Mark 400th Anniversary of King James Version by Studying Bible [Mormon]

LDS.org ^

[svcw]

I stated: lds jesus - created
You stated that was incorrect.
From lds.org: Jesus Christ is the literal Son of God.

[svcw]

I stated: lds jesus - not sufficient for salvation IE after all we can do.
You stated that was not true.
Articles of Faith: #3 We believe that through the Atonement of Christ, all mankind may be saved, by obedience to the laws and ordinances of the Gospel.

[oremites]

I stated: lds jesus - created
You stated that was incorrect.
From lds.org: Jesus Christ is the literal Son of God.

How in the world do you get "Jesus was created" from that statement?

So you're saying that you believe Jesus is figuratively the Son of God?

[svcw]

I stated: lds jesus - paid the price in the garden
You stated it was untrue.
From lds.org child’s coloring book (with a picture of Jesus in the Garden of Gethsemane). Jesus was praying. He was sad. He began to shake. Blood came out of his skin. All his body hurt. It hurt because he was suffering for the sins of all people. While Jesus suffered and prayed, an angel came to make him stronger. Jesus finished praying. He had bled and suffered for the sins of all people.
D&C 19:16–18

[svcw]

Cute but no cigar.
lds teach that their god had physical sex with Mary IE created

[oremites]

I stated: lds jesus - not sufficient for salvation IE after all we can do.
You stated that was not true.
Articles of Faith: #3 We believe that through the Atonement of Christ, all mankind may be saved, by obedience to the laws and ordinances of the Gospel.

You are again completely misunderstanding what we believe, reading what you want to see into that instead of what is really there.

Let me ask you - does Christ save everyone? Why are some people saved and some are not? What do those people who are saved do differently than those who are not saved? Does that mean that Christ's atonement is not sufficient for those who are not saved?

[svcw]

God wants none to be separated from Him. All can be Saved by Grace, no works required.

[oremites]

lds teach that their god had physical sex with Mary IE created

No we don't. Absolutely not.

Honestly, I'd be embarrassed to discuss religion with someone of another faith where my side of the conversation was telling them what they believe and their side of the conversation was "No, we don't believe that." I wonder how long it would take before I got the message that I was misinformed somewhere along the line.

[MHGinTN]

Let me ask you —though I seriously doubt you will answer, hoenstly: In Mormonism escatology, did the father of jesus have to earn the attributes of godhood and did jesus have to earn the attributes of godhood?

[Turtlepower]

It’s already well understood what Mormonism teaches, so there’s no need to ask around. It’s clear that the attributes assigned to Jesus in the BOM are not the same attributes given in the Bible. Therefore, it’s illogical to state the Mormon Jesus is the same as the Biblical Jesus.

[Turtlepower]

scvw directly quoted the Mormon Articles of Faith, so how is that a misunderstanding?

[laweeks]

Could you please provide a list of who's authorized to read your Bible.

Everybody's authorized to read KJV Bible. But to distort it, invent hundreds of thousands of gods, totally screw up Central American history, believe a fortune seeker/embezzler/polygamist/con-man as some kind of authority is a bit much for the average Christian.

The LDS might think they're Christians, but they couldn't be any farther from that than they are right now. Incredible that anyone with the slightest bit of common sense would believe the stories dreamed up by Joseph Smith. Jr. . . . especially the one about him sitting next to Jesus to help determine who gets into heaven.

I thought the one about Kolob was bad, and that the American Indians descended from the Jews, but that one takes the cake.

Please don't call yourselves Christians. Repent before you lose your souls.

[Godzilla]

LDS study and accept the Bible as the inspired word of God.

Oh really? Then why did smith have to go back and 'retranslate' it orem? And since the prophet did all that for you - you should be holding the JST as more valuable than the kjv since smith put all the plain and precious parts back in that were removed.

Oh, how do you study a kjv that has the plain and precious parts removed orem?

We also accept Jesus Christ as our only Savior and Redeemer.

After becoming perfect by your own works

Why can't you be happy for fellow believers?

For us to be 'fellow believers' we must believe the same thing. your prophet made it clear that the mormon jesus is not the Jesus of Christianity - thus we do not have a common belief and you are not my 'fellow believer'.

[svcw]

Bruce McConkie, in perhaps the most explicit denial of the virgin birth, wrote,

“Christ was begotten by an immortal Father in the same way that mortal men are begotten by mortal fathers.” (Mormon Doctrine, 1966, p. 547)

From lds.org: There is no doubt that the idea of physical relations between God and Mary has been clearly advocated in the Church by such authorities as Brigham Young [1], Orson Pratt [2], Heber C. Kimball [3], Joseph F. Smith, [4], Joseph Fielding Smith [5], James E. Talmage [6], Melvin J. Ballard [7], J. Reuben Clark [8], Bruce R. McConkie [9], and Ezra Taft Benson [10]. Mormons believe that Christ was literally the Son of God in the flesh, and he was conceived in a natural, physical way according to eternal law.

“Christ Not Begotten of Holy Ghost... Christ was begotten of God. He was not born without the aid of Man, and that Man was God!” (Doctrines of Salvation, Joseph Fielding Smith, 1954, 1:18).

