Posted on 03/08/2011 10:19:18 AM PST by NYer
Protestants say we’re saved by faith. Some Catholics say we’re saved by good works.
What does the Bible say?
This Sunday’s readings* are clear — it’s neither. And it’s both. At the very same time.
First, let’s define our terms. When St. Paul says “works” don’t save us, he is really referring to two things. First of all, he is speaking about the “works” of the Mosaic Law, which include everything from keeping dietary regulations to observing the Ten Commandments. Secondly, he means good actions performed by willpower, without any particular help from God. Paul had thought that rigorous observance of the Law, carrying out its prescribed works, was the key to making a person right with God. But his attempts to observe the law met with frustration (see Romans 7:15-24). The Law made him aware of God’s will but did not enable him to carry it out. “I cannot even understand my own actions. I do not do what I want to do but what I hate … what a wretched man I am!” His attempts at outward observance didn’t change his heart. In fact his heart was so far from God that he cruelly persecuted the followers of Jesus, looking on in approval as St. Stephen was stoned to death.
In Romans 3:23 St. Paul lays it out: We have all sinned seriously. None of us, on our own steam and by our own merits, can ever do enough to earn God’s favor. So God has fixed the problem — he gives us his favor as a free, undeserved gift in response to the sacrifice of Jesus, His son. We become pleasing to him, reconciled to him, not by our own efforts but by the cross of Christ. We receive this gift through the act of faith. So we are saved by faith, not by the works — at least not by the works of the Mosaic Law, done by our own strength.
So the faith camp wins? Not so fast. Let’s take a closer look at what the Bible means by faith.
Many people think that faith is belief. Belief that God exists … that Jesus is the son of God … that Jesus rose from the dead. Intellectual assent to all these truths is of course important, and is an indispensable part of the act of faith. Such belief often leads to religious actions — the hanging of crucifixes in our home, the wearing of medals, the recitation of prayers. These acts of piety are also good.
But Sunday’s Gospel says that mere belief and acts of piety are not enough to save us. Those rejected by God in Matt 7:21-23 clearly “believed” in Jesus; in fact, they prophesied and worked miracles in Jesus’ name. Perhaps they also said novenas in his name. But he said to them “out of my sight, you evil doers.” One of the strongest lines in the gospels provides an explanation: “None of those who cry out, ‘Lord, Lord’ will enter the kingdom of God but only the one who does the will of my Father in heaven.”
Biblical faith is not just belief. It is surrender. It is a complete entrusting of oneself to God in Christ and acceptance of his power, his will, and his plan. If we truly say yes to Him and let his grace into our hearts, we’ll never be the same. His love begins to work through us and change our lives. His Spirit takes up residence within us, giving us the strength to do what we could never do on our own, even to begin to love like He loves.
So true biblical faith is not passive. It is active, dynamic and alive. That’s why St. James says that faith without works is dead (James 2:24-26). Abraham believed that an unknown God was calling him to leave civilization and march into the desert to find a land that this God has promised him. Abraham did not sit and contemplate this call or set up a shrine to this God. He got up and began walking (Genesis 12).
So we are justified by faith, if we mean the authentic biblical faith that causes us to walk in God’s ways. And we are justified by works, if we mean the works of charity that can only flow from faith and grace.
So really, it’s not faith vs. works. It’s faith that works.
Philippians 2:12-18 (KJ)
12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.
14 Do all things without murmurings and disputings:
15 That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;
16 Holding forth the word of life; that I may rejoice in the day of Christ, that I have not run in vain, neither laboured in vain.
17 Yea, and if I be offered upon the sacrifice and service of your faith, I joy, and rejoice with you all.
18 For the same cause also do ye joy, and rejoice with me.
When Paul was on his second mission trip and talking to the Phillippians and he was talking about "work out your salvation" it was not a reference to "earn ones salvation" but his expression of one's salvation in spiritual growth and development. Salvation is a gift received once and for all, it is however expressed as an ongoing process where the believer is actively involved. "Fear and trembling" is not doubt and anxiety but in reference to active reverence and spinelessness purpose of response to God's Grace.
