Replies

Obviously, if Latter-day Saints claim to be the true church restored by Jesus Christ (which I believe), then we would consider that there is error in all other faiths. [Normandy]

C'mon Normandy...I could say 'error' exists in all religions and in all denominations (including Christian ones)...and who's going to disagree with that?

Some Christians will take others to task at times for beliefs on the sacraments...
...Or for some Calvinistic interpretations...
...Or that you must speak in tongues to demonstrate that you're really born-again...

And others won't focus as much on issues of orthodoxy
--Sometimes it's issues of orthopraxy
--Like Pat Robertson declaring some disaster is definitively linked to God's judgment [well, it could be, but who can say for sure?]...
...Or it might be wondering about Oral Roberts and his vision of a 900-foot Jesus...

My point is that Mormon leaders have gone well beyond stating Christian churches are full of "errors." All you have to do is to reread those quotes in the article or first seven posts to see them referencing us as...
...The church of the devil...
...Inspired by the devil...
...Holding portion with the devil...
...Part of the Anti-christ...
...100% abominable creeds...
...100% corrupt...
...'Babylon'...
...Whores, whoremasters, harlots, lewd daughters...
...Ignorant...
...Filled with heretic pagan beliefs...
...Full of darkness...
...100% apostate...
...Damned and damnable...
...Beyond salvation...
...Divine authority-free...
...etc.

...'Errorists' is simply WAY too mild of a term to describe the "beyond the pale" references your general authorities have given us...and framing it that way, in fact, makes you party to their efforts -- and guilty of downplaying what they've said.

I’m not going to spend my time criticizing another person’s religious beliefs because they differ from mine. [Normandy]

Now why did I just say you are "party to their efforts?"

#1 Even if you don't personally critique Christians and their beliefs, the fact that you apparently don't hold any of your past or present leaders publicly accountable for these kinds of words makes you and similar Lds more a part of the problem than any solution forged by the type of dialogue you mention.

IOW in certain circumstances, silence is an error of omission.

#2 Normandy, your tithe is going to pay for many of these quotes to be recycled...

Example A:
Lds "apostle" Bruce R. McConkie: "The church of the devil is the world; it is all the carnality and evil to which fallen man is heir; it is every unholy and wicked practice; it is every false religion, every supposed system of salvation which does not actually save and exalt man in the highest heaven of the celestial world. It is every church except the true church, whether parading under a Christian or a pagan banner." (Doctrinal New Testament Commentary, 3:551)

As I wrote in post #2, Is that still taught by the official Mormon church in its official curricula in official Institute classes to college students?

A. (Yes): The church of JC LDS: Seminaries and Institutes of Religion: Book of Mormon Student Manual: Chapter 4: 1Nephi 11–14 : Notes and Commentary

Examples B-->D: In post #5, I mention an Lds church pamphlet and Ensign article. In post #1, I mention another Ensign article. These are official Lds pubs.

Example E: The Lds church has put out a series of what each of their "prophets" said and wrote about which recycles these kinds of quotes.

Example F: Here's an official Lds Church Manual (Book of Mormon Gospel Doctrine Teacher's Manual from 1999, pp. 17-18): "Elder Bruce R. McConkie said, 'The titles church of the devil and great and abominable church are used to identify ALL churches or organizations of whatever name or nature -- whether political, philosophical, educational, economic, social, fraternal, civic or religious--which are designed to take men on a course that leads them away from God and his laws and thus from salvation in the kingdom of God' (Mormon Doctrine, 2nd e. [1966] 137-138."

So here we have an LDS church manual, in which YOU, NORMANDY, are helping to pay for...
...This manual quotes McConkie's MORMON DOCTRINE book excerpts about us being "the church of the devil." But you apparently don't want to assume responsibility for how your wallet is being used, eh?

Some Mormons apparently think we as Christians aren't able to put two & two together. For example, this church manual quote could certainly be broad enough to, say, focus on Jehovah's Witnesses & Christian Science & the like. But we can pinpoint who the Mormon church is discussing.

When Bruce McConkie writes, "The gods of Christendom, for instance, are gods who were created by men in the creeds of an apostate people. There is little profit or peace in serving them, and certainly there is no salvation available through them" (A New Witness for the Articles of Faith, p.545), then we're not left to wonder who this official Mormon church manual is discussing when it talks about "churches or organizations" which "take men on a course that leads them away from God and his laws and thus from salvation in the kingdom of God".

We have much in common with people of all faiths, and I see no reason not to be friends with other Christians and non-Christians because of differences in religious belief and practice. If someone wants to discuss my faith and talk about our differences like adults, fine. I am more than happy to do that... [Normandy]

Well, I agree here..."Revers-ally" [if that's a word], I say and personally do the same thing as an Evangelical toward Mormons, and have more opportunities for that offline.

THE FIRST BOOK OF NEPHI
HIS REIGN AND MINISTRY

CHAPTER 14

An angel tells Nephi of the blessings and cursings to fall upon the Gentiles—There are only two churches: the Church of the Lamb of God and the church of the devil—The saints of God in all nations are persecuted by the great and abominable church—The apostle John shall write concerning the end of the world. Between 600 and 592 B.C.

1 And it shall come to pass, that if the ^aGentiles shall hearken unto the Lamb of God in that day that he shall manifest himself unto them in word, and also in ^bpower, in very deed, unto the ^ctaking away of their ^dstumbling blocks—

2 And harden not their hearts against the Lamb of God, they shall be numbered among the seed of thy father; yea, they shall be ^anumbered among the house of Israel; and they shall be a ^bblessed people upon the ^cpromised land forever; they shall be no more brought down into captivity; and the house of Israel shall no more be confounded.

