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To: dsc; circlecity
1. I just went on line to look for “pope hat.” The very few references I found were pejorative, which makes it odd that a Catholic would be using it.

The question of "foam miters" came up in the context of papal visits/souvenirs a couple of months ago. What caught my attention was this description of "official merchandise" selection in a 1995 article, which called out foam rubber miters specifically:

...Committees at both archdioceses had to approve each papal product. "People were trying to get us interested in papal coffee mugs and foam rubber miters," said the Rev. Leslie Ivers, director of the New York Archdiocese's office for the papal visit. "These are things that we don't think are in good taste."
"Why would(n't) a Catholic want to own a foam miter?" The archdiocese responds by saying "we don't think they're in good taste". And a t-shirt is? Why not a miter? What about a miter with the Pope's picture on it? And what's wrong with calling it a "Pope hat" anyway? Some Catholics use slang to refer to the Pope as "papa" - why not slang to refer to his traditional headgear?

I think it's safe to assume that the availability of foam miters at any papal appearance is purely "unofficial" at best. I think it's also safe to assume that vendors anticipate a demand for them, since in 1995 they tried to get the archdiocese's blessing (pun intended) to sell them. Would an archdiocese sue competing vendors for selling "unauthorized" souvenirs from the Pope's visit?

I get the impression that the more traditionalist Catholics among you would consider buying or wearing a foam miter to be a disrespectful act. It certainly diverts revenue away from archdiocesan efforts to pay for the Pope's visit via "official" souvenirs. Would you consider that disrespectful as well?

2. Couldn’t find anything on that picture of Asians in YMCA t-shirts and foam miters.

Having read that vendors in fact sold them at the 1993 appearance, and wanting to sell them in 1995, I went looking for pictures. I found the picture in question on the blog of Saint Mary Magdalen Catholic parish, Brighton, UK. The same entry carried another picture:

3. Everything you think you know about Catholicism is wrong.

I know that a foam miter on a parishioner is less tacky than a rainbow umbrella hat on a priest.

28 posted on 09/17/2010 4:28:51 PM PDT by Alex Murphy ("Posting news feeds, making eyes bleed, he's hated on seven continents")
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To: Alex Murphy; circlecity
The overarching theme of the Pope's visit to Britain is the right of religion to be seen and heard in the public square in the face of an increasing secular hostility. This may be the last opportunity for this pitch to be made in the UK before the noose finally tightens around those who hold to traditional Christian beliefs on issues such as the sinfulness of homosexual acts, the nonexistence of such a thing as homosexual "marriage" and the sinfulness of abortion, etc. I would have thought that this was an issue of importance to all Christians, not just Catholics.

In Britain, we're almost at the point and maybe have already arrived, where punitive measures will be taken against persons and organizations who espouse these beliefs.

In all honesty, the Pope is the best person to make this pitch. Who else has the gravitas?

Given this, doesn't it seem a little ridiculous to be getting bent out of shape over the issue of souvenirs? Is your concern for the question of religious freedom less than your concern that the Pope might actually have some success in his campaign and that the Catholic Church in general and the Pope in particular might somehow be benefited or enhanced in public esteem as a result?

Britain is on the edge of the precipice. Can't you drop the animus for just this once?

33 posted on 09/17/2010 7:01:03 PM PDT by marshmallow ("A country which kills its own children has no future" -Mother Teresa of Calcutta)
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To: Alex Murphy
"People were trying to get us interested in papal coffee mugs and foam rubber miters," said the Rev. Leslie Ivers, director of the New York Archdiocese's office for the papal visit. "These are things that we don't think are in good taste."

I can understand their problem with 'Pope hats', but I wouldn't mind having a 'Pope' coffee mug.

49 posted on 09/19/2010 7:25:11 PM PDT by SuziQ
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To: Alex Murphy

“People were trying to get us interested in papal coffee mugs and foam rubber miters,” said the Rev. Leslie Ivers, director of the New York Archdiocese’s office for the papal visit. “These are things that we don’t think are in good taste.”

Thanks for blowing your own case out of the water.

According to your article, “people” were trying to get the archdiocese to sell foam miters. We don’t know who these people were, or whether they were even Catholic. What is clear is that they had no connection with the Holy Father, and that the representative of the archdiocese said the foam miters were not in good taste. How you can wring papal hypocrisy out of that is a question for the ages.

“Why would(n’t) a Catholic want to own a foam miter?” The archdiocese responds by saying “we don’t think they’re in good taste.”

What’s your problem with that? Any properly catechized Catholic is going to agree that they are in bad taste. Again, no indication of papal hypocrisy.

“And a t-shirt is?”

That depends upon what is written on the t-shirt, and where it is worn. T-shirts per se are not intrinsically offensive, as is a foam miter. Again, no indication of papal hypocrisy.

“Why not a miter? What about a miter with the Pope’s picture on it?”

I don’t believe that you are incapable of seeing the problem with that.

“And what’s wrong with calling it a “Pope hat” anyway? Some Catholics use slang to refer to the Pope as “papa” - why not slang to refer to his traditional headgear?”

Slang? My word, you’re not even trying to get things right, are you? “Papa” is Latin for “father.” If anything, it is more formal than “pope.”

“I think it’s safe to assume that the availability of foam miters at any papal appearance is purely “unofficial” at best.”

And yet you allege that their existence demonstrates the hypocrisy of the Holy Father when he speaks of the culture of celebrity. Where’s the consistency in that?

“I think it’s also safe to assume that vendors anticipate a demand for them, since in 1995 they tried to get the archdiocese’s blessing (pun intended) to sell them.”

They tried and failed to get the archdiocese’s permission. Further, anticipating a demand is not the same thing as finding a demand, and neither does selling nonsense to young skulls full of mush demonstrate papal approval. No indication of papal hypocrisy anywhere, yet.

“Would an archdiocese sue competing vendors for selling “unauthorized” souvenirs from the Pope’s visit?”

I doubt it, but some people would say that unauthorized souvenirs show that the pope is hypocritical.

“I get the impression that the more traditionalist Catholics among you would consider buying or wearing a foam miter to be a disrespectful act.”

Only the most poorly catechized Catholics would not.

“It certainly diverts revenue away from archdiocesan efforts to pay for the Pope’s visit via “official” souvenirs. Would you consider that disrespectful as well?”

So, the “hypocrisy” attack having failed, you’re switching to some variant of the “greed” attack?

“I know that a foam miter on a parishioner is less tacky than a rainbow umbrella hat on a priest.”

1. When one is that deep into bad taste, I don’t think minor differences in degree of offensiveness are meaningful. And are we to think that, although the rest of the world agrees that beauty is in the eye of the beholder, your tastes are a matter of knowledge, which is to say a matter of fact?

2. Neither a foam miter nor a rainbow-umbrella hat fall under the definition of “Catholicism.” They are outward manifestations of Satan’s attacks on the Church, nothing more.


50 posted on 09/19/2010 7:43:50 PM PDT by dsc (Any attempt to move a government to the left is a crime against humanity.)
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