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To: D-fendr

“Why isn’t the first statement negated by the second?”

If some one tells you something that you want to hear and they know you will agree with it and you agree with it do you do so of your own free will?

If some one gives you something that you want and they know you will accept it and you do accept it do you do so of your own free will?


15,618 posted on 11/06/2010 5:49:07 PM PDT by blue-duncan
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To: blue-duncan; D-fendr; Kolokotronis; kosta50; MarkBsnr
If some one gives you something that you want and they know you will accept it and you do accept it do you do so of your own free will

Who was that "some one" who wanted hitler to kill millions of Jews BD? "Some one" was giving hitler what he wanted according to what you seem to be putting forth.So ,who is the one giving hitler what he wants if he has no free will?

Are you suggesting it was God who wanted this since he fore knew hitler wanted to kill millions of Jews,thus hitler was actually following the will of God?

I am thoroughly convinced that people who deny free will are hiding some hideous evil act they have done and pawning it off on God's ordination.

I'm tired,Good Night!

15,619 posted on 11/06/2010 6:34:29 PM PDT by stfassisi ((The greatest gift God gives us is that of overcoming self"-St Francis Assisi)))
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To: blue-duncan; stfassisi; kosta50
If some one gives you something that you want and they know you will accept it and you do accept it do you do so of your own free will?

And they wanted it because...?

You have to walk it all the way back, determined each step of the way.

Determinism is the view that the future is completely determined by the past. Each action therefore conradicts the reality of free will choice - the past is unchangeable - choice is predetermined. Only the illusion of choice is possible. Determinism is the antithesis of free will choice.

In your formulation, once again, man, as self-conscious being capable of free choice, is removed from the equation.

The theological conclusions lead us away from Christ's teaching, His commandments and exhortations - and away from each human's personal responsibility.

15,621 posted on 11/06/2010 7:26:04 PM PDT by D-fendr (Deus non alligatur sacramentis sed<i>However GodÂ’s predetermination and providence is nos alligamur)
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To: blue-duncan; stfassisi; kosta50

I should have added the obvious.

Christian belief holds that we can be transformed. Our new life in Christ not determined by our previous habits and history. Our past does NOT completely determine our future - we have a choice.


15,624 posted on 11/06/2010 7:46:45 PM PDT by D-fendr (Deus non alligatur sacramentis sed.)
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