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To: markomalley
>> seems to make the Catholic argument that sola scriptura was a sixteenth-century invention and, therefore, not an essential Christian doctrine.<<

"They [heretics] gather their views from other sources than the Scriptures...We have learned from none others the plan of our salvation, than from those through whom the Gospel has come down to us, which they did at one time proclaim in public, and, at a later period, by the will of God, handed down to us in the Scriptures, to be the ground and pillar of our faith" - Irenaeus, Against Heresies, 3.1.1 - Irenaeus, Against Heresies, 3.1.1 Sola Scriptura !

"I beg of you, my dear brother, to live among these books [scripture], to meditate upon them, to know nothing else, to seek nothing else." - Jerome (Letter 53:10)

"There is, brethren, one God, the knowledge of whom we gain from the Holy Scriptures, and from no other source. For just as a man, if he wishes to be skilled in the wisdom of this world, will find himself unable to get at it in any other way than by mastering the dogmas of philosophers, so all of us who wish to practice piety will be unable to learn its practice from any other quarter than the oracles of God. Whatever things, then, the Holy Scripture declare, at these let us look; and whatsoever things they teach, these let us learn; and as the Father wills our belief to be, let us believe; and as He wills the Son to be glorified, let us glorify Him; and as He wills the Holy Spirit to be bestowed, let us receive Him. Not according to our own will, nor according to our own mind, nor yet as using violently those things which are given by God, but even as He has chosen to teach them by the Holy Scriptures, so let us discern them." - Hippolytus, Against Noetus, ch 9

"For how can we adopt those things which we do not find in the holy Scriptures?" - Ambrose (On the Duties of the Clergy, 1:23:102)"We use Scripture to answer heresy and preceive that it is power and truth." - Basil the Great

“Let the inspired Scriptures then be our umpire, and the vote of truth will be given to those whose dogmas are found to agree with the Divine words.” - Gregory of Nyssa (d.ca, 395) “On the Holy Trinity”, NPNF, p. 327

“We are not content simply because this is the tradition of the Fathers. What is important is that the Fathers followed the meaning of the Scripture." - Basil the Great (ca.329–379) On the Holy Spirit, 7.16

“Neither dare one agree with catholic bishops if by chance they err in anything, but the result that their opinion is against the canonical Scriptures of God.” - Augustine (354–430) De unitate ecclesiae, 10

"For among the things that are plainly laid down in Scripture are to be found all matters that concern faith and the manner of life,--to wit, hope and love, of which I have spoken in the previous book. After this, when we have made ourselves to a certain extent familiar with the language of Scripture, we may proceed to open up and investigate the obscure passages, and in doing so draw examples from the plainer expressions to throw light upon the more obscure, and use the evidence of passages about which there is no doubt to remove all hesitation in regard to the doubtful passages." - Augustine (On Christian Doctrine, 2:9)

Sola Scriptura !

Only the scriptures contain the teaching of the apostles and they speak to us through it, and that voice is louder and more perfect than any man made tradition!

5 posted on 10/28/2011 7:55:33 AM PDT by CynicalBear
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To: CynicalBear
I believe your list of quotes from the church fathers puts to bed the notion of "sola scriptura is a 16th century invention of the reformers."
7 posted on 10/28/2011 8:25:16 AM PDT by dartuser ("If you are ... what you were ... then you're not.")
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To: CynicalBear

What do you call the Protestant confessions or the manmade tradition of only baptizing adults?

Every Protestant sect has its own tradition when it comes to interpreting the scriptures. So I have to let out a hearty laugh.


8 posted on 10/28/2011 8:27:55 AM PDT by rzman21
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To: CynicalBear

Yet you cite the teachings of the Fathers of the church....

It seems we should find among the doctrines of scripture that of sola scriptura, but that is not what we see.


17 posted on 10/28/2011 12:47:44 PM PDT by BenKenobi (Honkeys for Herman! 10 percent is enough for God; 9 percent is enough for government)
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To: CynicalBear

Where’s Enoch, and I don’t mean whether he’s presently ‘walking with God’?

Enoch was actually referenced by Jesus in the Bible, yet the book is not a part of the Canon (1 or 2Enoch).

This I have never understood.


319 posted on 10/31/2011 10:26:53 PM PDT by RinaseaofDs (Does beheading qualify as 'breaking my back', in the Jeffersonian sense of the expression?)
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To: CynicalBear; metmom; 1000 silverlings; Alex Murphy; bkaycee; blue-duncan; boatbums; caww; ...

i have only read to #5, but it is not true that holding to the canon is contrary to Scripture being supreme and materially sufficient (formally awaited its completion), as by holding Scripture to be supreme we can sanction the church, and also principles of how scripture was established as being such. Most of which was before there was a Roman church, and without an assuredly infallible magisterium as per Rome.

Instead of the latter magisterium establishing Scripture by an “infallible decree,” which took Rome over 1400 years after the last book was written to do, it an be seen that Scripture was progressively established (and it is obvious there was a recognized body of Scriptures by the time of Christ) due to its heavenly qualities and effects and other supernatural attestation, and conflation with that which was prior established as being from God. And which today also confirms the Word, (Mk. 16:20) esp by manifest regeneration.

And it is by objective examination of Scriptural evidences that one may have confidence they presently have eternal life. (1Jn. 5:13)

This allows for challenges, but it is by “the manifestation of the truth” that souls are persuaded by true men of God, (2Cor. 4:2) and the rest can follow the evil which good overcomes. Wisdom is justified of her children.

RCAs argue that we lack an infallible interpreter for our supreme authority, but so do they, as the infallible magisterium itself is subject to some fallible interpretation.

Moreover, the canon was overall settled quickly for Prots, they can have more confidence in it than RCs can about a canon of all the infallible teachings of their supreme authority. And they also can and have many disagreements about doctrine, including what really is authentic teaching.


441 posted on 11/01/2011 4:47:43 PM PDT by daniel1212 (Our sinful deeds condemn us, but Christ's death and resurrection gains salvation. Repent +Believe)
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