Posted on 05/21/2011 4:46:26 AM PDT by marbren
Camping is a victim of replacement theology. IMHO the lie of replacement theology is almost as insidious as idolatry. The key to holistic understanding of Bible prophecy is to understand the role of Israel in it. God keeps his promises to Israel. This is a model to the rest of us that he will keep his promises to us as well.
A majority of the church going world has been victimized. I believed the lie for 35 years. During the past 20 I have been seeking the truth and only recently did I stop saying IMHO replacement theology is a lie and replaced it with: Replacement theology is a lie dropping the IMHO. For those that do not know, Replacement theology is the lie that the Church has replaced Israel in God’s plan.
The church was polluted by Replacement theology early on. Origen and Augustine, early Fathers of the church, were the first to muddy up the scriptures in this way when they arrogantly took on the mantle of Israel for themselves. Martin Luther apparently did not study it and this lead to his anti-Semitism and Hitler. In many ways IMHO it is like a reverse of the circumcision party that led to Acts 15.
This replacement theology lie has lead to the church we have today. Everyone is running around not knowing what is happening in these end times we are in. The truth is The Church, the Bride of Christ, has a role and Israel has a role. Think of men and women, children and parents, husbands and wives, angels and people, dogs and cats, sheep and goats, wheat and tares. All these have roles God invented.
So the solution: Open your Bible, drop your preconceived notions and open your mind, ask God to reveal the truth about all this Israel stuff written in the Bible. The Lord Jesus Christ is central in it all. Gods Grace and Mercy is incredible, He does all the work. Faith and hope and love permeate the entire Bible and the greatest of these is love.
Do you sit idly by and allow the words of Jesus to be subjected to derision by evangelicals like camping or do you police evangelicals like him?
How do you police these reprobates without an ecclesiastical structure?
How do you admonish ones like Camping?
How do you insure adherence to the words of God given an addiction to prideful self interpretation?
Given the state of derision you currently enjoy it might be well to rid yourself of these Satanic relationships
3. Now it is within the power of anyone who cares to find out the truth, to know the tradition of the Apostles, professed throughout the world in every church. We can name those too who were appointed bishops by the Apostles in the churches and their successors down to our own time.... But inasmuch as it would be very tedious in a book like this to rehearse the lines of succession in every church, we will put to confusion all those who, either from waywardness or conceit or blindness or obstinacy combine together against the truth, by pointing to the tradition, derived from the Apostles, of that great and illustrious Church founded and organized at Rome by the two glorious Apostles, Peter and Paul, and to the faith declared to mankind and handed down to our own time through its bishops in their succession. For with this Church, because of its more powerful leadership, every church, that is to say, the faithful from everywhere, must needs agree, and in it the tradition that springs from the Apostles has been continuously preserved by men from everywhere....
i am sure you agree with St Irenaeus that the faithful from everywhere must agree with the Church of Rome, right?
I’ll explain that as soon as you explain to me how you allow pedophiliac priests to remain priests. Get the idea? Sheesh! Your straw dogs are getting really old.
"He would have called you a gnostic". So like Camping wirh his supernatural predictions you channel with Irenaeus and support divination. Oh how biblically correct.
Are you kidding me? Absolutely not! I wouldn’t be a part of the heresy that is the RCC. I would be more inclined to believe that the RCC is the whore of Revelation.
Just as I thought no shame
After this weekend I thought the whores were the evangelicals and the sola crowd
oLofob wrote:
“ss- it’s not Biblical, see 2 Thessalonians and the Church has always followed the Apostolic Tradition.” Yes, I am quite familiar with 2 Thessalonians. There is no conflict here. The teaching of the apostles did not contravene the written word of God before or after its writing. That is the nature of divine teaching, the Word of God. It does not change, on which subject there is ample testimony in the Scriptures themselves. And remember, we are not talking about a slogan, whether understood rightly or not, we are talking about the normative authority of Scripture. Let me put it plainly, Scripture stands above tradition, any tradition. Tradition is validated by Scripture, not the other way around. That is the bottom line on sola scriptura.
Regarding infant baptism. Really? Let’s start a little more basically than that. Does Scripture command baptism? Of all nations? Interestingly, that phrase from Matthew 28:19 is the same phrase as is found in Matthew 25:32, the words of the same author, Matthew, by inspiration of the Holy Spirit. Who is indicated by the phrase in Matthew 25:32? Just adults? Or all people? You see, the command to baptize all nations includes all. Can you show Scripture that exempts infants and children? If not, the Scriptures command infant baptism. End of argument. And that is why the early practiced it, and the Lutherans agreed with the Scriptures and the fathers.
