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The Not So Secret Rapture
reformed.org ^ | W. Fred Rice

Posted on 01/14/2011 5:57:52 PM PST by topcat54

Evangelical book catalogs promote books such as Planet Earth: The Final Chapter, The Great Escape, and the Left Behind series. Bumper stickers warn us that the vehicle’s occupants may disappear at any moment. It is clear that there is a preoccupation with the idea of a secret rapture. Perhaps this has become more pronounced recently due to the expectation of a new millennium and the fears regarding potential Y2K problems. Perhaps psychologically people are especially receptive to the idea of an imminent, secret rapture at the present time. Additionally, many Christians are not aware that any other position relative to the second coming of Jesus Christ exists. Even in Reformed circles there are numerous people reading these books. Many of these people are unaware that this viewpoint conflicts with Scripture and Reformed Theology.

(Excerpt) Read more at reformed.org ...


TOPICS: Theology
KEYWORDS: crusades; endtimes; eschatology; rapture
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To: wmfights
It has now become SOP to insist that posters go back through 1,000's of posts to find the reference and then the poster asking for this will insist that since it is a paraphrase that someone has lied. It's disingenuous and not worthy of response.

It's just a diversionary tactic when they don't wish to admit the truth.

Exactly. It's been that way for a long time.

It's just more stalling because they have no Scriptural rebuttal.

1,841 posted on 01/29/2011 10:34:29 AM PST by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: metmom; MarkBsnr
God picked a really fickle bunch of the self indulgent, didn't He?

I don't see the fruit in this line of reasoning for any party here.

Deuteronomy 4:37 pretty much explains why God chose who He did: "And because he loved thy fathers, therefore He chose their seed after them, and brought thee out in His sight with His mighty power out of Egypt"

Or a fuller picture stated a few chapters later:

Deuteronomy 7:6-8 "For you are a holy people to the Lord your God; the Lord your God has chosen you to be a people for Himself, a special treasure above all the peoples on the face of the earth. The Lord did not set His love on you nor choose you because you were more in number than any other people, for you were the least of all peoples; but because the Lord loves you, and because He would keep the oath which He swore to your fathers, the Lord has brought you out with a mighty hand, and redeemed you from the house of bondage, from the hand of Pharaoh king of Egypt.

Granted, the Jews were and still are a bunch of Reprobates, earning their condemnation in spades because they were more wicked than Nineveh (Mt 12:41), Ethiopia (v42) and Tyre and Sidon (11:20-21). The greatest enemies of the Church has always been the Jews, and throughout their existence they have always had a remarkable talent for talking themselves into ovens.

When God was giving the world an analogy to how rebellious and idolatrous the sons of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob were, we got the all-to-vivid imagery of Hosea's Turbo-Slut wife, Gomer. Much of the characterization of Israel as a whore would make the must licentious and promiscuous porn star look downright chaste in comparison.

I would elaborate further but I don't need to be falsely labeled as an "anti-semite" by the weak minded in FR.

On the other hand, the Jewish people are overrepresented in the professions, in the patent offices, and among the financially well-to-do. When I need to have something done right, and cost isn't a factor, I always seem to end up at the office of someone of ethnic Jewish heritage - which is fine. For a people practically universally hated throughout the world, they do remarkably well.

Perhaps one could sum it up by saying, that generally speaking Jews are overachievers, unfortunately one all to common manifestation of their overachievement is in their opposition and hatred of Jesus Christ and His Church.

How this works out ultimately in God's plan? I defer to Deuteronomy 29:29 "The secret things belong to the LORD our God...". One thing is for certain, if God was looking for the most stubborn and rebellious people and least deserving people to love, He surely chose the right group to best exhibit His forbearance, love, patience and mercy.

The take-away from this is - no matter how rotten we are, no matter how depraved, wicked and sinful as individuals we can be, our LORD's Grace can still find us and save us from the Wrath to Come.

