoi, are called sons of Mary, wife of Clopas, a different Mary from the Mother of Christ.
The point here is that adelphoi, refers to relative, NOT brothers and sisters.
Additionally, James and John were sons of Zebbedi(sp?)(no access here)
Look around a Catholic Church and Catholic homes. Any images of God made like to corruptible man?
So you are not going to accept the OT, Just as the raqbbinical school at Jamnia did in 90 AD. Seriously that is the case you are trying to make?
No confusion among any of us who hear His voice and have Him in us. God didnt set up religion. The differences you see discussed here is because of the religion men set up.
Jesus simply said you either believe in Him and go to heaven for eternity or if you dont you go to eternal punishment. Its that simple.
So you are not going to accept the NT, Just as the raqbbinical school at Jamnia did in 90 AD. Seriously that is the case you are trying to make? Corrected for error should ahve been NT not OT
Where did you get that from? Wasnt the OT written? Jesus did say often it is written did He not?
The analogy is that conception requires mommy parts and daddy parts. You seem to wish to say mothers are only mother of the mother parts.
praying is communicating and/or conversing.
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