Colossians 1:24 Now I rejoice in my sufferings for your sake, and in my flesh I am filling up what is lacking 14 in the afflictions of Christ on behalf of his body, which is the church,
Only God’s sacrifice can pay the penalty of sin. Nothing else.
But Scripture simply doesn't say this. God … will repay each person according to what they have done.” Not what they believe.
Try this – instead of trying to reconcile your “faith alone” belief to Scripture, start with Scripture. Start with James, just for fun. James shows how useless it is to wish someone well without actually helping them, illustrating this by pointing to the cases of Abraham and Rahab. He then forthrightly states: "Do you want to be shown … that faith apart from works is barren?"
“You foolish person, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless? Was not our father Abraham considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? You see that his faith and his actions were working together, and his faith was made complete by what he did. And the scripture was fulfilled that says, “Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness,” and he was called God’s friend. You see that a person is considered righteous by what they do and not by faith alone. In the same way, was not even Rahab the prostitute considered righteous for what she did when she gave lodging to the spies and sent them off in a different direction? As the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead. In the same way, was not even Rahab the prostitute considered righteous for what she did when she gave lodging to the spies and sent them off in a different direction? As the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead. James 2:20-26
"Whoever thinks he is standing secure should take care not to fall" (1 Cor. 10:11–12).
You indeed might just be saved: “Who gave himself for our sins, that he might deliver us from this present evil world, according to the will of God and our Father: Galatians 1:4
And only IF you remain in his kindness. "See, then, the kindness and severity of God: severity toward those who fell, but God’s kindness to you, provided you remain in his kindness, otherwise you too will be cut off" Rom. 11:22–23
And only IF you endure: Here is a trustworthy saying: If we died with him, we will also live with him; if we endure, we will also reign with him. (2 Tim. 2:11–12).
And only IF you stand firm: [Jesus said] “All men will hate you because of me, but he who stands firm to the end will be saved.” Mark 13:13
And only IF you do what God wants: “God “will repay each person according to what they have done.” To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life. But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger. (Rom. 2:6–8).
Clearly, what you do is rewarded by God. Like Paul, you must be ‘working out my salvation in fear and trembling’ (Phil. 2:12), knowing that it is God’s gift of Grace that is working in you.
There were two Christians standing at the gates of Heaven. One a Baptist, the other a Catholic. When asked why they should be allowed in Heaven, they both stated that they believed Jesus died on the Cross for thier sins and tried to live their lives with the atonement of Christ in mind. Both were faithful. The gates opened to the Baptist and he was allowed to enter. When the Catholic asked why he wasn’t given entry to Heaven immediately, he was told that there are some things they need to discuss. 1)Why did he believe that those who soley believe that Jesus died on the Cross for their sins were not worthy? (Judgemental) 2) Explain the Mary issue and why such reverance (Idol Worship) to someone other than the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit? 3) Why pray to the Saints when I AM the way to heaven?
See how silly this argument can be? I believe in the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. I believe that Jesus Christ died on the Cross for my sins and the sins of man. This is stated as justification in the bible. I cannot get to the Father without this basic truth. That truth drives my actions and draws me to charity and other “works.” Those works alone will not get me to Heaven.
When Paul was preaching to the Gentiles he had all mannor of physical suffering (may had to do with his prison time). What he is talking about here is not a deficiency of the Cross but his own personal physical sufferings that he suffered as he preached the “Good News”. He preached that Christ suffered on the Cross to atone for sin. Paul is preaching he accepts his physical ailments while preaching on behalf of Christ.
Just a question... if the work was done there on the Cross, why aren't we in Heaven? Is God just wasting our time?
Well, I do not know about your God but my God doesn’t waste time.