“These name-titles all signify that our Lord is the only Son of the Father in the flesh. Each of the words is to be understood literally. Only means only; Begotten means begotten; and Son means son. Christ was begotten by an Immortal Father in the same way that mortal men are begotten by mortal fathers.” (Mormon Doctrine, 1979, pages 546-47)

[oremites]

scvw directly quoted the Mormon Articles of Faith, so how is that a misunderstanding?

Because scvw quotes them, but then goes on the "explain" them to say things that they definitely do not say. That is what is called a misunderstanding.

[Bidimus1]

Well you assumptions aside as to my knowledge of lds doctrine and beliefs.

The RLDS (later renamed) does use the j.s. “translation”

That you have an answer does not change that the question is valid, IF jst exists and is newer and more correct why use the KJV that was made by “Ignorant translators, careless transcribers, or designing and corrupt priests have committed many errors.” (DHC, vol. 6, p. 57)

That you believe that as I do not agree with you I can not understand your position is a conceit and a common one for the lds (and many many others..)

Of course you may bluster and froth and claim I do not know much (as you did in your response) but the question remains if jst is newer and more correct (as j.s claimed all his works were) why not proclaim it and use it.

[Godzilla]

There is no need for me to choose between the "LDS" and the "Biblical" Jesus because they are one and the same.

Not according to your recent prophet orem.

"In bearing testimony of Jesus Christ, President Hinckley spoke of those outside the Church who say Latter-day Saints 'do not believe in the traditional Christ.' 'No, I don't. The traditional Christ of whom they speak is not the Christ of whom I speak. For the Christ of whom I speak has been revealed in this the Dispensation of the Fullness of Times. He together with His Father, appeared to the boy Joseph Smith in the year 1820, and when Joseph left the grove that day, he knew more of the nature of God than all the learned ministers of the gospel of the ages.'" (LDS Church News Week ending June 20, 1998, p. 7).

The mormon jesus is not the Biblical Jesus. Perhaps you should be factual in the presentation of lds orem - and not presenting disinformation.

[oremites]

Let me ask you —though I seriously doubt you will answer, hoenstly:

Well, that sure put me in my place.

[greyfoxx39]

What could be more important for those millions of people in need than the message of Jesus Christ and his atonement? You really want us to "cut back" when the world needs His message more than ever?

Tell us just what "message of Jesus Christ and his atonement" is given in these temple rituals.

"For Latter-day Saints, the endowment serves as a rite of adult initiation. Growing out of Joseph Smith's encounter with Freemasonry, the endowment is a ritual drama re-enacting the scriptural narrative of the creation and the fall and pre-enacting the safe return of the faithful into God's presence. In the course of the ceremony, initiates are washed, anointed, and clothed in a sacred protective garment. They covenant to lead lives of modesty, temperance, reverence, fidelity, charity, sacrifice, and consecration. They don priestly robes and learn the sacred signs, tokens, and keywords which, they are told, will give them access to God's presence in the next life if they faithfully live out their covenants in this one.

"They covenant to lead lives of modesty, temperance, reverence, fidelity, charity, sacrifice, and consecration."....where is Christ in this litany of "works"?

LDS Endowment

Wherein this oath is taken: "You and each of you covenant and promise before God, angels, and these witnesses at this altar, that you do accept the Law of Consecration as contained in the Doctrine and Covenants, in that you do consecrate yourselves, your time, talents, and everything with which the Lord has blessed you, or with which he may bless you, to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, for the building up of the Kingdom of God on the earth and for the establishment of Zion.

And, then please tell us where did Jesus Christ require obedience to these commands that are listed in the questions that are required to be answered before a member can be allowed to enter these temples and take part in the manmade rituals.

Temple Recommend questions.

1 Do you have faith in and a testimony of God the Eternal Father, His Son Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost?

2 Do you have a testimony of the Atonement of Christ and of His role as Savior and Redeemer?

3 Do you have a testimony of the restoration of the gospel in these the latter days?

4 Do you sustain the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as the Prophet, Seer, and Revelator and as the only person on the earth who possesses and is authorized to exercise all priesthood keys? Do you sustain members of the First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles as prophets, seers, and revelators? Do you sustain the other General Authorities and local authorities of the Church?

5 Do you live the law of chastity?

6 Is there anything in your conduct relating to members of your family that is not in harmony with the teachings of the Church?

7 Do you support, affiliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?

8 Do you strive to keep the covenants you have made, to attend your sacrament and other meetings, and to keep your life in harmony with the laws and commandments of the gospel?

9 Are you honest in your dealings with your fellowmen?

10 Are you a full-tithe payer?

11 Do your keep the Word of Wisdom?

12 Do you have financial or other obligations to a former spouse or children? If yes, are you current in meeting those obligations?

13 If you have previously received your temple endowment:

Do you keep the covenants that you made in the temple?
Do you wear the garment both night and day as instructed in the endowment and in accordance with the covenant you made in the temple?

14 Have there been any sins or misdeeds in your life that should have been resolved with priesthood authorities but have not been?

15 Do you consider yourself worthy to enter the Lord's house and participate in temple ordinances?

IMO you may not realize that only about 20% of mormon members are "worthy" to take part in these rituals, right? That doesn't reach the majority of the "needy".