Replies

"You seem to be making some cultists' case that the Council of Nicea made up the doctrine of the Trinity out of whole cloth."

I have read most of Markbsnr's posts and I think you are engaged in yet another case of character assassination by misquote, partial quotes and innuendo. It is part of a bigger pattern. You have on several occasions posted out of context and completely falsified interpretations of my own posts.

In tens of thousands of posts I can't recall you ever posting any original thoughts, everything is a cut and paste that, collectively forms a mosaic of your anti-Catholicism.

Since you have decided to enter the fray, why don't you post stop sniping and start expressing some of your own thoughts.

What role do you believe the Nicene Creed should play in the formation of faith? Do you fully support the tenets of Christianity as expressed in the Nicene Creed? Should the Nicene Creed be the lens through which the Bible should be interpreted? Did the Nicean Creed precede and shape the Canon of the Bible, or did the Bible shape the Nicene Creed? Where is the Catechism of the Catholic Church at odds with any part of the Nicene Creed?

Do not make this thread "about" individual Freepers. That is also a form of "making it personal."

Discuss the issues all you want, but do not make it personal.

What role do you believe the Nicene Creed should play in the formation of faith?

None. Scripture tells us all we need to know. The new believer should be referring back to God's inspired written word for the formation of their faith. Mature faith takes time and cannot be had by memorizing a statement of faith some church wrote.

2 Timothy 3: 14But as for you, continue in what you have learned and have firmly believed, knowing from whom you learned it 15and how from childhood you have been acquainted with the sacred writings, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. 16 All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, 17that the man of God may be competent, equipped for every good work.

Scripture is authoritative and anything doctrinal needs to be referred back to that for support. If it's not found well supported and/or clearly spelled out in Scripture, the teaching needs to be jettisoned.

Creeds serve a purpose when the unwashed masses are illiterate or have no access to the Bible to give some grounding, but they can never and should never even be considered an option to replace memorization of Scripture.

Which, BTW, I do recall memorizing creeds as a Catholic. I cannot recall EVER being told to or encouraged to memorize Scripture itself.

I have read most of Markbsnr's posts and I think you are engaged in yet another case of character assassination by misquote, partial quotes and innuendo. It is part of a bigger pattern....In tens of thousands of posts I can't recall you ever posting any original thoughts, everything is a cut and paste that, collectively forms a mosaic of your anti-Catholicism.

What do you see now?

Court Psychiatrist: [Holding up inkblot card] Okay, now tell me what you see, Alan.
Alan Musgrave: Flowers. Hmmm...tulips, jonquils, and roses. They're long-stemmed American Beauty roses, actually.
Court Psychiatrist: [flipping to new inkblot card, irritated] Uh - concentrate. Try a little harder.
Alan Musgrave: [sharply inhaling]. Birds. Trees. [Sudden interest, taking card from psychiatrist] Oh, and there's a river! A river, winding lazily through green pastures....
Court Psychiatrist: [interrupting] You're fighting me.
Alan Musgrave: [continuing] ....oh, it's so peaceful. On the banks are happy children....
Court Psychiatrist: [ignoring him, filing her nails] Don't fight me, Alan.
Alan Musgrave: [continuing]....clouds, lots of clouds -- [gets out of chair and sits on desk, showing inkblot to psychiatrist] Look! One of them looks just like the Easter Bunny! Huh.
Court Psychiatrist: [takes inkblot from him, looks him in the eye, condescending] Alan, I want to help you. Now, don't you realize that these things are supposed to be dirty?
Alan Musgrave: [Surprised] Dirty? [Looks at new inkblot card, shakes head] No. That's a butterfly. A brightly colored butterfly....
Court Psychiatrist: [leaps up from desk, throws all inkblots at Alan in extreme anger] You are hostile! You are hostile, you little creep! You creep, you hostile creep!
Alan Musgrave: Shhhhh! Doctor, shhhhh! [motions with hand to sit down] Doctor, what are you hiding from? Your whole pattern suggests a rigidity syndrome of severe underlying anxiety, massive repressions and pathological prejudices. All of which makes it very difficult for me to relate to you! So if you really want me to talk, get me my tape recorder.
Court Psychiatrist: [steaming] Anything else?
Alan Musgrave: Now that you mention it, you might get me my transistor radio. And a corned beef sandwich. On rye. No mustard.
-- from the 1966 movie Lord Love A Duck

"You seem to be making some cultists' case that the Council of Nicea made up the doctrine of the Trinity out of whole cloth."

I have read most of Markbsnr's posts and I think you are engaged in yet another case of character assassination by misquote, partial quotes and innuendo. It is part of a bigger pattern. You have on several occasions posted out of context and completely falsified interpretations of my own posts.

I think that we should cut Alex some slack. Some kind person has come along and:

What role do you believe the Nicene Creed should play in the formation of faith? Do you fully support the tenets of Christianity as expressed in the Nicene Creed? Should the Nicene Creed be the lens through which the Bible should be interpreted? Did the Nicean Creed precede and shape the Canon of the Bible, or did the Bible shape the Nicene Creed? Where is the Catechism of the Catholic Church at odds with any part of the Nicene Creed?

Fair and cogent questions. I am looking foward to reading the answers.