Posted on 04/12/2011 7:55:27 AM PDT by bkaycee
Can a born again Christian be a member of a cult and be involved in idol worship? I once thought this was an impossibility until it happened to me. Now I understand why Jesus warned us that, in the end times, there would be an appearance of great signs and miracles that would deceive even the elect, if possible. I confess I have been seduced by signs and miracles associated with apparitions of Mary, and I offer my testimony so others may be warned and delivered.
Until recently I was serving as Director of Public Relations for the Queen of Peace Center in Dallas, Texas. This non-profit organization disseminates information and messages from Marian apparitions in Medjugorje and around the world. I co-authored a full page ad that was published in the June 25, 1993, Dallas Morning News at a cost of $10,000. This add announced "Mary's" prescription for peace and listed locations of her recent appearances. It also listed phone numbers to call for up-to-day recorded messages of Mary's latest apparitions, such as the one in Dallas (214) 233-MARY. I once thought it was special to be the only non-Catholic on the Queen of Peace board . . . that is, until I met Mike Gendron and his wife, Jane.
A Divine Appointment
Neighbors and close friends of mine knew I was seriously contemplating becoming Roman Catholic. They told me that Mike had been a Roman Catholic for 37 years and was now a pastor at a non-denominational church in the Dallas area. They said he understood many of the issues involved in being Roman Catholic and could help me with my decision. I looked forward to meeting both Mike and his wife, not for my sake, but for theirs. I felt certain the information I had collected about "Our Lady's apparitions" in Medjugorje would surely lead them back home to the "true" (Roman Catholic) church. Providentially it appeared, I attended a Queen of Peace board meeting the night before we met and asked the board to pray for this lost pastor and his wife, who had fallen away. When I arrived at their door the next morning, I first introduced myself, before returning to my car for the large stack of books and newspapers I had brought to persuade them. The materials would help explain what was happening in Medjugorje and how the Virgin Mary would help change their lives.
Confronted by Contradictions
After we met, they showed me a film titled Catholicism: Crisis of Faith. This film lovingly and objectively contrasted how the teachings of the Roman Catholic Church contradicts the teachings of the Sacred Scriptures. Mike would stop the film after each segment for my questions and comments. Initially, I was argumentative and felt uneasy and rather adamant about what I was witnessing. Mike realized he had forgotten to pray before starting the film and asked if we could ask God to make His truth clear, and that all deception would be exposed. After the prayer my whole countenance changed.
Each question I asked, Mike validated his answers using Vatican II documents and an official Roman Catholic catechism. It was amazing to me how Roman Catholic teaching contradicts the very Word of God. Question after question, he would bring the Bible over to me and knell to show me verses in context. His servant's demeanor and patient, understanding heart helped in unraveling falsehood after falsehood. There wasn't a question I could have asked him that would have provoked anger. As a reflection of our Lord, this man allowed Jesus to pull the scales away from my eyes.
There were three things in the film and our discussion that were most alarming to me. First, a church in South America has Mary placed on a crucifix rather than Christ. It reminded me of my visit to Our Lady of Guadeloupe Cathedral in downtown Dallas where Mary is positioned as the focal point at the alter and the crucifix is placed in another part of the church. These two scenes made me realize idolatry is practiced within the church.
Second, the Roman Catholic Catechism by Rev. William Cogan, now in its 44th year of print, has altered the 10 commandments of God. The 2nd commandment given to Moses reads, "You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or in the earth beneath or in the water under the earth" (Exodus 20:4). The Roman Catholics have deleted this commandment but still came up with ten by splitting the 10th one into two separate commands. "You shall not covet your neighbor's good; and you shall not covet your neighbor's wife" (Exodus 20:17). I was reminded of the scriptural warnings for those who add to or subtract from the Bible.
Third, Mike told me the only place in the Bible in which the queen of heaven was referred to was in the Book of Jeremiah. He encouraged me to study the passage and it would expose another false doctrine concerning Mary. Anyone who is familiar with the prayers and meditations of the rosary can tell you that in one of the mysteries Christ supposedly crowned Mary the queen of heaven after she was assumed into heaven. Neither of these events have scriptural validity, but I had decided to blindly accept these doctrines because all of the other meditations on the life of Christ were verified by Scripture.