1,842 posted on 01/29/2011 10:34:39 AM PST by The Theophilus
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To: The Theophilus
How this works out ultimately in God's plan? I defer to Deuteronomy 29:29 "The secret things belong to the LORD our God..." One thing is for certain, if God was looking for the most stubborn and rebellious people and least deserving people to love, He surely chose the right group to best exhibit His forbearance, love, patience and mercy.

The take-away from this is - no matter how rotten we are, no matter how depraved, wicked and sinful as individuals we can be, our LORD's Grace can still find us and save us from the Wrath to Come.

AMEN! That is my perspective, too. Just as God's mercy may well cover any and all infants dying young, so, too, if He so wills, will the Jews be saved by grace.

1,843 posted on 01/29/2011 10:40:41 AM PST by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: The Theophilus

‘While we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.’


1,844 posted on 01/29/2011 10:45:26 AM PST by MHGinTN (Some, believing they can't be deceived, it's nigh impossible to convince them when they're deceived.)
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To: Dr. Eckleburg

a sacred cow?


1,845 posted on 01/29/2011 10:46:12 AM PST by 1000 silverlings (everything that deceives, also enchants: Plato)
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To: The Theophilus; MarkBsnr; 1000 silverlings; Alex Murphy; bkaycee; blue-duncan; boatbums; caww; ...
The take-away from this is - no matter how rotten we are, no matter how depraved, wicked and sinful as individuals we can be, our LORD's Grace can still find us and save us from the Wrath to Come.

Perhaps that's the whole purpose of choosing he Jews. To show that NOBODY is beyond redemption and that it doesn't depend on us, our status, our faithfulness, our works of righteousness, our NOTHING....

It all depends on God and His love, and His faithfulness and His grace.

1 Corinthians 1:18-31 For the word of the cross is folly to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.

For it is written,

"I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and the discernment of the discerning I will thwart."

Where is the one who is wise? Where is the scribe? Where is the debater of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? For since, in the wisdom of God, the world did not know God through wisdom, it pleased God through the folly of what we preach to save those who believe.

For Jews demand signs and Greeks seek wisdom, but we preach Christ crucified, a stumbling block to Jews and folly to Gentiles, but to those who are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. For the foolishness of God is wiser than men, and the weakness of God is stronger than men.

For consider your calling, brothers: not many of you were wise according to worldly standards, not many were powerful, not many were of noble birth.

But God chose what is foolish in the world to shame the wise; God chose what is weak in the world to shame the strong; God chose what is low and despised in the world, even things that are not, to bring to nothing things that are, so that no human being might boast in the presence of God.

And because of him you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, righteousness and sanctification and redemption, so that, as it is written, "Let the one who boasts, boast in the Lord."

1,846 posted on 01/29/2011 10:47:06 AM PST by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: The Theophilus; MarkBsnr; 1000 silverlings; Alex Murphy; bkaycee; blue-duncan; boatbums; caww; ...
2 Timothy 2:8-13 Remember Jesus Christ, risen from the dead, the offspring of David, as preached in my gospel, for which I am suffering, bound with chains as a criminal. But the word of God is not bound! Therefore I endure everything for the sake of the elect, that they also may obtain the salvation that is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory. The saying is trustworthy, for:

If we have died with him, we will also live with him; if we endure, we will also reign with him; if we deny him, he also will deny us; if we are faithless, he remains faithful—

for he cannot deny himself.

1,847 posted on 01/29/2011 10:50:35 AM PST by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: MarkBsnr
And I would state that Japanese culture under the samurai would not have marched up to the mountain of God and started building a golden calf idol without at least trying to find out why Moses was delayed. Or even today.

How do you know that? IF they spend 400 years under Egyptian rule w/idol worship - since that's all they knew - they would do the same.

It's like anyone coming out of Catholicism - we all had to kill those sacred cows that we were taught- brainwashed with - it was all we knew.