3 And that great ^apit, which hath been digged for them by that great and abominable church, which was founded by the devil and his children, that he might lead away the souls of men down to hell—yea, that great pit which hath been digged for the destruction of men shall be filled by those who digged it, unto their utter destruction, saith the Lamb of God; not the destruction of the soul, save it be the casting of it into that ^bhell which hath no end.

4 For behold, this is according to the ^acaptivity of the devil, and also according to the justice of God, upon all those who will work wickedness and abomination before him.

5 And it came to pass that the angel spake unto me, Nephi, saying: Thou hast beheld that if the Gentiles repent it shall be ^awell with them; and thou also knowest concerning the covenants of the Lord unto the house of Israel; and thou also hast heard that whoso ^brepenteth not must perish.

6 Therefore, ^awo be unto the Gentiles if it so be that they harden their hearts against the Lamb of God.

7 For the time cometh, saith the Lamb of God, that I will work a great and a ^amarvelous work among the children of men; a ^bwork which shall be everlasting, either on the one hand or on the other—either to the convincing of them unto ^cpeace and ^dlife eternal, or unto the deliverance of them to the hardness of their hearts and the blindness of their minds unto their being brought down into captivity, and also into destruction, both temporally and spiritually, according to the ^ecaptivity of the devil, of which I have spoken.

8 And it came to pass that when the angel had spoken these words, he said unto me: Rememberest thou the ^acovenants of the Father unto the house of Israel? I said unto him, Yea.

9 And it came to pass that he said unto me: Look, and behold that great and abominable church, which is the mother of abominations, whose founder is the ^adevil.

10 And he said unto me: Behold there are save ^atwo churches only; the one is the church of the Lamb of God, and the ^bother is the church of the ^cdevil; wherefore, ^dwhoso belongeth not to the church of the Lamb of God belongeth to that great church, which is the mother of abominations; and she is the ^ewhore of all the earth.

11 And it came to pass that I looked and beheld the whore of all the earth, and she sat upon many ^awaters; and she had dominion over ^ball the earth, among all nations, kindreds, tongues, and people.

12 And it came to pass that I beheld the church of the Lamb of God, and its numbers were ^afew, because of the wickedness and abominations of the whore who sat upon many waters; nevertheless, I beheld that the church of the Lamb, who were the saints of God, were also upon ^ball the face of the earth; and their dominions upon the face of the earth were small, because of the wickedness of the great whore whom I saw.

13 And it came to pass that I beheld that the great mother of abominations did gather together multitudes upon the face of all the earth, among all the nations of the Gentiles, to ^afight against the Lamb of God.

14 And it came to pass that I, Nephi, beheld the power of the Lamb of God, that it descended upon the saints of the church of the Lamb, and upon the covenant people of the Lord, who were scattered upon all the face of the earth; and they were ^aarmed with ^brighteousness and with the ^cpower of God in great glory.

15 And it came to pass that I beheld that the wrath of God was ^apoured out upon that great and abominable church, insomuch that there were wars and rumors of wars among all the ^bnations and kindreds of the earth.

16 And as there began to be ^awars and rumors of wars among all the nations which belonged to the mother of abominations, the angel spake unto me, saying: Behold, the wrath of God is upon the mother of harlots; and behold, thou seest all these things—

17 And when the ^aday cometh that the ^bwrath of God is poured out upon 1 nephi 14 of all the earth, whose founder is the devil, then, at that day, the ^cwork of the Father shall commence, in preparing the way for the fulfilling of his ^dcovenants, which he hath made to his people who are of the house of Israel.

18 And it came to pass that the angel spake unto me, saying: Look!

19 And I looked and beheld a man, and he was dressed in a white robe.

20 And the angel said unto me: Behold ^aone of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.

21 Behold, he shall ^asee and ^bwrite the ^cremainder of these things; yea, and also many things which have been.

22 And he shall also write concerning the end of the world.

23 Wherefore, the things which he shall write are just and true; and behold they are written in the ^abook which thou beheld proceeding out of the mouth of the Jew; and at the time they proceeded out of the mouth of the Jew, or, at the time the book proceeded out of the mouth of the Jew, the things which were written were plain and pure, and most ^bprecious and easy to the understanding of all men.

24 And behold, the things which this ^aapostle of the Lamb shall write are many things which thou hast seen; and behold, the remainder shalt thou see.

25 But the things which thou shalt see hereafter thou shalt not write; for the Lord God hath ordained the apostle of the Lamb of God that he should ^awrite them.

26 And also others who have been, to them hath he shown all things, and they have ^awritten them; and they are ^bsealed up to come forth in their purity, according to the truth which is in the Lamb, in the own due time of the Lord, unto the house of Israel.

27 And I, Nephi, heard and bear record, that the name of the apostle of the Lamb was ^aJohn, according to the word of the angel.

28 And behold, I, Nephi, am forbidden that I should write the remainder of the things which I saw and heard; wherefore the things which I have written sufficeth me; and I have written but a small part of the things which I saw.

29 And I bear record that I saw the things which my ^afather saw, and the angel of the Lord did make them known unto me.

30 And now I make an end of speaking concerning the things which I saw while I was ^acarried away in the spirit; and if all the things which I saw are not written, the things which I have written are ^btrue. And thus it is. Amen.