The Queen of Heaven
After returning home, I looked in the Interpreter's Dictionary of the Bible for the passage in Jeremiah 44. Here, the Lord was angered by the wickedness of the people choosing to serve other gods. The people refused to listen to the Lord. Instead, they would "burn sacrifices to the Queen of Heaven and pour out libations to her." The woman "made for her sacrificial cakes in her image and poured out libations to her?" (Jeremiah 44:17, 19).
In Hebrew the word for queen has reference to "the heavenly handiwork" or "the stars of heaven." The reference might be to Ishtar, the goddess of love and fertility, who is identified with the Venus Star and is actually entitled "Mistress of Heaven." (The Interpreter's Dictionary of the Bible, p. 975)
My head was spinning and filled with questions after reading this. Doesn't Mary usually appear with stars for her crown? Who then is the woman in Revelation 12:3-6? And most importantly, why would the Roman Catholic Church give the mother of Jesus the title of a pagan goddess? Had I been promoting the ministry of a pagan goddess whose messages were inconsistent with the Bible? Indeed her messages do contradict the Bible. In fact, she speaks of another gospel, another plan of salvation that nullifies and opposes the all sufficient sacrifice of Jesus. The apparition of Fatima said, "You have seen Hell where the souls of poor sinners go, so save them, God wishes to establish in the world, devotion to my Immaculate Heart." The apostle Paul condemned anyone, even an angel from heaven, who would dare preach a different way to be saved other than through the life, death, and resurrection of Christ (Galatians 1:6-10).
As for the woman described in Revelation, she is not Mary, the mother of Jesus, but God's chosen people, the Jews. When the passage in chapter 12 is read in context with the rest of the book, and Genesis 37:9-10, this clearly refers to the nation Israel. God fulfills His promise to the Jews, by protecting them in the desert during 3 1/2 years of tribulation.
I later realized my prayers to Mary and the saints, the reciting of rosaries and chaplets of divine mercy, and the wearing of Marian medals and scapulars had taken my focus off of Jesus. I had allowed doctrines of the Roman Catholic church to do the very thing Saint Paul warned against, "But I am afraid, lest as the serpent deceived Eve by his craftiness, your minds should be led astray from the simplicity and purity of devotion to Christ." (2 Cor. 11:3).
An Angel of Light
Recently, a person whom I love dearly, and who has a "Marian devotion" asked me, "Why are you bothering the people who are already good people instead of worrying about those who are lost?" The answer came to me the other evening as the Lord continues to guide me through His sacred Word. Saint Paul wrote that "Satan masquerades as an angel of light" (2 Corinthians 11:14). We know the mother of Jesus would never oppose her Son, and since the apparitions do just that, they could very well be Satan masquerading as Mary. Saint Paul also wrote, "Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them . . . everything exposed by the light becomes visible" (Ephesians 5:11-14). Therefore, I feel called to expose these attempts by the evil one to divert people's devotion away from Jesus. The most authoritative way to do this is with the light of God's Holy Word. My new test for truthfulness is -- if it does not agree with the Scriptures then it must be rejected.
Freedom in the Truth
Now that I have torn down the altar in my bedroom, where I knelt and prayed to St. Anthony of Padua each night, and now that I have placed my rosaries, scapular and medals away, I have found a new freedom. The truth really does set people free! I have found special peace in knowing Jesus alone is my Savior, and not co-redemptrix with His mother. The Holy Spirit continues to lead me into all truth and is now the only teacher I need (1 John 2:27).
To all my precious friends who I have encouraged to seek Mary and to obey the misleading messages of her apparitions, I pray these Scriptures would minister to you -- "And it came about while He said these things, one of the women in the crowd raised her voice and said to Him, 'Blessed is the womb that bore You, and the breasts at which you nursed.' But He said, 'On the contrary, blessed are those who hear the Word of God and observe it." (Luke 11:27-28)
This article was submitted by a former Director for a "Mary, Queen of Peace Center."