So, all of the other passages, and they are numerous, are to be understood in the light of a single passage in James? Wouldn’t it be more reasonable to assume that the James passage should be read in the light of many, many others? Even Luther recognized that later in his life. Read James rightly, in the context of the whole of the Scriptures. There is no contradiction. James’ point is simply that faith and works go together. Of course they do. Works follow faith, or the faith is not genuine. But we are not saved by works, but by faith, as the sainted Ambrose said clearly on many occasions beside the one cited in my tagline.
oLofob also wrote:
“the reformation was nothing less than a doctrinal revolution, every doctrine was open to question and the result is utter confusion. the Holy Spirit is not the author of confusion!”
Every doctrine was open to question? I think not. Have you actually read anything from the Reformers? Followed the argumentation? Read the contemporaneous Roman responses? I am skeptical on the basis of what you write.
I am familiar with Catholic doctrine as well. And, yes, you are quite right that everyone being their own own authority is forbidden. But that is not what we are talking about, no matter what the devotees of your other 30,000 denominations may think. God is the Author of the Scriptures. God is the Interpreter of the Scriptures. Scripture interprets Scripture. That is drawing closer to the real meaning of “sola scriptura” than the bowdlerized phrase that is bandied about so easily here.
Yet those priests still get to serve communion and administer sacraments and the Catholic church. The RCC takes a verbal stand against homosexuality and yet allows homosexual priests to retain their positions.
And Catholics claim that those who support abortion have ex-communicated themselves from the church, the whole while that the church refuses to take any action against them.
Doesn't it discredit the Catholic church to allow those priests and pro-abortion supporters within it to continue in it? Not only does the Catholic church allow it, it gives its seal of approval to pro-abortion Catholics by continuing to serve them communion and perform Catholic funerals for the likes of Kennedy.
Oh, but that's different, I guess.......
Anyone who allows people like Camping to discredit Christianity is just looking for a reason to discredit Christianity. Camping only discredited himself. The Word of God is true, regardless of who misinterprets it and how.
As I understood your post, I read that you believe Satan has been bound in chains since they fell or since the flood.
Wow, I get an "F" in communications. I said nothing of the sort and in my volume-sized rambling rant I was specific about the binding taking place during the apostolic age of the Great Commission.
It brought the verse to my mind about the devil being a force we still must be aware of.
The passage in 1 Peter supports that opinion.
Some people believe the verses in II Peter refer to a certain part of the fallen angels and it was with that in mind that I suggested that not ALL of them are chained.
I didn't see that fine print in the Bible saying that the demon's mileage would vary. May I suggest that you make a special effort to realize that "deception" and "tempting" are different functions and that the ability to "deceive" the nations is what the binding has accomplished. Before the binding, the Gospel was not received by the nations, since the binding, the whole world has received the Gospel and many have repented and believed. The empirical evidence is bountiful testimony.
Additional Scripture such as Satan in front of God concerning Job ... Jesus as well as the disciples did battle against demon possession.
I concur that this is true, for these events all precede the outpouring of the Holy Spirit since Pentecost. When the Apostles went out to all of the world, they were given the power to bind, and in Acts we see numerous confirmations that they indeed did bind the spirits. In 16:16-19 Paul and Silas cast out the spirit of divination within the slave girl. Who has that ability of divination today? No one does because the spirits were bound in the age of the Apostles.
All this, to me, does not sound as if Satan is bound in chains in darkness - at least not yet anyway.
Your argument is not with me, but is with Peter and Jude who both testified under the Power of the Holy Spirit that the Devil and his minions are presently bound in chains of darkness. Revelation also concurs, but due to its heavy symbolism and wild disparities in interpretation, using a difficult text when we already have simpler texts isn't necessary.
Matt 3:9-10 "... and do not think to say to yourselves, 'We have Abraham as our father.' For I say to you that God is able to raise up children to Abraham from these stones..."
And John the Disciple gives us this exchange between our LORD and the Pharisees (Jews)
John 8:37-39 "I know that you are Abraham's descendants, but you seek to kill Me, because My word has no place in you... They answered and said to Him, "Abraham is our father." Jesus said to them, "If you were Abraham's children, you would do the works of Abraham..."
