[svcw]

Battlestar Galactica - mormons in space PLACE MARKER

[raygunfan]

this is why i question folks who are mormons, who either want to hold public office (and to a lesser extent, glenn beck).....if you cant see the contradictions historically in your faith, and there are a ton of them....how can i trust you in your decisions in the public forum???

[Colofornian]

From the article: Dr. Bushman called the idea of devout Mormons having their own planets in eternity “Mormon lore”...

We have our Bushman "lore" moments here on Free Republic, too -- where Mormons reduce clear Lds teachings to myths or accuse others of repeating "Evangelical...talking point[s]."

EXAMPLE

Oct. 23, 2011: A Freeper poster says about Mormonism: Well, the problem is that neither Judaism nor Catholicism thinks that we will all be gods and get our own planets... Mormons get our own planets? [post #7]

10 minutes doesn't even go by before a Mormon FREEPER scolds this poster; "Educate yourself. In my 40 plus years in the LDS church, I've never heard taught that we will all be gods of our own planets. That's a talking point of the evangelical opposition to the Church." [Post #10]

So here we have a Mormon FREEPER accusing another FREEPER of taking an "Evangelical...talking point" as factual...implying it isn't.

I later cited on that thread an Lds "prophet" -- Joseph Fielding Smith -- as teaching:

“To become like him we must have ALL the powers of godhood; thus a man and his wife when glorified will have spirit children who eventually will go on an EARTH LIKE THIS ONE WE ARE ON and pass through the same kind of experiences, being subject to mortal conditions, and if faithful, then they also will receive the fullness of exaltation and partake of the same blessings. There is no end to this development; it will go on forever. We will become gods and HAVE JURISDICTION OVER WORLDS, AND THESE WORLDS WILL BE PEOPLED BY OUR OWN OFFSPRING. WE WILL HAVE AN ENDLESS ETERNITY FOR THIS."
Source: Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, 2:48, as cited by The Mormon Church’s annual Melchizedek Priesthood Personal Study Guide, 1978-79, p. 131

The author of this thread's article notes the same thing occurring re: Richard Bushman...providing even additional Lds sources where Mormons will have their own planets' teaching is still taught to Mormon children:

From the article: ...while serving as Prophet and President of the LDS Church, Spencer W. Kimball taught, “Each one of you has it within the realm of his possibility to develop a kingdom over which you will preside as its king and god. You will need to develop yourself and grow in ability and power and worthiness, to govern such a world with all of its people.” (“’…the Matter of Marriage’” [address delivered at University of Utah Institute of Religion, 22 Oct. 1976], 2). That was then–35 years ago. But this is now: President Kimball’s statement is quoted in three current LDS manuals. The manuals are produced by the Mormon Church for the purpose of teaching children (Chapter 4: Teaching Children: from Four to Eleven Years,” A Parent’s Guide), high schoolers (Doctrine and Covenants and Church History Seminary Teacher Resource Manual – Introduction), and college students (Doctrines of the Gospel Student Manual 430 and 431, 29 [Chapter 10]).

From the article: Shortly before his death in 1901, fifth LDS Prophet and President Lorenzo Snow watched kindergarten children forming clay into spheres. President Snow turned to his companion and observed, “…these children are now at play, making mud worlds, the time will come when some of these boys, through their faithfulness to the gospel, will progress and develop in knowledge, intelligence and power, in future eternities, until they shall be able to go out into space where there is unorganized matter and call together the necessary elements, and through their knowledge of and control over the laws and powers of nature, to organize matter into worlds on which their posterity may dwell, and over which they shall rule as gods.’”(Improvement Era, June 1919, 658–59)

Beware "face value" convos with Mormons when they tell you what they believe.

They duck. Accuse you falsely. Obfuscate. Redefine words. Some even prevaricate -- thinking that you only deserve "milk" as a babe and therefore are not "worthy" to eat Mormon meat.

[Safrguns]

How can someone hold up a book they claim to be the inspired word of God, and at the same time refer to details in that book as a “canard”???

Are they admitting that Joseph Smith was writing from his own opinion or speculation???