Cheap Grace is a problem.
And if that's what you'd done, I wouldn't have called it sophistry. But, maybe through ellipsis or some other thing -- in any event not saying what you meant, both of these reek of sophistry.
I wonder if the diversity of humans and of loves is sufficiently acknowledged. To PRESUME to judge someone's devotion on how he answers, "Who/what is Jesus to you?" is, well, presumptuous IMHO. If I've just spoken for 45 minutes on the Trinity and the Hypostatic Union I might have an entirely different answer from what I'd have if I had been talking about the atonement.
The theological impossibility of an adequate statement beyond the reach of cavil on ANY important truth means that any short statement can be criticized -- while few will read a book long enough to be adequate.
Keep in mind
That IHS XP
Has died for us,
And is risen from the dead.
He is our saving Lord;
He is Joy for all ages.
If that's enough, why do we need a Bible? If it's not enough, can we ever have enough?
I recall, also, the little old ladies, mostly "charismatics" at a church I served who would come up to one and, as it were, shove a thermometer under one's tongue, take it out and decide if one was sufficient, all in a few minutes.
I tremble for their souls. The eagerness to judge is a problem.
You are right. There are many who are teachable and we never stop learning His Truths.
This is the Log in our eye.
This is one of the main attributes of a child like faith.
The objective reality: your sect is vile and offensive to God. You crave sects because without them you would have not choice but to be part of the Original, the tast the refreshes, the Church (yep - the only real one).
Yep - THAT one.
The one that’s been doing His thing for 2,000 years!
ayThe objective reality: your sect is vile and offensive to God. You crave sects because without them you would have no choice but to be part of the Original, the taste that refreshes, the Church (yep - the only real one).
Yep - THAT one.
The one that’s been doing His thing for 2,000 years!
John 16:7-11 7Nevertheless, I tell you the truth: it is to your advantage that I go away, for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you. But if I go, I will send him to you. 8 And when he comes, he will convict the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment: 9concerning sin, because they do not believe in me; 10 concerning righteousness, because I go to the Father, and you will see me no longer; 11 concerning judgment, because the ruler of this world is judged.
John6:44 No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day.
Mad dog says
I don’t see how these verses contradict what I wrote.
So lets see what it is Mad Dawg wrote
But it also stands not only to reason but to experience that one cannot get a good understanding of one's sinfulness until one has a good understanding or experience of God's love
Actually men have to understand the depth of their filthiness before a Holy God.. When men see that they can never pay for that sin..that they are so unclean before God that His wrath is upon them...only then can they understand the love of God.. and that understanding of their sinful state will never come from themselves..... men love their sin.. to justify it they compare themselves to their neighbors or people on TV.. they see themselves as worthy COMPARED TO OTHER MEN.. it is the work of the Holy Spirit to convict us of our sin... ...
Repentance can not come from the core of a man..God has to give it to Him
John 16:7-11 7Nevertheless, I tell you the truth: it is to your advantage that I go away, for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you. But if I go, I will send him to you. 8 And when he comes, he will convict the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment: 9concerning sin, because they do not believe in me; 10 concerning righteousness, because I go to the Father, and you will see me no longer; 11 concerning judgment, because the ruler of this world is judged.
John6:44 No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day.
Mad dog says
I don’t see how these verses contradict what I wrote.
So lets see what it is Mad Dawg wrote
But it also stands not only to reason but to experience that one cannot get a good understanding of one's sinfulness until one has a good understanding or experience of God's love
Actually men have to understand the depth of their filthiness before a Holy God.. When men see that they can never pay for that sin..that they are so unclean before God that His wrath is upon them...only then can they understand the love of God.. and that understanding of their sinful state will never come from themselves..... men love their sin.. to justify it they compare themselves to their neighbors or people on TV.. they see themselves as worthy COMPARED TO OTHER MEN.. it is the work of the Holy Spirit to convict us of our sin... ...
