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To: RnMomof7; annalex; Dr. Eckleburg

After much reflection of the Scripture in question, I believe it is of no consequence to Catholic apologetics to state that you are correct when you say Matt 16:18 can be interpreted as a promise of victory over evil. Indeed as you correctly point out, a “gate” cannot be an offensive weapon.

However this does not negate the Catholic claim that this Scripture indicates the Church will remain visibly intact throughout history, until His return. This is due to the simply logical consequence of a victorious Church: it cannot be both victorious over evil, yet presumably at the same time, fall into apostasy.


155 posted on 09/21/2010 11:01:20 AM PDT by FourtySeven (47)
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To: FourtySeven; RnMomof7; metmom; 1000 silverlings; Quix
it (Christ's church) cannot be both victorious over evil, yet presumably at the same time, fall into apostasy.

True enough. And that is why Rome reveals itself not to be the church in question.

No visible church on earth is perfect. Christ's invisible church, the one built with the spiritual stones of each and every believer, will endure and prevail.

"Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? " -- 1 Corinthians 3:16

Churches are commanded by God to preach the Gospel, to administer Christ's two sacraments, to encourage fellowship among the congregants and to safe-guard sound doctrine.

Because Rome rejects the Scriptures as its only rule of faith and practice; because Rome follows "another Christ;" and because Rome seeks salvation from a "co-redeemer" Rome stands not in the light of Christ's truth but in the shadows of foolish and crippling error.

"Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

Wherefore also it is contained in the scripture, Behold, I lay in Sion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: and he that believeth on him shall not be confounded." -- 1 Peter 2:5-6


162 posted on 09/21/2010 11:24:07 AM PDT by Dr. Eckleburg (("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: FourtySeven
However this does not negate the Catholic claim that this Scripture indicates the Church will remain visibly intact throughout history, until His return. This is due to the simply logical consequence of a victorious Church: it cannot be both victorious over evil, yet presumably at the same time, fall into apostasy.

I do believe the THE church of Jesus Christ will remain visible and intact... The word of God indicates He always has a remnant of His Own

The question again is what is the church?

The Roman Catholic church has no leg to stand on when claiming to be the New Testament church .

Scripture indicates that the church is composed of believers.. One is not saved by the church , the church is composed of the saved.

242 posted on 09/21/2010 1:49:42 PM PDT by RnMomof7 (Jhn 8:43 Why do ye not understand my speech? [even] because ye cannot hear my word.)
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To: FourtySeven; RnMomof7; Dr. Eckleburg

No one said “gates of hell” refers to any offensive weapon. Satan of course, is all offense, so that distinction is immaterial. What Matthew 16:18 says is that sin, for whioch Hell is punishment — including the sin of Protestant deceptions — will not prevail against the Catholic Church. History proves Christ correct even to those ignorant of the Gospel, today.


313 posted on 09/22/2010 5:27:11 AM PDT by annalex
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