They cannot have it both ways.

This is why we cannot afford to have someone like Mitt Romney as president. They are simply unable to deal with common sense reality.

Compartmentalization can be costly. TOO costly given that much power.

[daisy mae for the usa]

Clear, concise, and to the point. Thank you. These inconsistencies are why I can’t vote for Mitt Romney and Jon Huntsman. If they refuse to clearly look at these serious problems within their religion, why would I expect them to “rightly divide” issues for this nation? I would respect them more if they simply said, “Yes, I think one day I’ll be god-like and rule a planet.”

This business of then-and-now cannot be trusted. The Bible says Jesus is the same yesterday, today, and tomorrow. (Heb. 13:8) Any religion claiming to be Christian, as Mormonism claims, should be in line with Jesus. Again in James 1:17 the Bible says God does not change. Truth is TRUTH — it does not do then and now.

Anyone who cannot recognize the absolute nature of truth as it originates from God cannot be trusted to hold public office. That is what we have now in the Presidency.

[Alex Murphy]

Dr. Bushman [Richard Bushman, the Visiting Professor in Mormon Studies at Claremont Graduate University] called the idea of devout Mormons having their own planets in eternity “Mormon lore” that stems from the Mormon belief that humans can become like God. He suggested that if Mormons can become like God, they might then be able to run a bit of God’s universe. Tagging the belief as “lore,” Dr. Bushman relegated the idea to the arena of mere tradition passed from person to person within the Mormon community by word of mouth.

Dr. Jackson [Kent P. Jackson, associate dean of religion at Brigham Young University] went a step further. He said the idea of faithful Mormons being rewarded with their own planets in eternity is a “canard”; that is, “an unfounded rumor or story.” Nothing further needs to be said. End of discussion....

....If I want to know what Mormonism teaches about human beings becoming Gods and creating worlds, should I ask a Mormon? Should I ask LDS professors? Or should I consult the teachings of LDS prophets and apostles? Mormon professor Kent Jackson says the doctrine is nothing but a canard — an unfounded rumor — while Mormon prophets and apostles continue to proclaim the doctrine with clarity via official Church venues and publications. Which source is the best and most trustworthy source for learning the truth about Mormonism? And just as importantly, why don’t these sources agree?

Which source is authoritative? Which source claims to speak with authority? Mormonism trumpets the claim that, because they don't have paid clergy, their clergy can be trusted. I take that to mean, from a Mormon point of view, that a paid and tenured university professor cannot be trusted.

[Nevadan]

Thanks for posting. According to the LDS professors in the article, there is no substance to some of the beliefs that Church leaders & Prophets clearly taught and continue to teach. What is particularly disturbing to me is the attempt by current LDS leaders and professors to publicly distort and deny their own teachings while attacking others who simply document those teachings. In a lot of ways it is similar to how Muslims apologists react when one points out the truth about Islam not being the “religion of peace” they maintain it is. Instead of acknowledging Islam's record both in the past and present, they accuse others of being “Islamophobes”. Likewise, those who tell the facts about Mormon teachings are “anti-Mormons”. Never-mind what the truth is.

No doubt what I just wrote will put me in the Mormon hater category. But that could not be farther from the truth. I have close Mormon friends whose friendships I treasure.

[Vendome]

I’m conflicted...

[Vendome]

If God said it,

I Believe it,

That settles it....

How hard would that be?

No reason for duplicitous values, that are antagonistic to God’s clarity.

[cruise_missile]

So the liberals are starting to become experts on Mormon theology?

[fishtank]

This is for referencing Maureen Dowd:

[Elsie]

On PURPOSE??

[Elsie]

Mormon Professors Confuse ...

 

 

Professor Robert Millet        teaching at the Mission Prep Club in 2004  http://newsnet.byu.edu/video/18773/  <-- Complete and uneditted

---

 

 

Timeline...    Subject...

 

0:59           "Anti-Mormons..."

1:16           "ATTACK the faith you have..."

2:02           "We really aren't obligated to answer everyone's questions..."

3:57           "You already know MORE about God and Christ and the plan of salvation than any who would ATTACK you."