Repentance can not come from the core of a man..God has to give it to Him
Some sects may be full of happy people, but that doesn’t excuse Christians for joining them in gay sects.
That would be covered in the Catholic beliefs of Jesus.
I would be very cautious how one characterizes The Holy Spirit.. He is the helper that Christ promises.. and that helper exposes our sin ..and leads us to truth ...dismissing His work might border on blasphemy
Here is what 36 years as a Christian has taught me.. the first thing believers do is not to give the theology of Jesus.. they FIRST celebrate and identify Him as their Savior and Lord.. but those words do not roll easily off the lips of one for whom he is not Savior and Lord...
LOL! I think I need to save that post!
Ohh well that takes care of it huh? It is mentioned somewhere in the Catechism... funny that was not given as an answer? I wonder why it never came to mind??
As usual, this is post of yours is very good.
I had never thought about that ...thanks... There is a strong significance to that.. Jesus fulfilled the "type" found in the priesthood. He is the final High Priest ... that curtain was the separation that kept the people out of the Holy of Holies. .Only the High Priest had access to that Holy Place one time a year on the Day of atonement.. Now Christ had fulfilled that type as well and now there is no more a "special" set aside men..we all have access to the holy of Holies with the blood of Christ..their stand no barrier between God and man.. we can now come bodily before the throne of God when we are in need of mercy or grace
What a God we have ......... Hallelujah
But it also stands not only to reason but to experience that one cannot get a good understanding of one's sinfulness until one has a good understanding or experience of God's love.
(I bolded one word, since it is important to my defense.)
Now, though you don't take the trouble to be clear, I assume that you offer the following as an objection or correction to what I wrote:
it is the work of the Holy Spirit to convict us of our sin... ...
Repentance can not come from the core of a man..God has to give it to Him.
The rest of it is merely a contradiction, not an argument.
Now I do not see anything in what I said that indicates HOW one gets either a sense of divine love or a sense of one's own crying need for it, what the agency or origin is of either of those gifts or indeed anything whatsoever that contradicts either your statement or metmom's.
What I do see is that you do not make your case (or I missed it.)
Please,if is not your intention to waste my time, show me EXACTLY what I said that contradicts what metmom quoted or what you argued.
By "exactly," I mean this. Show me that what I said is logically necessarily equivalent to a statement that contradicts what either or both of you said. Leave no steps out.
I do not see any contradiction. That doesn't mean there isn't one, just that I can't find it.
Please do not introduce an a new argument or insist that a particular spin on what I said is equivalent to what I said.
I do not think you can do it. As far as I can tell what I wrote was a sequence of events ("until"). I did not say anything about the cause or origin of the events. I did not say anything about what was "sufficient".
Consequently, to say the Holy Spirit is the cause or origin does not have any relevance whatsoever to what I said.
Similarly what metmom bolded was a verse about WHO does the convicting. (And there is an array of possibilities about whether "he will convict the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment" necessarily describes or is confined to the conversion of the individual OR about any sequence of events in that conversion.) Again there is nothing about the sequence of events. Therefore there is no relevance to what I wrote. Therefore there is no contradiction.
What is your argument?
Yep, it does.
It is mentioned somewhere in the Catechism... funny that was not given as an answer?
I don't know what exactly you mean by that.
I wonder why it never came to mind??
It is part of the Catholic beliefs of Jesus, so it was already covered. The two specific beliefs I mentioned were that He is 100% man and 100% God and that He is the second Person of the Trinity. I only specifically singled out those beliefs, because I know metmom does not say that she agrees with the first and I was not (and still am not) sure whether she believes the second.
We are told to Judge the spiritual condition of other by Christ.. But He cautions that we judge correctly..because the measure we use to measure other is the measure used to measure us..
Jhn 7:24 Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.
We are told not to be yoked with the unsaved.. that requires a judgment ...
1Cr 6:2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
The only verse the unsaved seem to know is "judge not " but they do not seem to understand the point..
Look, you see what I have going on here. I simply cannot manage another issue now. It wouldn’t be fair to the issue or to either of us.
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