Posted on 08/27/2010 11:45:13 AM PDT by Hank Kerchief
Are you suggesting that the 911 thugs said to themselves, “Let’s do something wrong.”
I think they thought they were doing good.
I thought that Catholic doctrine never changes? I quoted to you from a Catholic Catechism...no commitment to a loving God, but a clear statement
Q. 631. Is Baptism necessary to salvation?
A. Baptism is necessary to salvation, because without it we cannot enter into the kingdom of heaven.
The Baltimore Catchecism [1891]
So if Catholic doctrine is never changing this says CLEARLY that an unbaptized baby can not enter heaven, ir there is no "limbo" there is only one other place..hell
So...what do YOU say we do to be saved?
Calvinist say NOTHING. Either one is elect, and will be irresistibly saved, or not, in which case you will never repent.
“Unconditional Election
God’s choice of certain individuals unto salvation before the foundation of the world rested solely in His own sovereign will. His choice of particular sinners was not based on any foreseen response or obedience on their part, such as faith, repentance, etc. On the contrary, God gives faith and repentance to each individual whom He selected. These acts are the result, not the cause of God’s choice. Election therefore was not determined by or conditioned upon any virtuous quality or act foreseen in man. Those whom God sovereignly elected He brings through the power of the Spirit to a willing acceptance of Christ. Thus God’s choice of the sinner, not the sinner’s choice of Christ, is the ultimate cause of salvation.”
http://www.monergism.com/directory/link_category/Calvinism/The-Five-Points-of-Calvinism/
That paragraph can be summed up as “By Grace, Thru Election”. God chooses to save you, or not, and “His choice of particular sinners was not based on any foreseen response or obedience on their part, such as faith, repentance, etc.”
Actually all men are commanded to repent and believe.. the question is can they?
the devils also believe. Are they then saved?
But where did your faith come from?
I was in the military. If I gave an order that could not be obeyed, the fault was with me, not my men.
And if I commanded them “Clean the Latrine”, it didn’t mean I was about to clean it for them...
Where do my evil desires come from? Me, or does God impose them on me?
I vote Door #1...
The devils are past the time where believing could save them, as are men once they die. But there will come a day where EVERY knee shall bow...willing or not.
Faith is a gift from God.
That doesn’t answer the question. How is your belief any different than theirs?
The Catholic church for the most part is composed of societal Catholics.. where the faith is a family tradition.. those tend to be non attenders or "Sunday Catholics". On any given Sunday the church will be full of cafeteria catholics that pick and choose what they want to believe and are about as subject to Rome as you and I are..
Most Catholics are their own pope ...
So it breaks me up when they try to tear apart Evangelicals for having some doctrinal differences. We might bicker about the order of salvation , but we hold 80 or 90 % of our doctrine in common.. our differences have nothing to do with our faith in Christ alone, the center of our faith.
“Faith is a gift from God.”
Except no scripture says that, and I’m a Sola Scriptura kind of guy...your sacred tradition means nothing to me. Dang Baptist!
Their beliefs are compelled. Mine are not. In spite of what Calvin taught.
so you are boasting?
Nope. I don’t think I’m some special person chosen from before time to be God’s favorite. I’m just a sinner who heard the Gospel, and asked God to forgive me and change me. And after 40 years, I still need a LOT of changing.
Now you would not be calling me a liar would you?
631. Is Baptism necessary to salvation?
A. Baptism is necessary to salvation, because without it we cannot enter into the kingdom of heaven.
So where does an unbaptized baby go fassisi? Limbo?..Oh wait the catholic church no longer teaches the non doctrinal limbo... so the other choice is??????
Ya'll need to make up your minds. Are Catholics mindless robots incapable of independent thought who only parrot the Vatican line or are we each our own Pope, each determining our own personal interpretation of Scripture and Tradition? Your "Taste Great / Less Filling" type of debate is confusing.
Something about this verse just struck me. Paul was speaking to the Thessalonians, right? He was speaking to the entire assembly there in Thessalonica and, like many churches even today, there are tares among the wheat, so could it be possible that some of those that Paul was addressing were not saved?
I am in agreement with what Mr. Rogers says regarding the foreknowledge of God not being the same as him making us as his robots incapable of actions of our own will. God foreordained that all who come to Christ in faith will be conformed into the image of Christ. He has preordained that belief in the truth results in sanctification and justification to eternal life and because he is not bound by time, he has seen it all before it even came to be - he knows the end from the beginning and nothing is hidden from him. Maybe the problem is in trying to "over-think" an idea instead of accepting that not all things are able to be understood with the finite, mortal mind.
Jesus told his disciple, who wanted him to explain it all, that he had told them of earthly things and they didn't believe. How would they believe if he told them of heavenly things?
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