Then instructed that we needed the Holy Spirit to understand God's Supernatural Word since it is Spiritually discerned. Something Catholics still DO NOT understand and their posts show that. God tells us about HIS WORD "The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned". Catholics ignore it because 'their man made teachings' - their 'EGYPT' - tell them differently.

Talk about being stiff necked!
1,848 posted on 01/29/2011 10:51:33 AM PST by presently no screen name
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To: The Theophilus

Amen


1,849 posted on 01/29/2011 10:52:30 AM PST by RnMomof7
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To: Dr. Eckleburg
JUST PERFECT, Dr E!!!!

I'm sure you will be trashed for exposing their 'own idol' as they live in their own Egypt, their 'own bondage'.
1,850 posted on 01/29/2011 11:03:38 AM PST by presently no screen name
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To: metmom
Almost all of us who have left the Catholic church after being born again, have done so with our eyes wide open after having discovered the TRUTH in God’s word, the Truth that is contradicted by Catholic doctrine constantly. ....The Catholic church failed us and there’s no point in staying on that Titanic.

Exactly!! There was no reason to leave - I was content UNTIL I learned The Truth.

John 8:31 "Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in MY WORD,, [then] are ye my disciples indeed;

John 8:32 "Then you will know THE TRUTH, and THE TRUTH will set you free."

I left man made teachings for HIS WORD, THE TRUTH!! Thank YOU, JESUS!!
1,851 posted on 01/29/2011 11:16:26 AM PST by presently no screen name
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To: HarleyD; MarkBsnr; kosta50; Alamo-Girl; metmom; xzins; Cronos; caww; Mad Dawg; wmfights; Quix; ...
[kosta50] [c]omparing God to a pink unicorn would not be a surprise to me. — HarleyD

Well he didn't do that, exactly, IIRC. Not quite. He merely indicated (in a 'way past post) that belief in God is indistinguishable from belief in pink unicorns. In short, I gather belief itself is what's foolish in kosta's eyes.

And yet he seems to believe in himself and his methods. :^)

So go figure!!! LOL!!!

FWIW, I just figure our friend kosta is the classic snarling "dog in the manger": He can't eat the fodder; but he's determined to prevent all the other animals from eating it — even though their nourishment depends on it.

Thanks so much for writing, HarleyD!

1,852 posted on 01/29/2011 11:27:02 AM PST by betty boop (Seek truth and beauty together; you will never find them apart. — F. M. Cornford)
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To: wmfights
Thank you for sharing your insights, dear brother in Christ!
1,853 posted on 01/29/2011 11:31:05 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: metmom
Thank you for that beautiful Scripture, dear sister in Christ, and for sharing your insights!
1,854 posted on 01/29/2011 11:32:21 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: MarkBsnr
Yet again, you make my point for me. The NT ladles meanings upon OT verse (or in many cases misquotes or invents it) which were never understood by the Jews.

And the Reformers might likewise claim that the Catholic Church never understood certain Scriptures, e.g. prophecy, Eucharist, ministry of the Holy Spirit.

Why do you think that the nation of Israel to this day does not accept the divinity or the story of Jesus?

Tradition.

1,855 posted on 01/29/2011 11:37:46 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: metmom
LOLOL! So are you, dear sister in Christ!
1,856 posted on 01/29/2011 11:41:16 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: HarleyD
It certainly has had that effect. Thank you for sharing your insights, dear brother in Christ!
1,857 posted on 01/29/2011 11:44:51 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: Dr. Eckleburg
It is gold. It is a statue. If people worship it, it's "gonna leave a mark."
1,858 posted on 01/29/2011 11:52:58 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: Dr. Eckleburg
Thank you so much for that additional, older example, dear sister in Christ!
1,859 posted on 01/29/2011 11:55:57 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: betty boop
The dog in the manger is an excellent metaphor, dearest sister in Christ, thank you for sharing your insights!
1,860 posted on 01/29/2011 11:58:16 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
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