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To: caww

Thank you for the link. I appreciate it.

REgarding catholicism-I’m not convinced regarding the Catholic church; I’m not rejecting it out right but it never made sense to me as far as the anti-christ aspect of it. But we do know that at the end there will be one religion...many religions will blend into one (like you said ‘chummy). But as far as Catholicism taking a lead role in the end times...I’m just not convinced now, especially in light of what we are witnessing with Islam.

Well time for bed. Thanks again caww. Have a great nite.


18 posted on 03/29/2011 12:23:33 AM PDT by Outlaw Woman
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To: Outlaw Woman; caww
It's actually a lie

here's the truth: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1702111/posts

Pope's Speech at University of Regensburg (full prepared text)

I was reminded of all this recently, when I read the edition by Professor Theodore Khoury (Münster) of part of the dialogue carried on-- perhaps in 1391 in the winter barracks near Ankara-- by the erudite Byzantine emperor Manuel II Paleologus and an educated Persian on the subject of Christianity and Islam, and the truth of both. It was probably the emperor himself who set down this dialogue, during the siege of Constantinople between 1394 and 1402; and this would explain why his arguments are given in greater detail than the responses of the learned Persian.

The dialogue ranges widely over the structures of faith contained in the Bible and in the Qur'an, and deals especially with the image of God and of man, while necessarily returning repeatedly to the relationship of the three Laws: the Old Testament, the New Testament, and the Qur'an. In this lecture I would like to discuss only one point-- itself rather marginal to the dialogue itself-- which, in the context of the issue of faith and reason, I found interesting and which can serve as the starting-point for my reflections on this issue.

In the seventh conversation edited by Professor Khoury, the emperor touches on the theme of the jihad (holy war). The emperor must have known that surah 2, 256 reads: There is no compulsion in religion. It is one of the suras of the early period, when Mohammed was still powerless and under threat.

But naturally the emperor also knew the instructions, developed later and recorded in the Qur’an, concerning holy war. Without descending to details, such as the difference in treatment accorded to those who have the “Book” and the “infidels,” he turns to his interlocutor somewhat brusquely with the central question on the relationship between religion and violence in general, in these words:

Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached.

The emperor goes on to explain in detail the reasons why spreading the faith through violence is something unreasonable. Violence is incompatible with the nature of God and the nature of the soul.

God is not pleased by blood, and not acting reasonably is contrary to God's nature. Faith is born of the soul, not the body. Whoever would lead someone to faith needs the ability to speak well and to reason properly, without violence and threats... To convince a reasonable soul, one does not need a strong arm, or weapons of any kind, or any other means of threatening a person with death.... The decisive statement in this argument against violent conversion is this: not to act in accordance with reason is contrary to God's nature. The editor, Theodore Khoury, observes "For the emperor, as a Byzantine shaped by Greek philosophy, this statement is self-evident. But for Muslim teaching, God is absolutely transcendent. His will is not bound up with any of our categories, even that of rationality." Here Khoury quotes a work of the noted French Islamist R. Arnaldez, who points out thatbn Hazn went so far as to state that God is not bound even by his own word, and that nothing would oblige him to reveal the truth to us. Were it God's will, we would even have to practice idolatry.


19 posted on 03/29/2011 1:10:08 AM PDT by Cronos (Palin: 2012)
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To: Outlaw Woman; caww
The Battle of Vienna (9/10/1683 -- note the date, Al Q chose 9/11 for a reason) when Catholic Austro-Hungaria, Poland, Spain, Czechs, Southern Catholic Germans pushed back the Moslem forces and started the decline of the Ottomans

Polish winged Hussars


Polish King Jan Sobieski III at Vienna


Jan Sobieski III sending message of Victory to the Pope.

We are on the frontlines of the battle against Islam -- in Africa, in Asia, in Europe and yet we face lies by folks who stay at home in the US, far away from the front lines and dream up conspiracy theories???

20 posted on 03/29/2011 1:18:42 AM PDT by Cronos (Palin: 2012)
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To: caww

300 year commemoration in which the Ottomans were pushed back.

Don't make up illogical claims.

21 posted on 03/29/2011 1:19:51 AM PDT by Cronos (Palin: 2012)
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