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[Stourme rambles]

Your interpretation denies men their agency. And if your interpretation were correct then God bends to the will of man

[Cronos explains]Non-sequitor -- you're saying the interpretation denies free will as well as promotes men's free will?

Daniel's point is very clear. you dont' read the entire passage of Daniel which reads as

39And after thee shall arise another kingdom inferior to thee, and another third kingdom of brass, which shall bear rule over all the earth.

40And the fourth kingdom shall be strong as iron: forasmuch as iron breaketh in pieces and subdueth all things: and as iron that breaketh all these, shall it break in pieces and bruise.

41And whereas thou sawest the feet and toes, part of potters' clay, and part of iron, the kingdom shall be divided; but there shall be in it of the strength of the iron, forasmuch as thou sawest the iron mixed with miry clay.

42And as the toes of the feet were part of iron, and part of clay, so the kingdom shall be partly strong, and partly broken.

43And whereas thou sawest iron mixed with miry clay, they shall mingle themselves with the seed of men: but they shall not cleave one to another, even as iron is not mixed with clay.

44And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever.

--> do you understand that Daniel writing in 600 BC is talkign about Nebuchadnezzars neo-Babylonian Empire as the first kingdom, then the second being the Achemenid Persian Empire, then the third (brass) being the Greek Empires, then the fourth (iron), being the Roman Empire. Then the fourth, the Roman was divided into East and West, yet the Eastern part survived until the 15th century.

Daniel describes a time of the coming of Christ, the a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever. --> you also just contradicted yourself because THIS kingdom, the Christian Church was never destroyed as stated in Daniel, yet you and the Mormons make up the false statements about Great apostasy, contradicting yourself.

[Stourme struggles with English]

Daniel's point is that all the great kingdoms will pass away and then the Lord would set up a kingdom that wouldn't be destroyed

[Cronos explains]

Of course, He set up a kingdom that wouldn't be destroyed --> YET, YOU KEEP INSISTING THAT HIS KINGDOM WAS DESTROYED -- YOU KEEP CONTRADICTING YOURSELF. He set up a kingdom -- His Church, the One Holy Apostolic Catholic Church that has never been destroyed.

[Stourme makes another contradiction]

If the scriptures are true, and I believe they are

[Cronos explains]

Yet, you and the other Moromns keep saying that the scripture (the Bible is part of the great Apostasy -- well, which is it?

Along with all the murder and mayhem this "whore of all the earth" or church will do
On Sept. 11, 1857, in a meadow in southwestern Utah, a militia of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, or Mormons, attacked a wagon train of Arkansas families bound for California. After a five-day siege, the militia persuaded the families to surrender under a flag of truce and a pledge of safe passage. Then, in the worst butchery of white pioneers by other white pioneers in the entire colonization of America, approximately 140 men, women and children were slaughtered. Only 17 children under the age of 8 - the age of innocence in the Mormon faith - were spared.

After the massacre, the church first claimed that local Paiute Indians were responsible, but as evidence of Mormon involvement mounted, it placed the sole blame for the killings on John D. Lee, a militia member and a Mormon zealot who was also the adopted son of the prophet Brigham Young. After nearly two decades, as part of a deal for statehood, Lee was executed by a firing squad in 1877. The church has been reluctant to assume responsibility - labelling Lee a renegade - but several historians, including some who are Mormon, believe that church leaders, though never prosecuted, ordered the massacre.
Pretty obvious,eh?

the great Whore of Babylon is this

5. John describes this whore as the mother of harlots. (little whores). The whore, the original cult formed by J Smith gave birth to a number of harlots

5. John describes the devil as the giving power this "whore". Therefore I can conclude that this "whore", the LDS cult teaches the devils doctrine.

6. 1 Tim 3:12 reads
12A deacon must be the husband of but one wife and must manage his children and his household well.
And yet Mormon cult leaders have quite a few wifes, eh?

" it will also do bad things with conspiring kings of the earth. " --> yup, the Mormons above -- greedy cult.

Please show me where Christ taught His Apostles to throw away scripture...

Oh -- and do you accept the Bible in it's entirety? Yet, you just said it was the start of the great Apostasy!!

God has nothing to do with the running of the Mormon Cult. So says the prophets, so says history.

In contrast, History proves that God is guiding Christ's One Holy Apostolic Catholic Church -- this is the instrument how the conversion of EUrope, Africa, Asia and the Americas came to Christ

[Cronos trolls]

YET, YOU KEEP INSISTING THAT HIS KINGDOM WAS DESTROYED

but several historians, including some who are Mormon, believe that church leaders, though never prosecuted, ordered the massacre.

[Stourme boggles]

You're comparing ants and elephants. I've seen people with blinders on...but boy.

1. The Church had no involvement with mountain meadows. This equates to wishful thinking on the part of Mormon haters.

2. There is no contradiction in my words.

a. Christ started a Church among the people. The Church is made for man, not man for the Church.
b. When there is no prophet to speak directly with God to keep the doctrine correct, people start making up their own.
c. The people killed the apostles and the prophets and made up their own doctrines. Thus apostasy.
d. After several generations after Christ left and the apostles were killed, the people, by their own actions, fell into apostasy.
e. Christ's original Church effectively died. Not because Christ abandoned it, but because it was rejected by the people. Which God gives man the right to do. It's called free agency.

3. Signs of the apostasy are clear. I've shown many.

4. God, for this very purpose, raised up wise and courageous men to aid in the restoring of his Church.

a. From Christopher Columbus to the founding fathers of the United States.
b. A Constitution that guarantees by law, religious freedom.
c. Now God can call a prophet again.
d. The prophet then corrected the doctrines created by man.

5. And this is what Daniel saw. That in this day, God's kingdom would never be destroyed because the people of today will never entirely turn away from it.

6. Do I believe the entire Bible is the Word of God? Truthfully.. no. Solomon Song is not scripture..at all. Neither is Proverbs. Proverbs was written by a king, not a prophet.

a. If there was no apostasy then we wouldn't have a "Bible". We'd have all the scriptures written by the prophets that were ever passed down from the time of Adam.
b. The early Catholic church had no authority to decide what was scripture and what wasn't...but they did it anyway. They threw away what they didn't like. The Great Apostasy in action.

7. Revelation 11 speaks of two prophets that will be killed in the streets of Jerusalem just before the second coming of Christ.

a. Rev 11 affirms that there are real prophets on the earth today that have the same power that Moses had.
b. There are no prophets in the Catholic church.
c. God's house is not divided.
d. So the Catholic church can not be God's true Church.
e. If (A = B) & (B=C) then (A=C)
f. If any of this is in doubt, see item a and b.