So there are "descendants of Abraham" and there are "children of Abraham" the former have common DNA, the latter have a common Father and Faith and can be "raised from stones" if need be.
I think it is you that does not understand that the "church" isn't an "it" it is an "us". It spans across time and nations, peoples, languages, even denominations because it is made up of those who have trusted in the only begotten Son of God to save them from their sins. Jesus said, "He who believeth in me hath eternal life.". It is so obvious that the church Jesus meant was absolutely NOT an organization for the shear fact that not everyone who is a member of the Roman Catholic Church is necessarily saved. How many people do you know personally who come to Mass once and awhile and go through the motions yet NEVER display a changed heart through their deeds or thoughts? I can think of many and not just from the RCC, there are many people who have the mistaken notion that membership in a church grants them the right to be called a Christian. We know very well that is not what it means to be one.
So, when you ask, "Can I find the Church in all 2,000 years?", the answer is, of course. It existed long before there even was a "Roman Catholic Church" and certainly before they declared themselves the one and only church. If you go back to the first time the word 'catholic' was used, it meant universal and implied a common, single faith in the Gospel of Jesus Christ. As much as I'm sure you'd love to copyright that name, you cannot, because universal means exactly that. God doesn't look at labels, he looks at the heart, remember that.
Also, making the thread "about" individual posters, e.g. 499 and 467 - are forms of "making it personal."
Discuss the issues all you want but do not make it personal.
However, we are still exhorted to not "give the Devil a foothold" (Eph. 4:27), "Put on the full armor of God, so that you can take your stand against the devil’s schemes." (Eph. 6:11), we "must also have a good reputation with outsiders, so that he will not fall into disgrace and into the devil’s trap." (I Tim. 3:7), as well as "Opponents must be gently instructed, in the hope that God will grant them repentance leading them to a knowledge of the truth, and that they will come to their senses and escape from the trap of the devil, who has taken them captive to do his will." (2 Tim 2:25-26), and also to "Submit yourselves, then, to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you." (James 4:7).
Finally, from Revelation 20:1-3, we are told of a one thousand year period where the Devil IS bound in chains:
And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years, And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
If the Devil is bound in everlasting darkness NOW, then he must have a long chain. ;o)
So very true, dear sister in Christ! Thank you for those beautiful Scriptures!
ABSOLUTELY INDEED. Angelina's 23 hours in Heaven concluded with Jesus showing her some of how the Rapture will occur: At the same time I could observe the whole world and how small it looked and then suddenly I saw how thousands were disappearing. Pregnant women saw their pregnancy disappear and they looked like they had gone crazy screaming. Children had disappeared everywhere and many people were running to and fro, screaming, “This can’t be, this can’t be! What’s happening?” And those who had known the Lord and were left behind were saying that Christ had come, that the Rapture had occurred and they screamed and wanted to kill themselves; wanted to hang themselves and so many other things, but they couldn’t.
From here:
http://daaixin.wordpress.com/heavenly-visitations-heavenly-visits/
and here:
http://www.spiritlessons.com/
Angelina, in her 23 hour Heavenly visit had The Rapture shown to her this way:
He told me, “Daughter, I am going to show you something: How I am going to go for a holy people to Earth. I am going to show you how the day of the Rapture will be.” We walked until we reached a place where I could observe a giant screen and people in it.
But the Lord, very sadly said, “It” too late. The time to repent is now.” He told me, “Daughter, go tell humanity to seek me, for during that time there will no longer be opportunity. Daughter, it will be too late for all those that stay behind.” When the Lord observed how humanity was left behind, He began to weep and only said, “Daughter, I will go to Earth as says in This was all that the Lord showed me. From there He brought me back here to Earth,
The Lord told me, “Daughter, in those days, death will flee; Daughter, in those days the Holy Spirit will no longer be on Earth.” When the Lord said these words, I observed an enormous traffic and thousands of people. He told me, “Daughter, look, this is how everything will happen.” I then saw people running. There were accidents but I could not observe a single dead person: all of them were alive, although injured. They kept on running from one place to another, shouting, “Christ came, Christ came!” They would plead, “Lord, forgive me, forgive me- take me with you!”
1 Thes. 4: 16-17 :
“For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God; and the dead in Christ shall rise first; Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air; and so shall we ever be with the Lord.”. But not everyone will go with the Lord, only those who are doing his will and living a holy life for the Lord told me,” Only those that are holy will enter the Kingdom of Heaven,” Another very important thing which he told me: “No one knows, neither the day nor the hour in which I will go for my holy people, not even the angels know it.” As He said this, the screen which was about to close, revealed people running and magazines and TV news said that “Christ had come”. The screen closed and the Lord told me, “I will go for a holy people.”
