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To: St_Thomas_Aquinas

Having gotten my undergraduate degree from Notre Dame and taken a theology course taught by a priest who was a proponent of textual criticism I can assure you that proving the inspiration of Scripture is the furthest thing from the mind of the textual critic.

While the Catholic and Greek Orthodox churches may be the oldest Christian organizations on earth, it is the Baptists who most closely capture the faith and mindset of the early church fathers in the first few hundred years AD in this modern world.


20 posted on 01/23/2011 6:44:06 AM PST by Yet_Again
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To: Yet_Again
That institution you mentioned ceased being Catholic more than fifty years ago and since Vatican II many clergy have joined the intellectual agnostic ranks. It appears you met one or more.

I have attended many Baptist churches and hypocrisy abounds. Alleged Baptist proximity to Christianity be it early or current is a figment of imagination. They are the group most associated with and known for involvement the Know Nothing , Nativist and KKK movements in this nation. How do you associate early Christianity with that historical record?

28 posted on 01/23/2011 7:16:12 AM PST by bronx2 (while Jesus is the Alpha /Omega He has given us rituals which you reject to obtain the graces as to)
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To: Yet_Again
it is the Baptists who most closely capture the faith and mindset of the early church fathers in the first few hundred years AD in this modern world.

Seriously -- why do you say that?

Especially in light of what is written in The Didache (written in AD 70)
Centrality of communion
"Confess your sins in church, and do not go up to your prayer with an evil conscience. This is the way of life. . . . On the Lord’s Day gather together, break bread, and give thanks, after confessing your transgressions so that your sacrifice may be pure" (Didache 4:14, 14:1 [A.D. 70]).

Baptism
"Concerning baptism, baptize in this manner: Having said all these things beforehand, baptize in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit in living water [that is, in running water, as in a river]. If there is no living water, baptize in other water; and, if you are not able to use cold water, use warm. If you have neither, pour water three times upon the head in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit Chapter 9

42 posted on 01/23/2011 7:53:22 AM PST by Cronos (Bobby Jindal 2012)
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To: Yet_Again
A straightforward reading of the Acts of the Apostles shows that the Church was very centralized even during the Apostolic Era.

In the Acts of the Apostles, we find a Church that is immediately centralized in Jerusalem. When Peter has his disturbing vision in which God directs him to admit the Gentiles into the Church, he refers back at once to the apostolic leadership in Jerusalem (Acts 11:2).

The mission of the infant Church was directed from Jerusalem, with Barnabas and Agabus being sent to Antioch (Acts 11:22, 27). The Council of Jerusalem (Acts 15) was convened to decide the Gentile question, and the council sent a letter of instruction to the new churches in Antioch, Syria, and Cilicia (Acts 15:23). Philip, John, Mark, Barnabas, and Paul travel to and from Jerusalem, providing a teaching and disciplinary link between the new churches and the church in Jerusalem. After the destruction of Jerusalem in AD 69 authority is not centered in Jerusalem, but rather vested in Peter and Paul as apostles, as their epistles to the various churches attest. This central authority was very soon focused on Rome, so that St. Ignatius, a bishop of Antioch, wrote to the Romans in the year 108, affirming that their church was the one that had the "superior place in love among the churches."

by the time of Irenaeus in the mid-second century, the centralizing role of the Bishop of Rome was already well established. From then on, citation after citation from the apostolic Fathers shows that the whole Church—from Gaul to North Africa and from Syria to Spain—affirms the primacy of the Bishop of Rome as the successor of Peter and Paul.
43 posted on 01/23/2011 7:54:22 AM PST by Cronos (Bobby Jindal 2012)
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To: Yet_Again
From the beginning the churches were ruled by elders (bishops). Acts 14:23, and Timothy1:5 describes the apostles appointing these elders. The elders kept in touch with the apostles and with the elders of the other churches through travel and communication by epistle (1 Pt 1:1, 5:1). Remember that this was in the Roman and Parthian Empires and the speed of their communication was not rivalled until the invention of the telegraph.

In the early Church we do not find independent congregations meeting on their own and determining their own affairs by reading the Bible. In the first two centuries the canon of the New Testament had not yet been decided. Instead, from the earliest time we find churches governed by the bishops and clergy whose authenticity is validated by their succession from the apostles. So Clement of Rome writes, "Our apostles also knew, through our Lord Jesus Christ, that there would be strife on the question of the bishop’s office. Therefore for this reason . . . they appointed the aforesaid persons and later made further provision that if they should fall asleep other tested men should succeed to their ministry" (Letter to the Corinthians, 44). Ignatius of Antioch writes letters to six different churches and instructs the Romans, "be submissive to the bishop and to one another as Jesus Christ was to the Father and the Apostles to Christ . . . that there may be unity."
44 posted on 01/23/2011 7:55:53 AM PST by Cronos (Bobby Jindal 2012)
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To: Yet_Again

really??? they deny baptismal regeneration and infant baptism. no one believed as they do until the 16th century. read the church fathers, which one was a baptist?


133 posted on 01/23/2011 11:52:13 AM PST by one Lord one faith one baptism
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