I am not in heave as yet because my physical body is still functioning.
Dolt - HEAVEN not heave
“Let your light shine before men in such a way that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father who is in heaven.” Matthew 5:16
‘For we are God’s workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.” Ephesians 2:10
We are justified (declared righteous) by God through faith in the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. (Romans 5:1) Men will declare us righteous when they see our good works. God knows who his sheep are. (John 10:4-5, 14) How will men know, unless we do good?
I have to leave in a moment, but a quick response: Colossians 1:21-22: “And you which were in past times strangers and enemies, because your minds were set in evil works, hath he now also reconciled. In that body of his flesh, through death, to make you holy and unblameable, and without fault in his sight.” That is but one verse where it is made clear that justification occurs once. “Reconciled” is past tense - not future, not present progressive. Christ’s death has made us without fault - because of Christ’s sacrifice, not because of anything we have done or can do or will do. The warnings not to fall away in Scripture I can address later in full context but because of time constraints cannot do so now. I hope, however, that this thread can continue to be peaceful and not become acrimonious. Best to you.
Sanctification.
I am just repeating the literal words of the bible.
When Paul was preaching to the Gentiles he had all mannor of physical suffering (may had to do with his prison time). What he is talking about here is not a deficiency of the Cross but his own personal physical sufferings that he suffered as he preached the “Good News”. He preached that Christ suffered on the Cross to atone for sin. Paul is preaching he accepts his physical ailments while preaching on behalf of Christ. So you are saying the Paul is wrong and the Bible contains error? Because the literal words say different. Oh wait I see you are one of those that when Jesus says "This is my Body", "This is my blood" think he is lying. well he we think that the words in the Bible are the truth.
“ Christ is sufficient or He’s not. Of course He is. Only God’s sacrifice can pay the penalty of sin. Nothing else.”
Let me add for those stuck on the “my works will get me there” side of the argument, There will be rewards at the Judgment Seat of Christ for the works knowing and unknowing we do in this life, but those works do not earn us salvation. That “work” is complete already in Christ.
And if it is Belief + Works, I sure feel sorry for those accepting Christ at the last moments of their life – not having time left for works.
Now how did I know this was your work after just reading the first sentence?
You need to read two verses further: Colossians 1:24 Now I rejoice in my sufferings for your sake, and in my flesh I am filling up what is lacking 14 in the afflictions of Christ on behalf of his body, which is the church,
When you read scripture it will help you if you have some historical perspective.
No, I do not believe Jesus lies, even the claim is ridiculous.
But here's the deal: we can choose to do, or not do, those things. That's the key to the discussion of faith vs. works.
Jesus didn't say that it is sufficient to believe; when He gathers people, He says "follow me." Faith is tested; and the true test of our faith, is our willingness to "follow" -- to actually act on our faith.
To act according to our faith, is often called "an outward sign of an inward grace." But we how often do we keep that light under the bushel instead? I certainly do so a lot more often than I care to admit.
It's interesting to note how often follow appears in the Gospels, and in what context.
Jesus gives people a choice; hence, we have the disciples who choose to follow (and still fail to do so on the night He was betrayed); and by contrast we have the Rich Young Man, who wants to follow but cannot manage to make the choice.
We have Nicodemus, who hid his faith while Jesus lived; and who revealed it on the day He died.
He also told this parable to some who trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and treated others with contempt: "Two men went up into the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. The Pharisee, standing by himself, prayed thus: 'God, I thank you that I am not like other men, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even like this tax collector. I fast twice a week; I give tithes of all that I get.' But the tax collector, standing far off, would not even lift up his eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, 'God, be merciful to me, a sinner!' I tell you, this man went down to his house justified, rather than the other. For everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, but the one who humbles himself will be exalted." (Luke 18:9-14)
Hint: you're not the tax collector in that story.
How in the world can you interpret Colossians 1:24 as having to do with salvation?
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