Return to Earth Maxima: When she knew she was returning, we were there with her stretched out on the floor, waiting for her return with a moan – nothing else. She went, “uuhmm” – nothing else. I said, “Thank you, Lord, because my daughter is here now!” I knew that she was here. All of us gave thanks to the Lord, and from then on we laughed and talked, because we knew; nothing else – just a moan. From then on, she started breathing slowly, little by little, until about five hours had gone by and she was able to open her eyes and talk. You could hardly understand what she was saying; it wasn’t clear enough. The first five hours she just lay there and slowly started to pick up. She would sigh, but after the moan everything was slow. She began sighing slowly until it normalized. After five hours when she opened her eyes, we kept the windows shut and covered the door entrance with a big blanket. The light was off because she couldn’t stand the light at all – at all, nothing, nothing; the light would bother her. When she began speaking after five hours, they were just words and she would get too tired; she had no strength. And we just sat there, wondering. We wanted to know; we wanted her to tell us quickly what she had seen, what had happened? She couldn’t tell us. She would tell us a little bit and then she would be tired. Two weeks went by until she was able to share her testimony, all of it. She would rebuke them, but they would not leave. She rebuked them again and suddenly, a light appeared, a tremendous light, a wonderful blessing, and then they would flee! It was the Lord, for she had no strength. She described the demons as ugly – very, very ugly. They were large and fat, ugly. She said there was no word to describe how horrible they were. They would arrive and throw themselves upon her to choke her and she would fight back rebuking them, but she had no strength. Then the Lord would arrive and they would leave.
The message to all humanity is to seek God. What my daughter went through was not easy. It’s a profound message because humanity feels that what it is doing is alright. Youth that are in drugs and alcohol nowadays think that it is alright, but it is wrong. One of the greatest experiences that my daughter had was when she saw many entertainers in hell, including dancers, and also, Pope John Paul II. Then, the message is that it is time to seek the Lord, to repent and to humble oneself before Him. What the Lord left written in his Word is real with a central message that says, “Heaven and Earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.” The Word of the Lord will come to pass in its due time. The Lord also showed her that tunnel where people were walking to hell. Many people are already in hell. Then, it is something that is real. Even the Lord’s people don’t believe this- they don’t believe. But this experience that the Lord allowed my daughter to have and took her to that place is something tremendous. The message is for us to seek the Lord, to turn to him not from the lips, but from the deepest part of the heart, for the coming of the Lord is at hand. He told us once that He had not come out of his love for humanity, but that He was at the door and explained, “I am no longer at the door; I am beyond the door. I will come soon; my coming is near. My people have left me and gone back to worldly things.” But the Lord gave us a message and told us, “Tell my people to return to the old paths.” The church today must go back to the old paths, for we know that it is where we are in the fire: seeking the Lord. When the trumpet sounds we must be ready to meet the Lord: It will be wonderful! The Lord’s Urgent Message Narrator- “Currently, Angelica Zambrano is preaching God’s message to all humanity. Right now, this documentary is being seen by many- thousands, millions of souls that are searching for the truth, like you have just done.” Angelica (before an audience)- The Lord told me at that moment,” Daughter, in those days the Holy Spirit will no longer be on Earth. In those days, He will no longer be on Earth.” And I began to see an enormous traffic; I began to see accidents and how people wanted to kill themselves. He told me, “They shall seek death, but death shall flee from humanity. Death will no longer be during that time.” Suddenly, I began to see people watching TV and magazines that read, “Thousands and Thousands have Disappeared.” Many already knew that Christ had come for his holy people. Keep on declaring what I have told you.” And I was crying all the way, pleading with Him, “Lord, please, don’t leave me here. Take me with you!” He responded, “Daughter, the nations, your family are waiting for you.” I insisted, “But Lord, I don’t want to stay here; I want to go up to the Kingdom of Heaven.” He said, “Daughter, you must enter that body. You must receive life, Daughter, so you can go and testify what you have seen. Many will not believe you; many will believe you, but I am your faithful witness. I am with you. I will never leave you.” Accept me as your child, Lord. In this hour I forgive anyone that I had not been able to forgive. I renounce to my lack of forgiveness. I renounce to all that has hindered your flow and I ask you to transform me and to fill me with your presence every day. Thank you, Father, Son and Holy Spirit; in the Name of Jesus, Amen. Blessed are those who are invited to the wedding supper of the Lamb!” And he added, “These are the true words of God. Rev. 19:20 Rev. 20:15 Rev. 21:4 Rev. 22:1 But the fearful and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. “No idolaters” because they will not inherit the Kingdom of Heaven. It is in the Bible. Ex. 20:3-6 Rev. 21:21 Rev. 21:27 And there shall in no wise enter into it anything that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb’s book of life. Rev. 22:11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous , let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still. Rev. 22:12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be. Rev. 22:13-15 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last. Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. For without are dogs and sorcerers, and whoremongers and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie. “The time is soon and God allows signs to reveal to humanity what is about to happen. Do not remain condemned; that’s what the devil wants. Have you asked yourself if you are already walking through hell’s tunnel? Today is the day of salvation and for you to invite Jesus, your Savior into your life. These are simple and yet great words to say: “I accept you, Jesus as my Lord and my only Savior. I give you my life and soul with all my heart. I want to be with you for eternity.”
“Take this now and choose your final destiny: Life or death, heaven or hell, Jesus or the devil. It’s clear: either you belong to Jesus or to the devil. Either you do what is right or you do what is wrong. You choose your destiny: eternal life or the lake of fire. Think about it. Take it and decide now. Jesus Christ died on the cross for each one of us- for our sins-and He gave us the opportunity of salvation by his mercy. Accept Christ as your only Savior. You just heard it and you saw it. Don” t let this moment be remembered forever while you are condemned for eternity in hell.” This documentary was produced and realized by the ministry: “El Sueño de Dios” together with “Godfilms” – to the glory of God in these last days of revelation. Angelica:
Demons arrived to torment her after all this. She could see them clearly. They would be disguised in the shadows. They were here within three days of her return and she couldn’t talk yet. She asked them what they wanted and they replied, “We have come to make a pact with you.” She asked,” What is that pact?” They told her, “You must shut up. You must not say anything of what you saw down there, because if you speak, we will kill you.”
Those people that had been left behind, who had known the Word, went crying through the streets, wanting to kill themselves, but they could not do anything. The Lord closed the screen and told me, “I will come for a holy people and I will come soon for my church.” That’s what He told me in the Kingdom of Heaven. But two weeks ago the Lord said to me, “Daughter, I take pleasure in what you are doing, that you are fulfilling what I have given you, but do not tell my people that I am coming soon. Tell my people that I am coming right away. “Again the Lord told me, “Tell my people that I am coming right away and that I am coming for a holy people. Tell my people that only the holy ones, only the holy ones will see me!” That afflicted me and he added, “And do not be silent:
He told me in the Kingdom of Heaven,” It’s time to return to Earth. You must return and you must tell humanity what I have shown you.” And I answered, “No, Lord. I don’t want to go.” When I was there I didn’t want to return to Earth. Then we started to walk; the angels gathered round and we began to descend these beautiful steps, white steps with flowers surrounding them.
Close your eyes and place your right hand over your heart. Raise your left hand and if you feel like crying, cry; and tell the Lord what you feel in heart to tell Him. Repeat after me – all of those that are going to accept the Lord- repeat this prayer with me: “Lord, I thank you for your love and your mercy. I thank you, Lord, for the word that has reached my heart today. In this hour, Father, I ask for your forgiveness. Forgive me. Wash me with your precious blood. Write my name in the Book of Life.
Conclusion
And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellow servant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God; for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of the prophecy.
And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty god.
And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
And he showed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.
Thou shalt have no other gods before me. Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; And showing mercy unto thousands of them that love, and keep my commandments.
And the twelve gates were twelve pearls; every several gate was of one pearl: and the street of the city was pure gold, as it were transparent glass.
Rev. 22:7
Behold, I came quickly: blessed is he that keepeth the sayings of the prophecy of this book.
Narrator- (With Angelica and Maxima at the Zambrano Family home)
“Then, it’s not a lie; it’s not a joke; it’s not a story; it’s not a dream- hell is real! Hell exists! To anyone that does not believe, I want to tell you that hell is real, very real. I cannot find words to tell you how real it is. I wish that you could experience it yourself.”
AMEN!!!!!
Thanks for sharing that testimony, dear brother in Christ!
Thanks for your kind reply.
In my opinion the various sects including your group are more representative of the whore of Babylon — the multi-headed symbol of chaos.
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